an open letter revisited
 

I closed the open letter thread. Sadly, it became an example of exactly what is wrong with this place (imho, and in the opinion of quite a few others). I also just closed the "50% believe in WMD.." thread. It had descended into a "liar liar pants on fire" debacle from both sides!

ENOUGH!

It has been requested by some people here who I consider moderate (interestingly, left and right) that a more proactive approach be taken. I am somewhat loathe to do that, but I will now not hesitate to close a thread that degenerates into a pissing contest or name calling. And "stupid ruthless neocons" and "lying fascist liberals" is name calling...even if *you* believe it to be redundant and the truth handed down from on high.

Let's get back to bikinis, weird photos, and other nonsense. If you want to talk politics or religion, fine but keep it civil. Be forewarned that the tolerance level for nasty tone/language on political and religious threads has been lowered. If you wouldn't say it to someone's face, maybe think twice about typing it here. And for god's sake, try to see the humor in things.

Carry on...

Sounds great...if applied fairly. But your decription of the WMD thread makes me believe that it is unlikely.

Fint, stop already. C'mon. Have a little respect.

He mischaracterized it to suit his purpose. He disrespected the honest posters. I respect Todd a great deal, but when he is wrong....he is wrong. When a conservative screws up in a post...he is called out...but when a liberal does...everyone was equally bad.

cool..that will never happen...It's fint's way or the highway.

Sorry, Todd.......It has to be said at the get-go before we have a carbon copy of the last failed effort at civility.

Dude, you quoted the same post multiple times over hours with insults to bait a poster into continuing an argument. Todd's right to close it.

He's implementing this rule now, and you were the most recent offender of it, he's got to start.....

Gotta agree, there are some really, really entertaining, insightful and funny people here and they are getting drowned out. BTW, I don't think I'm one of them. PPOT is/was very refreshing compared to other sites where people just spew obscenity after obscenity.

Fint, I'll say this once. Above I said I closed the thread because it had descended into people calling each other liar. Go back and take a look at that thread and tell me that *you* did not repeatedly call others liars. I did not say who started it. I did not say who was right or wrong. I merely pointed out that it reached a point where everyone was just calling each other liars. So I closed it. End of story. You think I was wrong. Fine. People can come to their own conclusions by reading the thread. But I'm done with it and will not argue any more about it.

There you go again...your first personal attack under the new rules...will something be done? Nope...but just let Mul do that.

Never said it was wrong to close it...it was wrong to make all sides equally responsible. When someone blatantly post lies about you...you would tend to press them for a retraction. When the moderator allows such from some posters....you can only expect folks to defend themselves.

"It's fint's way or the highway"

Ok, who thinks that qualifies as a personal attack?

Apparently he's not allowing it for any. The thread's closed...

The difference is they blatantly lied about me (the evidence is right there in the thread). Then they had the nerve to call me a liar. Of course (much later) I called them on it.

I do. I don't see any reason why he addressed me (by name) at all...of course it was a personal attack....it was not an attack on all mankind...sheesh.

fint...Just try to follow the suggestions Todd has laid down. Just for once, try not to shift blame and deny culpability. Your comments on the other thread were in large part the reason the thread was closed.

As for me, I am, from this point on, going to be quite selective in responding to comments meant to inflame and annoy. They resolve nothing and show a cruel and sadistic streak on the part of the instigator.

Patronizing instigation.

there is no foul language. No real insult, at least as most people would define it. Yes, he mentions you by name, so the personal part is there, but I don't quite see the insult.

And he addressed you by name because you had already taken a swipe at me. You essentially said I am incapable of being fair, and will make decisions based on party line. Under your metrics that would be a personal insult. I don't believe that to be a reasonable line in the sand for OT.

Never wrestle with a pig in the mud. All you do is get dirty and the pig likes it. Please note I didn't take sides here.

Well I can only say the you quickly proved me right...and as far as answering your post....you took the first swipe...but I guess that is alright since you moderate. I guess its Nostatics "way or the highway."

Well, he IS the moderator, isn't he?
ou by name to assure that you will kne comentow to whom th
And, I address ydd y

Your all liars, pigs, or worse. so there.

LMFAO

You don't say.....

Well, he IS the moderator, isn't he?

And, fint, I address you by name so you will know to whom the comment is addressed. It is a common courtesy to do so.

