Question For The Uber Geeks

[Wrecked944]

I've been programming computers for almost 2/3 of my life. And I have always made it a point to delve deeply into the theory of software design and try to write code that Dr von Neumann, himself, would be proud of. Merely functional code has never been sufficient for me. I have always wanted my code to be elegant, painfully easy to understand and, if possible, beautiful.

To that end, I've always sought out examples of top shelf code from other people so I could learn from it. In whatever language I've used, I tried to keep copies of perfectly written code snippets on hand to be reviewed, refined, and re-used again and again.

So lately I have been coding in C#. Nice language. Not exactly the most challenging thing in the world. But that's okay. It works. And I am really trying to dig deeply into the structure of C#'s oop world to try to make this language sing. Unfortunately, the coding examples I see on the internet were mostly written by dyslexic monkeys on acid. And the "Standard and Practices" websites I have found mostly focus on variable naming conventions and indenting. And that stuff only scratches the surface of what makes an elegant program.

So can anyone point me towards a resource that really digs deeply into the theory of oop design in general and C# in particular? I mean, any moron can make this stuff work...and clearly many do. But where do the real hardcore techie geeks hang out and get down with oop algorithms and esoteric theory?

[widebody911]

Can't really help you. Honestly, I write fairly simple code, just complicated enough to get the job done - no obfuscation contests for me. Why? Because some time in the future, I might have to go back in and fix/enhance it.

I guess that makes me a moron

For the record, you'll probably find the uber techie geeks hanging out (living) in their parents' basement, when they're not working on thir 944 or 951.

[Wrecked944]

Originally posted by widebody911
I guess that makes me a moron

After seeing your c/f work, I can say honestly that "I served with morons, I knew morons, morons have been friends of mine. And you, sir, are no moron."

[dhoward]

Originally posted by JanusCole
Snipped....
And you, sir, are no moron."

Let's not get carried away here...

[Z-man]

Originally posted by JanusCole
Unfortunately, the coding examples I see on the internet were mostly written by dyslexic monkeys on acid.

I see you've met my IT department's system programmers...

I do a little amount of coding, but it's in REXX on Z/OS (Mainframe). Mostly storage related stuff and manipulation of tables to create source code.

My own personal guidelines for coding (as learned in my impressionable college years) have been:
1. Documentation is key. Especially with languages that are 'self-documenting'
2. A procedure should have only one function.
3. The main program (whatever it's called in your language) should only contain priming of variables and calls to procedures.
4. Variables should have logical names. (skippy=12 is NOT a logical name, but Gigabytes_used=12 IS.)
5. When debugging, don't expect different results if you haven't changed anything.

-Z-man.

[jriera]

With all due respects do not use C#, Dr. Vonn Neumann and good code in the same sentence

Anything after C does not go with my theory of good code or good use of machine resources, I am at heart an assembler kind of guy, that may explain why I quit developing many years ago.

Go no further and check Dr. Donald Knuth Art of Computer Programming series

[masraum]

I'm a techie, but of another sort. All of this talk of programming made my eye's glaze and all I heard was:

waaah, waaah wah waaahahha waa wah waaaahh.

Takes a special breed. Like being a cop or in the military, I'm glad someone wants to do it so I don't have to.

[BlueSkyJaunte]

Knuth.

Also "Patterns in Programming" or something along those lines.

[david.avery]

Well, there are developers and there are programmers.

Most of my clients couldn't care less that I made one line of code prettier than another. They want it to work, be supportable, with as quick a time to market as possible. That being said, I wrote several MFC C++ apps, and they don't hold a candle to the rapidity with which I can throw a .net c#/vb.net app together. I recently wrote a web service that talks to handheld pc's for data collection in an hour! That's the whole SOAP communication layer for the project. That's pretty good. Now I know, will my c# compile into the most efficient clr (common runtime language) over something hand-written in c++? Probably not. Cost wise, time to market-wise, .net CLR is awesome.

[Tishabet]

I too have had a hard time finding really elegant C# code.
I have always been amazed by some of the code that PERL programmers can pump out...that stuff can be elegant beyond belief.

[legion]

Good design is key. Good code should just be following good design. Good design should contain coding standards, but also standards for the use of objects, attributes, instances, whether to make methods class methods or instance methods.

IMO, once you apply good design principals to a business problem, the design of the application should be pretty apparent.

[legion]

Originally posted by widebody911
For the record, you'll probably find the uber techie geeks hanging out (living) in their parents' basement, when they're not working on thir 944 or 951.

So...did you spanked at the track by a 951 or on the job by a younger guy who happens to drive a 951? Or both?

And we're only living in our parents basements in markets like CA because we're accumulating cash to swoop in and buy houses after the big RE bust....

[Wrecked944]

Originally posted by jriera
Go no further and check Dr. Donald Knuth Art of Computer Programming series

Well, I saw the Knuth stuff back when I was in college. And IIRC, it does not include OOP and/or relational databases. It is, sad to say, a bit out of date.

I've always believed that OOP was nothing new...only a regular old sequential statement paradigm wrapped in a set of fancy function calls. But that does not absolve us of the responsibility to take full advantage of the OOP mindset. Simply throwing code into class definitions isn't enough (at least not for me).

[bryanthompson]

Originally posted by widebody911
For the record, you'll probably find the uber techie geeks hanging out (living) in their parents' basement, when they're not working on thir 944 or 951.

Who exactly might you be talking about?

I always try to make my code as perfect as possible. My boss teaches Java and Perl, and has written several books on the subject, so I everything I write always goes through the mental, 'what will Marc think when he sees this,' filter.

I know nothing about C# and have avoided it as much as possible. I'm mostly doing Ruby these days. I've been unable to find decent resources that even explain some best practices Ruby, and forget trying to find useful documentation on DRB (at least, until our book comes out).

[bryanthompson]

A ColdFusion friend just send this my way... might be able to find something, but I haven't used it before. http://krugle.com/

[Icemaster]

Originally posted by Tshabet
...some of the code that PERL programmers can pump out...that stuff can be elegant beyond belief.

I wholeheartedly agree. PERL and C/F honestly is some of the cleanest I've seen. The dyslexic monekys on acid are destined to be server admins one day...the true art of code is lost.