What a great way to restore one's reputation in the Porsche community - demand an apology for something the individual apparently did not write and commit a potentially criminal act in the process of bashing a customer who's only expectation was the timely performance of a state mandated action.

Can anyone imagine how different this all would be had DC Automotive's response been something along the lines of:

"Gee, I'm really sorry that we allowed the paper work for your title to "fall through the crack". I'm the owner/president/manager of the company so this problem stops at my desk. I'll have the title to you in 14 days. We appreciate you sending us the certified letter to remind us of our obligation to you our valued customer. We look forward to working with you to supply your future Porsche parts."

That's the company I'd like to do business with on a regular basis.

And yeah, it's a Google world and I wonder how many customers using Google on a search for DC Automotive would find the above response refreshing.

Nah, its obvious that a lot can get lost in the translation when it comes this form of communication, esp where i am concerned; i do better with face to face and or telephone. Regardless of what you know or think you know about the situation between us and Andrew, you dont and wont know it all. Suffice it to say, that Andrew was very patient up until very recently; while we attempted different options. We finally just bought a bond to cover the vehicle. It is ironic that the biggest complaint about the transaction is the paperwork and not the vehicle...
I am confident it will all work out to mutual satisfaction soon; I also know we wont offer a vehicle for sale without a Valid title in hand.
(As opposed to the bill of sale and etc that are perfectly legal in other states)
I will hold any further comments until the title is delivered to andrew.

A lessen learned.

Even dealers don’t trust each other to get the required paperwork. This is the reason for the instrument known as a “Sight Draft.” It is a bank check that will only clear if the listed paperwork is enclosed. Very useful.
Check here.

Best,
Grady

sorry, at this point i wouldnt buy a cheeseburger from DCautomotive. no sense sitting around for months wondering if i could eat it.

Wow. This is an unbeleivable response from a business in public view of many potential customers. No where that I have read has Andy made any negative comments, been libelous, or made any threats. In fact, I'm amazed at his restraint (untypical for many in the faceless world of the BBS) in mentioning only the facts in his original post. What exactly is it that he needs to appologize for or retract? :confused:

I have now affiliation with either party but...

Do some of you nit wits realize some vehicles dont have titles? and that various states didnt title vehicles until various years in the mid 70s?

If you buy my 1969 911 from me, there will be no title... and aint gonna get one no matter how much you complain...

Its out of my hands that NY didnt title vehcles in 1969 nor did they title vehicles in until 1975 (I could be wrong about the year exactly)


Apparently Connecticut didnt title the vehicle in question

Im sure there were ways around this debacle that didnt involve venting it here

peace out

what a joke....sorry to hear about all the trouble flatsixcrazy...

And the guy from dcAutomotive asked for an apologyhttp://www.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/wat5.gif
He should be perfusely apologizing to you....

Thanks for your invaluable insight...hope the other 2208 posts weren't this usesless...

Who is to blame?
 

Answer: Very easily! Someone (Andrew) finds the exact car/project that they are looking for, and they minimize/justify the HUGE RED FLAG (title issue) by the great price they have negotiated. AN oral agreement to secure title was then probably made in haste to expedite the sale.... Notice that Andrew has NO problem with the car, just the paperwork. Does DC automotive have responsibility to live up to it's end of the deal? Of course... And shame on them for dragging their feet on a small potato deal :-(!!! Should it have taken this long to resolve the title issue? Of course not! But let's not forget, Andrew had no problem entering into this deal and writing a check and taking posession of the car with probably only a handshake for resolving the title issue.... Once again, it takes a sqeaky wheel to get the grease. But let's not all point the finger at the big bad car dealer! Has anyone ever heard the term "Buyer Beware?" Purchasing a vehicle on Ebay with out of state title issues? Does Andrew not bear any responsibility in this transaction? It's taking too long, and now he wants to blame everyone but himself for his poor business decisions... If it were me, I think I just might have made a visit to my local DMV to present the very hypothetical issue to the person who could rightfully answer the question prior to making ANY bid on the car.

Any questionable purchase like this should always be made through an independent escrow service. Very simple - No title/No cash. I've purchased and sold airplanes and boats with the assistance of an escrow service for a completely "Hassle Free" transaction!

Can we all just get along?

It's nice to see that Mr. Z and Andrew are hopefully resolving their issues on paperwork!

