I've been seeing my physician because of lack of sleep. Been getting only 5 - 6 hours a night and I'm finding it hard to stay awake behind the wheel. I understand your reasons for the need for more waking time so I hope you can manage it. I can't with only 5 hrs of snooze.

I find that if I take a fair amount (3-4 tabs) of Ginko that I wake up earlier and feel more rested. Might try it...

BTW, I need 6 hours and an afternoon nap really helps if I am pushing hard.

Joe A

With all due respect to you 4-digit posters, if I got less than 6 hours of sleep, OT would be the first thing to go.;)

Never!

Man, as the only sub 3-digit poster I offer my humble suggestion: plan for strategic all nighters (or close anyway). I can't deal with consistent low sleep but can deal with end in sight type manipulation. My career is such that the week is usually killed and sometimes the weekend, sooo, I'll plan for late nights here and there for specific projects. For instance, plan for a productive but not cerebral intensive Friday, come home Thursday and go at it. Thats how I reworked my Belgium A5, painted my helmet, installed a roll bar, blah blah . . .

If you can figure out a better solution, I'm all ears. Your solution, however, may not involve either relaxing the schedule or adding more crew to the submarine. ;)

Shaun, it sounds like you've got all the elements you need for a high-stress low-sleep life. Coincidentally, you've also got the elements for dying young, and having ulcers, but that's beside the point, right? ;)

Try taking 400 mcg of chromium as an addition to your vitamin intake at @11:00 am each day. Chromium helps you body (naturally) process / use glucose more efficiently. This is about 4 times the required amount per day.

I've found that I have more energy (w/o feeling hyper) and it lasts until bedtime. Then I can easily go into a very restfull sleep for a shorter period of time, and wake up refreshed. Side benefit is that your hunger between meals subsides as well!!

I agree with Nostatic. You're playing with a seriously vital bodily function. Please reconsider. Your friends prefer you to be alive and healthy.

I've spent the last 20 years of my life in varying degrees of sleep deprivation. Sometimes I work 48 hours straight skipping an entire night of sleep. The next night I might get 4 hours or I might hibernate for 10 hours straight. Sleep deprivation screws with your health in many ways. The general aging process accelerates. I'm going through my middle years at warp speed. Things are starting to hurt that shouldn't be bothering me for another 10 or 15 years. I'm growing old fast.

My advice? Get your sleep.

I think the Targa has more of an effect on my mortality than anything, really a double-edged sword. It keeps me young, yet may kill me, umm, while staying young. :D Today going up to NH was a good example.

I'm very fortunate to have some great genes, either that or my Intelligent Designer got a good night's sleep before creating the mold, so I'm not worried about age, just about taking advantage of everything around me as much as possible.

thanks everyone for your thoughts, looks like I'll be just trying to wake up a little earlier. David's got the best advice though... get of OT. :D SmileWavy

When I'm working, I get approx 4 hours a sleep a night, and it can take its toll. If you are going to reduce your hours, then be consistant, and your body will respond better. I don't really recommend 5 hours though. 6-7 should be about perfect.

Cool thread. And I thought I was deprived by getting 7-9 hours of sleep each night. My advice is to get to bed a decent but constant time (for me it is ~10:30; having to wake up at 7:00) and sleep in on the weekends. I sometimes can't imagine how Lubemaster here gets his sleep when it's 11:00 PM Pacific time and he's still posting on the forums. :eek:. ;)

One question though, why do I sometimes feel more sluggish if I get more sleep? Shouldn't it be the other way around?

For me, too much sleep is as bad as too little. Feel groggy all day.

Your body naturally regulates how much sleep you need. Every body is different and trying to circumnavigate the natural rhythm for long periods will take it's toll. I am envious of the people who don't need much sleep and feel energetic all day, but they are few and far between.

There is only one way to survive cutting down on the number of hours you sleep.. its to increase your basic metabolic rate... tough to do a 38 as naturally you are slowing down at the same time...

If your BMR is high.. as in yuor ealry mid twenties then you recover more rapidly during your sleep cycle.. add to that good physical fitness and hey presto a 4-6 hour sleep quotient if fine..

You can increase your BMR by making usre yuor diet is very healthy...includes reducing or cutting out caffine and alcohol....and getting some serious aerobi exercise every day... like 90 minutes or so of which at least half should be within your peak heart rate range...

In time, possibly a couple of months you will noitice that you can maintain your activity level on a reduce number of hours of sleep...

However you need to balance that out against the following:-

1) Time taken for exercise....can be great fun if its social.. such as a running group or skating club.
2) Mental acutity during difficult tasks....The mind needs REM time...it works in apporx 90min cycles and you needed three per sleep cycle usually to get a 'recharge'...add in some non REM time and pretty soon you are looking at a irreductible minimum.. for you..
3) The schedule needed to achive this is gonig to severely limit your flexibility....how deos that affect your life...
4) See what Moses said..

Its better to be ready, both mentally and physically to do regualr 'pushes' to get projects moving or completed than try to run a little bit faster for longer..

Like the lumber jack in the Canadian Woodcutting cometition... he you takes time to sharpen the axe will beat those who slog thro it non stop....

Change your diet. Cut back / drop most grains, and harder to digest foods (you don't know they're hard to digest because your body is working to break them down; but without them, less energy expended).

Look into Ayurvedic info for body type and modify your diet around those reccomendations. Cut out caffeine and white sugar.

Figure out what and when your natural sleep cycles are; including an afternoon nap if that works for your sleep cycle (ie 20 min - 1 hour+, means a lot less tiredness at night). Even though you have to be at your job you can do it.

Eat your biggest meal midday. Excercize in the early morning. Go to sleep a lot earlier, but get up a lot earlier too. No alcohol.

Check out books by John Doullaird (not spelled correctly) a sports physican who understands and uses ayurvedic system in an understandable way / palatable way to westerners.

Don't make less sleep a goal, and if you make some or all of the above changes, you will be more rested, more efficient, and pretty soon, much less sleep needed. That was one of the byproducts for me when i made some gradual but major lifestyle changes, suddenly had a lot more waking hours, and also am much more alert.

YMMV

Listen to "Doc Moses"! I've had chronic insomnia for more than 4 years and it's gotten to the point where I have to take Lunesta to get any sleep at all. Don't mess with your body's sleep cycle and be thankful you're able to sleep!

Even worse is messing with your sleep schedule while you're moving around the country. Try getting sub 6 while changing time zones and bed times almost every day. I spent 5 weeks in a van tour managing a band and the sleep situation was not kind to me. I am still a bit disoriented and it's a month after we got back. I literally didn't leave the house and slept and vegged for a straight week.

If you want some good advice, work smarter, not longer.
After a certain point, you're just not effective any more.

JCM = 3 jobs, 90hr work weeks, 4 years, no sleep = hella tired.

JCM

P.S. I owe you a boutique list. I'm an *******.

>>That's just great! We've got nuclear submarines running around being operated by a bunch of over-caffeinated sleep-deprived young men.<<

Yep, and about half the airplanes in the sky are being piloted by folks with less then 3 hours of sleep on a daily basis. But the FAA says its legal if you get more 'scheduled' rest the second night.

Or, just slit your wrists...