LS6... 350 or 346

[cashflyer]

Well, it seems that I have committed some sort of crime against nature and humanity on another BBS that I frequent.

Over the weekend, I and some other grid workers saw an LS6 powered Ultima. None of us are Chevy "enthusiests", but we got entangled in an argument amongst ourselves about the LS6.

Rob said the LS6 was an updated 350.
I said the LS6 was a higher displacement 350.

Turns out that I was thinking about the LS7. That's fine, I was wrong and can live with that.

Now, on the other BBS, somebody else has jumped all in my sh_t about using the term "350" instead of referring to the proper displacement of 346cid.

I maintain that since neither Rob nor I are enthusiests of the Chevy, that it doesn't matter because we both understood what we were talking about.

My question.... are Chevy people really this effing anal retentive about their engines?

To me, that would be like marching around at the track and insisting that everyone acknowledge my engine size as exactly 2995cc. (it's propbably not, but that's just as an example)

[masraum]

nah, I think most people consider the newer engines 350's despite the fact that they haven't been 350 for a while. That's actually pretty common among car manufacturers.

[scottmandue]

If I were ever buy to a classic 60's car (not that I could afford one)it would be a Chevy, my dad was a GM guy and bought Oldsmobiles and Chevy's so that is what I learned to drive and work on growing up.

I didn't know about the 346 thing.

[KevinP73]

Being that you and Rob knew what you were talking about even if you were not 100% accurate in your reference of 350, it really shouldn't matter what anyone else has to say.
The part I think is ironic is how you can exist in the Porsche community and ask if someone could possibly be "that anal"?
Yes indeed someone can.

[artplumber]

Originally posted by KevinP73
The part I think is ironic is how you can exist in the Porsche community and ask if someone could possibly be "that anal"?
Yes indeed someone can.

Too true

[kaisen]

Wow. I'm amazed that someone would take the time to argue it.

GM refers to the displacement newer LS architecture engines in metric terms (5.7L) so the 'old' and 'new' smallblocks are rounded to be the same. It's good for GM because everyone can identify with it. The actual displacement of the LS1 and LS6 are 346 cu in, but even the 'old' 350s weren't always exactly 350 cu in.

So when you rebuild the motor and clean up the bores, should you refer to your engine as a 355? Or in the case of the LS6, a 351?

The guy should get a life.

E

[tobster1911]

Originally posted by kaisen
GM refers to the displacement newer LS architecture engines in metric terms (5.7L)

Yep.

Kaisen you would probably know. What is the designation for the 6.0L that they put in the GTO? Is it an LS?

[masraum]

Originally posted by kaisen
Wow. I'm amazed that someone would take the time to argue it.

GM refers to the displacement newer LS architecture engines in metric terms (5.7L) so the 'old' and 'new' smallblocks are rounded to be the same. It's good for GM because everyone can identify with it. The actual displacement of the LS1 and LS6 are 346 cu in, but even the 'old' 350s weren't always exactly 350 cu in.

So when you rebuild the motor and clean up the bores, should you refer to your engine as a 355? Or in the case of the LS6, a 351?

The guy should get a life.

E

Actually, the old 350's were pretty much exactly 350ci as they came from the factory.

bxs - 4x3.48

2^2*pi x 3.48 x 8 = 349.847 ci

It's just the newer stuff that's a bit off.

[RANDY P]

I call anything made by GM these days as a "350" -since until recently they did the 346 and a 327 - Tell him to go read yet some more Car Craft...Can't he find something else to waste bandwith on?

Only rookies and armchair mechanics (read: don't know anything else) complain about such semantics.

rjp

[masraum]

What was the 327 used in? I hadn't heard of that one except 1970 and prior. Was it still a 4x3.25?

[cashflyer]

Originally posted by masraum
What was the 327 used in? I hadn't heard of that one except 1970 and prior. Was it still a 4x3.25?