However, I'm both troubled and amazed how everyone points the blame to DC Automotive.... I''ve never personally dealt with DC Automotive, however, I've seen their ads in Excellence Magazine for many years. I would have to almost assume that by their sheer length of existence in this type of fickle business for several years, they have some level of business sense. As I'm sure Andrew read the very same Ebay ad that I did, the issue of title was made very clear. If he just couldn't pass up this opportunity, then he bears responsibility in accepting the fact that resolving the title issue was not a "sure thing" as far as how long it "could take."



Porsche 1971 911
NO SUNROOF
Rolling Chassis, never crashed
(has valid paperwork, CT does not issue titles for vehicles
built prior to 1980)
As a licensed dismantler i have never had a state refuse
the state of CT paperwork, but check with your DMV, if enough time
is provided i can produce an NC title.
(We are a licensed independant dealer in NC)

When everyone is done puffing their chest's and threatening to line their attorney's pocket with money, perhaps we could all start actually accepting responsibility for our own action's! What a concept!... Unless of course, you have a kid sister who is a second year law student... Or worse, you have a family full of S*%T, oops.. I meant lawyers :-)!

Cheers Everyone!

Patrick

Re: Who is to blame?
 

The quality of a commercial is inversely proportional to the quality of the product.

If someone has a great product, it still has to be marketed. What good is it if no one knows about it? The seller's goal is to get people to try it. After that, he doesn't have to advertise it except occasionally, to catch a new crop of consumers. A good restaurant just has to get you there once. If the food and service are really good, you'll be back.

For other vendors, it's name recognition: when you think of moving, think of Wreckit Movers. They want to make sure that they get a chance to bid for your business.

Most highly advertised products are either no damn good, flagrantly overpriced or are no better than the competition. Now these products need the best that Madison Avenue has to offer. They need marketing surveys, psychologists, gimmicks, great actors, novelty and cuteness.

One TV commercial that really frosts me is for an insecticide that is supposed to be so harmless that they advertised it with a man biting into an apple that he claims has been sprayed with it. No one really believes that that apple was sprayed --the man doesn't look like a complete idiot-- but it sure is an attention getter. It does sell the product. That's pretty good for something that really doesn't do a very good job of killing bugs. If you want to kill bugs effectively, chances are that you have to use something that will make a human good and sick, or dead. One of the best insecticides was chlorodane. The big drawback was that it killed a lot more than termites and ants. If you are into organic gardening, you don't want to use anything stronger than a water jet and Ivory soap which, as everyone knows, is 99 and 44/100ths percent pure. I've tried to forget that, but I can't. It's virtually impossible to forget anything trivial. I've been trying to forget The Alamo for years. What I forget is where I put my glasses or the car keys, or what I came to the store to buy. At any rate, soap water does a good job of washing the bugs, and clean bugs spend more time admiring themselves in the mirror and less time sucking the life out of your plants. You knew that I was talking about aphids, didn't you? Don't bother telling me about lady bugs; I've tried them. In order to keep a good crop of lady bugs going, you have to have a good crop of aphids etc. To refer to the people in advertising agencies as "whores" is to insult the practitioners of the oldest profession. When I meet a person in advertising, my first question is "where did you go wrong?"

The purpose of a lot of advertising is to get people to pay money for things that they don't need, don't want, and which, if they had them, would either do them no good at all or harm them.

When the California public voted to have a state lottery, no one told us that it would be extensively advertised on radio and television. The cost of that advertising is, of course, deducted from the amount that goes to the winners and to education.

Advertising people win no matter what happens. It makes no difference if the product is any good, if it actually kills like booze or cigarettes can, or if it is worthless, as is the lottery to the many millions of loosers who buy tickets. The advertising people get their big paychecks regardless! Who said "crime doesn't pay"?

Sure Eli... why dont you take your head of your and wake up?

Some vehicles dont have titles... no matter how much ppl complain about it..

you wont get a title for a vehicle that is registered in NY, or CT that was made prior to 1973... again I dont know the exact year that titles were issued

You will not get a title to a 1969 Camaro, or a 1955 Jaguar, or a 1959 Porsche 356or a mid 1920s Packard.. its not going to happen

so Elihttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1119227784.gif

Hmmmm...

