The Sad State of U.S. Healthcare

[legion]

With headlines like this, it's a shame we haven't converted to a nationalized system already...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/oldest_boomers

[Tobra]

That is socialized, not nationalized.

I am confident that if healthcare is "nationalized" it will be every bit as successful as Amtrak.

[Jims5543]

My mom who is in her late 50's and almost 60 works at JC Penney for one reason only. So her and my dad can have health insurance. My dad is self employed and cannot get coverage on his own so my mon gets it through her work.

That blows.

[turbo6bar]

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
My dad is self employed and cannot get coverage on his own so my mon gets it through her work.

How about a Health Savings Account or insurance through a self-employed association?

[competentone]

Originally posted by legion
With headlines like this, it's a shame we haven't converted to a nationalized system already...

From the article:
A new government study shows deaths from heart disease, cancer and stroke continue to drop, but it also shows that half of Americans ages 55 to 64 — including the oldest of the baby boomers — have high blood pressure, and two in five are obese.

You're saying we should have socialized medicine so the fat and lazy people can get free health care?

If they want to avoid health problems, maybe they should change their poor eating and exercising habits. I know, I know, I'm suggesting that people should take responsibility for their health; I guess I must be a horrible person to suggest such a thing!

[Nathans_Dad]

Socialized health care doesn't work. Ask the people in Canada who come across the border for care because they have to wait too long in Canada. Ask the people in the military healthcare system who have to wait 3-4 weeks for an MRI. Ask the people who have to wait 6 MONTHS for a heart bypass surgery in the Harris County Health System (Houston, Tx).

Oh, and I saw nothing in that article to suggest that we needed some sort of nationalized healthcare. Sounds like the baby boomers are overweight and have increased incidences of the diseases that go along with obesity...

[Jims5543]

Originally posted by turbo6bar
How about a Health Savings Account or insurance through a self-employed association?

He has health issues. No insurance company will cover him in an individual policy. He can only gain coverage through a group policy. I see no way for her to quit as long as my dad is alive.

I own my own business and pay close to $800 a month for coverage. (MSA) No maternity coverage. Since my wife had a C-section insurance companies are sure to put a rider in that excludes all c-sections even if it is an emergancy.

I paid out of pocket close to $14000 for my 2 year olds birth.

Something needs to change.

[Moses]

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
Something needs to change.

Big, big changes are coming.

I predict the first major event will be when some ambitious politician will "solve" the problem of the uninsured by offering universal access to Medicare. To defray the wild costs, the government will squeeze the pharmaceutical companies and will borrow a page from the HMO playbook...they will restrict access.

Eventually we will have a two tier system. Medicare for the majority and private insurance for those who can afford it. A lot like Englands present system.

[turbo6bar]

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
Something needs to change.

Based on your experience, I'd say that's an understatement. I had no idea it was that bad.
jurgen

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by Moses
Eventually we will have a two tier system. Medicare for the majority and private insurance for those who can afford it. A lot like Englands present system.

Thats almost exactly what Germany has. If you make over a certain limit you have no choice and are forced into "private" insurance, where the costs are a bit higher. Good news was that when the doctors found out that I was in the private group they jumped on any issue I had. Found out that the insurance for the masses took forever to pay while the private paid within a month and at a slightly higher rate.

I could care less what happens but feel that we need health insurance for everyone in the country.

JoeA

[legion]

BTW...my initial comment was sarcastic...

[bivenator]

One of the reasons healthcare is so expensive is the amount of diagnostic tests now available. CT/MRI/PET/US/Nuclear are all available. Dr must order many of the tests in order to protect themselves from lawsuits that could arise if all available resources are not used to save the patient. How many needless exams are done that have no effect on the ultimate outcome? Having worked in hospitals for many years I can say that we are all gonna die. If we go to a nationalized HC system then the government will put a stop to the excessive exams. This sounds fine until it is you or somebody you love that could benefit.

