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fastpat 08-02-2006 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rob Channell
Quote:

Originally posted by Tim Hancock
This simplistic attitude of leave them alone and they will leave us alone is flawed. The radical islamists want us dead whether we leave them alone or not.
Spoken like a man with a clue.......

I agree, Tim.

Based on what shred of evidence? There certainly isn't any known facts in evidence that muslims are prepared to invade America.

techweenie 08-02-2006 06:13 PM

Quote:

It would be much easier for Israel to carpet bomb a Lebanese town than it is to trace where missles are being launched and to send a precision bomb to that precise coordinate -- after spending a day spreading leaflets telling the population to leave because a bombing is imminent.
Yes, that's a nice fairy tale. Ports and power plants in Lebanon were bombed. Bridges bombed. Neighborhoods bombed. A convoy of refugees was bombed. A UN observer post was bombed. Nearly 600 Lebanese killed, last I heard. And the last Israeli report I heard seemed to indicate about 40% of the victims were civilians.

It was a good 10-12 days before this story of 'dropping leaflets on neighborhoods' surfaced. I would like to see some independent corroboration that is actually happening.

The other side is pumping out propaganda, as well. At least one child's corpse was paraded around by a "rescue worker" for -- what appears to be -- 4 hours. There are 5 or 6 different photos of the dead child circulating various news services.

"The first casualty when war comes is truth". Hiram W Johnson

techweenie 08-02-2006 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rob Channell
Spoken like a man with a clue.......

I agree, Tim.

Is this just another paranoid fantasy, or is there a shred of evidence to support this?

Because we played a major role in creating the 'radical Islamists' and arming them. We then abandoned them and supported governments that suppressed them or attacked governments that sheltered them.

The one tactic we haven't tried is leaving them alone.

cool_chick 08-02-2006 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
Is this just another paranoid fantasy, or is there a shred of evidence to support this?

Because we played a major role in creating the 'radical Islamists' and arming them. We then abandoned them and supported governments that suppressed them or attacked governments that sheltered them.

The one tactic we haven't tried is leaving them alone.

Ever notice how we didn't have any foreign enemy to speak of (apart from England, when we seceded from their rule) until the 20th century, coincidently when we became interventionists?

fintstone 08-02-2006 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fastpat
I reckon the Israeli's should simply even up the odds by leaving their air force on the ground, leaving their tanks in their paddocks, and only take the weapons that correspond with what Hezbollah is known to have. Then it would be a true test of courage on both sides in the fight.

But as long as the Israeli's hide behind armor and in aircraft, which is a form of cowardice, the opposition will use whatever tactics it can to compensate.

Amazing words from a man who has armed himself to the teeth as protection from the other rubes in rural South Carolina.

snowman 08-02-2006 07:31 PM

I am a simple person, Kill all the bastards before they kill you, that simple.

jyl 08-02-2006 07:55 PM

No reason for the Israelis to invite a "true test of courage" by grounding their planes. It is a war, not a sporting contest.

As I've posted before, I'm not so interested in the morality of the war in Lebanon. That way lies endless, unresolvable debate.

I'm more interested in the practicality. Are the Israelis doing what they need to do achieve their goals? Now that I see Israel sending 10,000 troops into Lebanon, I think they are moving in the right (practical) direction.

As for Hezbollah, they seem very practical. AFAIK they are doing exactly what they need to do to achieve their goals.

RoninLB 08-02-2006 08:27 PM

Terrorists couldn't exist without population support or apathy.

cool_chick 08-02-2006 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RoninLB
Terrorists couldn't exist without population support or apathy.
Or oppression....

cool_chick 08-02-2006 08:32 PM

Plus fear

You think the crips exist because of population support or apathy?

M.D. Holloway 08-02-2006 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Plus fear

You think the crips exist because of population support or apathy?

In many hoods in LA they are very popular - same reason why the Mafia had such a strong hold (and still may) in cities in the NE. They provide a level of sercurity that many folks do not get from the police.

speeder 08-02-2006 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by LubeMaster77
In many hoods in LA they are very popular - same reason why the Mafia had such a strong hold (and still may) in cities in the NE. They provide a level of sercurity that many folks do not get from the police.
This is absolute nonsense, where did you hear it? There is none of the kind of security provided by old line Italian mafia families or the attendant popularity in the communities with modern street gangs. Just none at all. And the reason is because they do not have a code of conduct like the Italians did that kept them from committing street-level crime against their own people or selling drugs to school children, etc....

The Hezbollah, OTOH, besides being a political party w/ an armed militia are the biggest provider of social services in southern Lebanon such as schools, clinics, hospitals, etc. and they are extremely popular in their country. Unfortunately, the current conflict has bolstered this considerably.

RoninLB 08-02-2006 09:53 PM

" Terrorists couldn't exist without population support or apathy."

"Or oppression"
"Plus fear. You think the crips exist because of population support or apathy?"


You have no level of understanding to comment.

Emotional responses are great and may you love all the people around you.
..but leave me out of it.

RoninLB 08-02-2006 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tim Hancock

Speeder, I think it is safe to say that my right wing opinions and your ????wing opinions will never coincide when it comes to picking sides in a fight.


I think you got it all wrong Tim.

Denis has more than opinions. He's a textbook example of white guilt. Pick an issue and he'll follow the profile 100%. The more intense the issue the bigger the cage he's in. Hey, different strokes for different folks.

that said, I believe he's a good friend.

techweenie 08-02-2006 10:29 PM

Quote:

You are either lying or you don't know what you're talking about.