The LS4 is 325cid (5.3L) used in 2006 Chevrolet Impala/Monte Carlo SS and 2006 Pontiac Grand Prix GXP. I'm not sure if this is what he was referring to.

The LS4 is supposedly what will be standard in the new Camaro if it ever goes into production.

[kaisen]

Originally posted by tobster1911
Yep.

Kaisen you would probably know. What is the designation for the 6.0L that they put in the GTO? Is it an LS?

The all-aluminum LS1/LS6 (5.7L, 5665cc, 346.1 cu in) was introduced in the 1997 C5 Corvette and was also used in Camaros, Firebirds, GTOs, CTS-Vs, and SSRs. The LS1 has a 99mm (3.898 inch) bore and a 92mm (3.622 inch) stroke. It has the same 4.40 inch bore spacing as the 'old' small blocks of yore.

The LS6 was just a 'hotter' version of the LS1 .... basically heads and cam.

The all-aluminum LS2 (6.0L, 5970cc, 364.3 cu in) was introduced in the 2005 C6 Corvette, and was also used in 05-up GTOs, 05-up SSRs, 05-up CTS-V, and the Trailblazer SS ... so far. The LS2 has a bigger 101.6mm (4.001 inch) bore and the same 92mm stroke. It also has the same 4.40 inch bore spacing.

The all-aluminum LS7 (7.0L, 7008cc, 427.6 cu in) was introduced in the 2006 Corvette C6-Z06. The LS7 has a bigger 104.775mm (4.125 inch) bore and larger 101.6mm (4.00 inch) stroke. With the same 4.40 inch bore spacing, it is considered the edge of the envelope for a small block.

There are other 'LS' architecture motors in 99-newer GM products that are typically (but not always) cast iron block motors.

E

[NICKG]

there was a big block ls6...in chevelles and vettes in the early 70's 454ci

[kaisen]

Originally posted by masraum
What was the 327 used in? I hadn't heard of that one except 1970 and prior. Was it still a 4x3.25?

The LS4 (5.3L, 5328cc, 325 cu in) was introduced in the 2006 Impala SS / Grand Prix GTP / Monte Carlo SS. The LS4 has a 96.01mm (3.879 inch) bore and the same 92mm (3.622 inch) stroke as the LS1/LS6/LS2. It has the same specs as the 5.3L in the pickups and sport utility vehicles, but in an all aluminum transverse layout. It has the same 4.40 inch bore spacing as the 'old' small blocks.

The 'original' 327 small block was indeed a 4.00 inch bore x 3.25 inch stroke. It was basically a 'stroked' 302.

The LS4 is rated at 303hp and 323lb-ft and with Displacement On Demand the EPA gives a 28mpg freeway rating!! These cars will break 100 mph in the quarter mile, suggesting that they may make more than 303hp.

E

[masraum]

Originally posted by NICKG
there was a big block ls6...in chevelles and vettes in the early 70's 454ci

Not related to the modern LS6

[masraum]

Originally posted by kaisen
The 'original' 327 small block was indeed a 4.00 inch bore x 3.25 inch stroke. It was basically a 'stroked' 302.

Actually, I think the 302 was a destroked 327. It used a 283 crank the first year, and then the second and third year used a crank with 283 stroke, but 327/250 journal sizes.

[kaisen]

Originally posted by masraum
Actually, I think the 302 was a destroked 327. It used a 283 crank the first year, and then the second and third year used a crank with 283 stroke, but 327/250 journal sizes.

Same thing, but yes. The 327 came first so you are absolutley correct.

I should have prefaced the response by saying, "Think of the 302 as a.....", rather than 'basically'.

E

[masraum]

Get it right damn it!!!

[madmmac]

Wow, most of the Chevy guys need the 4 extra inches.

[scottmandue]

As long as we have all the GM experts here how about settling an old argument for me:

My friend has a '66 Pontiac Tempest with a 326 and I say it is the same engine as my dads old '69 Chevy impala 327 am I wrong? Will Chevy 327 parts fit on a Pontiac 326?

Thanks,
Scott