Plumbers?? How to drain hot water heating system?

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:01 PM

Any help would be appreciated. I'm gutting a small house with baseboard heating on two floors, appx 1200 sq feet of floor space total. I'm going to take out all the baseboard pipes, so I need to drain the heating system first.

I found the drain valve at the very bottom of the oil-fired furnace, which is in the basement. There's pressure behind it, if I open the valve the water comes out pretty good. So I put the hose on it.

I need to take the hose up out of the basement because there is nothing to drain to in the basement. The water does not flow when the hose is above grade, I guess there is not enought presure.

Is there some kind of siphon device that plumbers use?

Also, I assume I need to introduce some air into the system to avoid a vaccum, how would I do that? My idea was an ax to one of the pipes on the second floor, but there's probably a more technical method

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:11 PM

I see you're from the south

Oil-fired furnace heats the water. Water heats the house.

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:13 PM

Did I just step on a joke?

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:18 PM

They'll tell me why hot water needs to be heated?

Joeaksa · 07-02-2006, 06:18 PM

Is there any place in the area that is below the level of the furnace in the basement? Front or back of the house by the drive lower? If so then you can put a long hose on it, then siphon the water out by creating a suction on it.

We did this overseas with the same style heating systems in Germany. Sometimes took a real long hose but worked.

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:23 PM

Joe! thanks for the suggestion, unfortunately no lower ground within a reasonable distance.

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 06:37 PM

That's an idea! I could probably even get away with a smaller 10 gallon bucket, just adjust the flow so it doesn't overwhelm the pump.

Now if I can find that old sump pump I haven't seen in a long, long time ....

Joeaksa · 07-02-2006, 06:45 PM

Pump it into several 5 gallon gas cans, then carry it upstairs and dump it. Then open the cans up and let them air out before using again.

Joeaksa · 07-02-2006, 06:49 PM

Procon,

Thats way overkill. I drained my 15,000 gallon pool with one of those a month ago. Took 3 hours so its pumping a lot of water.

If its anything like we had in Europe, the system Rodeo has does not hold that awful much water I believe.

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 07:08 PM

Found it! Thanks Procon and Joe, I'm going to get the biggest bucket I have and stick the sump pump in it. I'll just cut one of the lines on the second floor after it drains a bit to avoid a vacuum.

Here's the reason for the gut, btw. Thought I'd get some exercise, get away from my desk, and save some $$ by doing the demo myself.

I've practically filled the THIRD 30 yard dumpster, and I'll need a fourth to finish. Who knew? But the place will be like new construction for the plumber, electrician and carpenters.

fastpat · 07-02-2006, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rodeo
I see you're from the south

Oil-fired furnace heats the water. Water heats the house.

That's one of the most efficient heating systems there is, the only way to improve it is to upgrade the burner, and switch to gas at the same time. You can't find a better system, and it's almost dust free, no filters to change, and on and on. I installed one in a house I owned, vintage 1917, worked great and almost totally silent.

Rodeo · 07-02-2006, 07:58 PM

Pat, I agree, forced hot water is a great heating system. We have it in our house too, used to be fired by this massive asbestos-covered thing in the basement that looked like it belonged in an old ocean liner. Upgraded to one of these babies a few years ago.

I'll keep the hot water system in the carriage house, but I really dislike the baseboard radiators. Going to try to find some cool old cast iron radiators instead.

911pcars · 07-02-2006, 09:35 PM

If you haven't figured out the venting yet, open a faucet.

Sherwood

Joeaksa · 07-03-2006, 04:17 AM

What's nice is to lay piping inside the floor (usually concrete) and run the hot water there. Not sure how you would do it on a multi-story house.

When you wake up and put your feet on the floor, its is nice and toasty and stays that way all day long during winter.

Rodeo · 07-03-2006, 04:32 AM

Sherwood, the heating is a closed system. I don't think opening a faucet would let air into the heating pipes.

Joe, my brother has radiant heat. It's freaking great! You do it on a multi-level by opening up the ceilings and running the flexible water pipes along the floor joists of the room above. Too expensive for this project though.

Radiant is actually the most efficient, and you can run the heat lower because when your feet are warm, it "tricks" your body into thinking its warmer than it actually is.

Joeaksa · 07-03-2006, 04:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rodeo
Sherwood, the heating is a closed system. I don't think opening a faucet would let air into the heating pipes.

Joe, my brother has radiant heat. It's freaking great! You do it on a multi-level by opening up the ceilings and running the flexible water pipes along the floor joists of the room above. Too expensive for this project though.

Radiant is actually the most efficient, and you can run the heat lower because when your feet are warm, it "tricks" your body into thinking its warmer than it actually is.

The other reason why its so effecient is that heat raises, so putting the heating elements on the bottom is best, while the cooling vents for A/C in the "ideal" house should be coming somewhere out of the top of the room, and letting the air descent and cool as it does.

Someday when I build my "last" house will make it this way.

911pcars · 07-03-2006, 09:00 AM

"I don't think opening a faucet would let air into the heating pipes."

Errr. Excuse me for not paying attention. Doesn't a closed heating system still have a connection at the radiation source (if exposed) or are they all soldered?

If you plan on removing the baseboard elements anyway, wouldn't a well-placed slice through the highest-elevated baseboard heater pipe accomplish the desired venting?

Sherwood