Right.

No it is not. If you have an idea or a fact post it. It is extremely rude to address me personally with a backhanded remark such as that. You were just trolling in an attempt to get me to slam you back and Todd could make an example out of me.

It is even worse when you make your "holier than thou" attempts to psychoanalyze me after I make a post that you disagree with in an attempt to demean me. You do it so often that you probably not even realize you do it.

I apologize for the initial garbled message. The keyboard on my laptop is defective and has a mind of its own.

fint..'nuff said. You prove my point.

Our discourse is at an end.

Being a moderator does not give one the right to pursue their own political agenda at other's expense. As I posted....as long as he is even-handed.....I think it is good to restrict the personal attacks. If applied fairly it will benefit me most of all.

Well, it's a good thing then Todd's not doing that...

:)

And you prove mine, My lucky day...if that means you are planning on stopping trying to figure out on line...why I am so confused and hateful. I never thought that defending one's reputation against fabrications or supporting one's country and elected officials would be viewed that way.

Time will tell.

I thought of responding, but figured that the effort of a thoughtful post would be lost.

However.......

It is not the defense of one's country that is in question. It is the methods used and the tactics that detract from the message. You attract more flies with sugar than with vinegar. And you attract more converts with logic than with sheer partisanship. Try being a bit more subtle.

And, in the future, please try to be a bit more thoughtful before labelling people. THAT is a true form of "Holier than Thou" behavior.

Was that not a civil response?

I learned early on in the OT forum to ignore certain topics and people. I don't even open the threads. I will continue to do that. I suggest in addition to Tod's moderation that the rest of us do our own moderating by not participating in those threads & situations we know will, and always do go wrong. If we did that, possibly the irritating posters would be left to gnash their teeth at each other and continue to go nowhere.

And they wonder why we react and fight back. Not PC to fight back if you are a Republican. The left remind me of a woman who pushes a man to the brink of battery, gets the beating, and then calls the cops on the man pushed over the edge.

It is the left dividing this country. It is the left demoralizing the troops. It is the left encouraging the enemy to continue forth with their murderous rampage. It is the Democrat party feeding the culture of hate...The response is not the problem, it is the culture of hate propagated by Democrats that is the problem...That is the very seat of the vitriol and reaction we see here at Pelican.

Marv:

I am beginning to think likewise. If responses were not made to inflammatory posts, maybe the number of such posts would decline or the posters would give up altogether.

I do not understand the anger and intensity with which some people respond, and how apparently easily their feelings are hurt. Seems to be a bit childish, or carefully calculated to maximize the number of responses.....

Tis a puzzlement.

I always play nice. :)


KT

And I just don't understand how those that are so quick to dish it out cannot seem to take it in return.. maybe they have small.....look, you have me playing Psychoanalyst too!

"I hate the Republicans and everything they stand for..."

Howard Dean...The man at the very front of the Democrat Party.

No. That was condescending.

Fortunately I am not attempting to attract flies...that is a democrat thing. I label no one.

I am defending my country and way of life against an onslaught of terrorism and supporters of such. If anyone has a problem with that...it is their problem not mine. It is a battle between good and evil....and there are only two sides.

So it is no wonder that a big story in the United States these days is "Bush-hating." The Democrats seem to be spinning crazily in pure fury at the president. Time magazine describes the president as a "polarizing figure." A small majority of Americans love him, Time says, but those on the leftmost side of the Democratic party positively hate him.



That really is what this is all about. Lets not beat around the Bush...

...and so history will show that divided we fell.

Republicans/Democrats...Christians/Muslims....Israel/Palestine...it's all the same and the same arguments are here every day with the same people saying the same things.

You (if the shoe fits) claim to be "intelligent" yet you beat your head against the same wall day in and day out and expect the outcome to be different.

These factions, you and your "enemy" will have to see sooner or later that coming at your friend in the OT with a knife isn't going to get you more friends.

If you're resorting to violence, verbal or for real then the battle for peace is already lost.

I haven't read the other threads but the bile is apparent; this place isn't free. You don't pay to be here and if the folks here respect you so little I must ask why you stay?

None of this crap belongs here anyway and I would feel very comfortable that if it continued in anyway that those responsible were banned entirely. The behavior just doesn't belong here.