[gaijindabe]

"When the 1930s group was tested around 1990, 42 percent had high blood pressure. That compares with 50 percent for the 1940s group. The older group's rate of obesity was 31 percent back then, compared with 39 percent for the 1940s babies now. Because of the advent of cholesterol-lowering drugs, the prevalence of high cholesterol actually went down, from 35 percent for the 1930s group to 23 percent among the 1940s babies."

The drug makers are the bad guys - but with all the other numbers going the wrong way, they are the ones raising life expectancy..

[Moses]

Originally posted by gaijindabe
"When the 1930s group was tested around 1990, 42 percent had high blood pressure. That compares with 50 percent for the 1940s group. The older group's rate of obesity was 31 percent back then, compared with 39 percent for the 1940s babies now. Because of the advent of cholesterol-lowering drugs, the prevalence of high cholesterol actually went down, from 35 percent for the 1930s group to 23 percent among the 1940s babies."

The drug makers are the bad guys - but with all the other numbers going the wrong way, they are the ones raising life expectancy..

The "definition" of obesity changed in the 80's and they just recently changed the cutoff for high blood pressure. Not sure if this affects the study.

[gaijindabe]

Originally posted by gaijindabe
"When the 1930s group was tested around 1990.....

.....1940s babies now....

The testing started in the 1990s.

Lets face it. With folks cutting back in smoking and drinking, and the advent of all these drugs, we are going to be stuck with the baby boomers for a long time.. Soylent Green might be the only answer.

[RallyJon]

[Rick Lee]

Some of the reasons healthcare is so expensive is malpractice liabilty suits and waste/fraud/abuse, which is particularly exacerbated by a gubmint-run system already.

I don't know why some of these horror stories don't get more coverage, but when the NYT uncovers a doctor billing Medicare for 900 (yes, nine hundred) procedures in one day, seems to me that's probably just scratching the surface. The feds need to crucify such crooks. And why is someone entitled to become a millionaire because of medical errors? What lawsuit ever produced a life-saving drug or prevented the next error?

I went to see Bill Frist speak on Avian Flu at the Press Club yesterday and it was pretty scary stuff. The most outrageous factoid was why we have so few domestic vaccine producers - yes, the lawyers. He talked about creating an immunity (legal, that is) clause for emergency vaccine production. You can bet that will be a huge legislative fight.

[Tobra]

Originally posted by legion
BTW...my initial comment was sarcastic...

I sort of figured, based on other things you have said.

Originally posted by Rick Lee
Some of the reasons healthcare is so expensive is malpractice liabilty suits and waste/fraud/abuse, which is particularly exacerbated by a gubmint-run system already.

I can tell you a few things from the doctor side of it. You hear about the gross abuse and fraud, what you don't hear is how the fee schedule goes down, or how the insureres will refuse or delay payment. Every day, at least one situation comes up where I order a test that I am 99-100% sure will give no useful info, but have to order it, medico-legally.

Ask yourself this question, would you want to be the first uninfected person to try out the HIV vaccine?

[Rick Lee]

Of course, I wouldn't want to be that person. That's why they have clinical trials. And it's also part of why it costs so much to bring a new drug to market.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by bivenator
One of the reasons healthcare is so expensive is the amount of diagnostic tests now available. CT/MRI/PET/US/Nuclear are all available. Dr must order many of the tests in order to protect themselves from lawsuits that could arise if all available resources are not used to save the patient. How many needless exams are done that have no effect on the ultimate outcome? Having worked in hospitals for many years I can say that we are all gonna die. If we go to a nationalized HC system then the government will put a stop to the excessive exams. This sounds fine until it is you or somebody you love that could benefit.

One of the major reasons why health care is so expensive is because of the bloodsucking lawyers with their multiple lawsuits that is dragging this country down. Then factor in the drug companies who can make a pill for 5c and sell it for $5.00 to cover their legal fees. Next we have the hospital corporations who pay $1.00 for a pillow and sell it to the patient for $44.00, to pay for the uninsured patients.

Its not just one thing but one thing is correct, it must be stopped and fast.

JoeA

It goes on and on and its not just one thing.