Eli, No offense, but you went on a little different tangent than I expected... Is it your conclusion then that no Automotive dealership that advertises it's product could ever be trusted? This would ever so strongly point the blame finger totally on Mr. Andrew! Buyer Beware!!

Re: Who is to blame?
 

yeah right.............

ever heard of MOTORMEISTER????

Did you even bother to read the ebay add? It said "if enough time is provided i can produce an NC title". Andy only wants what he was promised and needs to title the car in VA, and four weeks+ should be enough time. Eli was right - your replies ARE worthless. Sorry I don't have a taseful f-you smiley for you, but I'm not in jr. high school any more.

Dave,
Hmmmm... Buyer Beware?

Did you get burned by MotorMeister Too?

If it Sounds too good to be true, it usually is? You often get what you pay for? The sweetness of a low quote is often outlasted by the bitterness of poor craftsmanship.... Was I the only guy that stayed awake in Business 101? A motor rebuild that every other shop quotes $10k for, and MotorMeister quotes $5-6K? And you didn't check around for other happy customer referrals??

If MotorMeister was the one and only shop a person went to, maybe....

Don't get me wrong here, as I'm not defending MotorMeister.... But as far as a "total engine rebuild" for a 911 motor for $5k? You get what you pay for!

Let us not forget "Earl Scheib" and "Maaco" Paint Centers. They advertise extensively, and do a tremendous volume of work. But how does one really expect to get lasting complete paint job for $250?? There will always be a demand for less expensive work, lower quality! The problem usually arises when someone misrepresents the lower cost work as being top quality! Miscommunication is where the problem lies...

Re: Re: Who is to blame?
 

you beat me to that one :D

as i've gathered from the comments from the 2 involved here, it seems that andrew was told he would have the title....then he was told again....and again.
simply sounds like someone dropped the ball and they need to correct the situation, andy did what i do when i'm in a dilemma....he asks for help, not appologies.

WTF? Four months and still no title? What's a 'reasonable' wait then 8 months, a year, 4 years? Meanwhile you can't register or drive the car right?

Enjoying that new car?!

I'd say you've been more than reasonable. Is dcAutomotive still holding the title work hostage until you appologize? Craziest thing I've ever heard. Get a lawyer, should be a slam dunk, just show him this Pelican thread!

Keith

Sure Patrick it's Andy's fault.

A reputable dealer offers a car and a written guarantee to supply a NC title and Andy's a complete idiot to accept the contract for sale? Andy makes numerous requests for the promised paperwork, keep in mind the car is virtually worthless with out clear title, over a four-month period receiving little more than continued empty promises and you suggest Andy's at fault? This goes on for over four months but you suggest he did not wait long enough for DC to supply the paperwork but now the seller can supply clear title in two weeks? How long is long enough?

I still wonder how you are, “ …both troubled and amazed how everyone points the blame to DC Automotive.” What degree of culpability, other than as you suggest his “making a bad business deal” does Andy have in this scenario? Caveat Emptor does hold in most all private party deals on fit for purpose, condition, etc but this is a specific performance issue in a very simple contract for sale. Seller promised to deliver car and NC title in a timely manner, which we now know to be two weeks for the title, and has yet to perform this specific portion of the contract.

Explain to me again how the buyer is at fault?

I’m confused by your logic.

Not that I'm defending Tim, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to after witnessing the cool F.U. thingy! How do you do that Tim? Very cool!!

Anyway, without knowing the true nature of the ENTIRE AGREEMENT, we are all merely speculating on this entire debate! Opinions are like a##holes. We all have one! My $.02 - After about 3 months, Andrew's wife probably threatened to divorce him if he didn't resolve this debacle soon, and his kid sister who might be a second year law student, is polluting and pumping up his poor ego with poor legal advice, after it was deflated by his own inept business decision....:D

The way you guys are defending dcAutomotive made me take a second look at the auction listing as well as all the posts on this topic...
In summary,
Andy won an auction, which clearly outlined the fact that the seller WILL supply NC title.
Four weeks later Andy, decided to ask his peers on a privately ran porsche board, if in fact the behavoir exhibited by dcAutomotive is appropriate.
In response Andy got hosed, dcAutomotive demanded an appology WTF:eek: :confused:, and all of us got a lesson on states which don't require a title for an older car. http://www.pelicanparts.com/support/smileys/shake.gif

PS. Oh...back at ya Timmy...http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1119227784.gif