July 12 - soldiers captured - conflict begins
July 13 - "planes dropped leaflets on southern Beirut warning residents to keep clear of Hizbullah positions"
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/front/2006/0714/3138014947HM1LEBANON.html


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1154574652.jpg

Translation:

To all Lebanese residents

Following the repeated terrorist actions of the Hezbollah, which has reached the efforts intented on finding a better future for Lebanon, the Israeli army will act in Lebanon for all the duration necessary in order to protect the Israeli people.
For your security and in order to avoid harm to civilian people who are not implied with Hezbollah, avoid being in places where Hezbollah is located and where it operates.

It is necessary that you know that the continuation of the terrorist actions against Israel is a double edged blade for you and for Lebanon.

Signed Israel

Source: http://lebanonheartblogs.blogspot.com/2006/07/how-nice.html

Did you read what you linked to? It appears you did not, but it might be a good idea.

cool_chick 08-03-2006 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by RoninLB
" Terrorists couldn't exist without population support or apathy."

"Or oppression"
"Plus fear. You think the crips exist because of population support or apathy?"


You have no level of understanding to comment.

Emotional responses are great and may you love all the people around you.
..but leave me out of it.

LOL

Emotional responses? Sociological studies were part of my formal education. Nothing emotional about my response.

And I beg to differ about my "level of understanding."


What you guys describe about the Muslim people is some species that is not human.

RoninLB 08-03-2006 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
LOL

Emotional responses? Sociological studies were part of my formal education. Nothing emotional about my response.

And I beg to differ about my "level of understanding."


What you guys describe about the Muslim people is some species that is not human.


that's great info.. I just called the White House.
here you go.

"Our administration takes these matters seriously and your opinion was heard loud and clear here in Washington. You'll be pleased to learn that, thanks to the concerns of citizens like yourself, we are creating a new division of the Terrorist Retraining Program, to be called the "Liberals Accept Responsibility for Killers" program, or LARK for short.


In accordance with the guidelines of this new program, we have decided to place one terrorist under your personal care. Your personal detainee has been selected and scheduled for transportation under heavily armed guard to your residence next Monday.

Ali Mohammed Ahmed bin Mahmud (you can just call him Ahmed) is to be cared for pursuant to the standards you personally infered to in your PP OT reply of complaint. It will likely be necessary for you to hire some assistant caretakers.

We will conduct weekly inspections to ensure that your standards of care for Ahmed are commensurate with those you so strongly alluded to in your reply.

Although Ahmed is a sociopath and extremely violent, we hope that your "level of understanding will help. Your adopted terrorist is extremely proficient in hand-to-hand combat and can extinguish human life with such simple items as a pencil or nail clippers. We advise that you do not ask him to demonstrate these skills at your next yoga group. He is also expert at making a wide variety of explosive devices from common household products, so you may wish to keep those items locked up, unless (in your opinion) this might offend him.

Ahmed will not wish to interact with you or your daughters (except sexually), since he views females as a subhuman form of property. This is a particularly sensitive subject for him and he has been known to show violent tendencies around women who fail to comply with the new dress code that he will recommend as more appropriate attire. I'm sure you will come to enjoy the anonymity offered by the burka -- over time.

Just remember that it is all part of "respecting his culture and his
religious beliefs" -- wasn't that how you would put it?

We truly appreciate it when folks like you keep us informed. You take good care of Ahmed - and remember..we'll be watching.

Good luck!
Cordially, your friend,
Don Rumsfeld

techweenie 08-03-2006 07:44 AM

Quote:

Nice try. Of course I read it. Some Lebanese blame Hezbullah, most blame Israel. It's interesting to read viewpoints other than that found in your local newspaper, isn't it. The fact is that you lied and I called you out. Next time you make up stories, remember that the Internet makes it easy to debunk your BS.

To have an intelligent debate on this forum requires discussing truths -- not making things up to support your position.

Ronin, that's brilliant! Haha.

As I suspected, you did not read your links.

The first mentioned that Olmert 'announced' to the Lebanese that he was attacking Hezbollah. Meaning what? He stated it on Israeli TV? Radio? What did it mean? Hezbollah is in a region, not in 'neighborhoods.' The inference is that the entire region where Hezbollah is operating would have to be evacuated. Not realistic, practical and certainly not reasonable.

Same with the leaflets supposedly dropped before bombing. Read what it says. Israel does not know where Hezbollah is, specifically. Maybe local Lebanese do -- maybe not. Again, it's a general evacuation demand.

Neither the broadcast nor the leaflets are useful instructions. That's why civilian causalties are estimated at such a high percentage.

The whole idea of "surgical strikes" is some kind of comic book fantasy. If a bomb falls in your neighborhood, targeting people who are indistinguishable from you, except for their ideas, lots of innocent people are going to die.

The Arab world was not on Hezbollah's side in general until after about a week of Israeli bombing of civilians, tourists, etc. Then opinion shifted.

techweenie 08-03-2006 08:31 AM

For anyone who thinks the situation is as simple as the PR machines would have you believe, here's something that will challenge everything you "know" if you actually read what it says and implies:

http://tinyurl.com/jb3y4

(for those averse to clicking or doing any kind of research, this is from a reserve IDF officer talking about working with Arabs and specifically the Israel-Hezbollah connection.)

Halm 08-03-2006 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
The whole idea of "surgical strikes" is some kind of comic book fantasy. If a bomb falls in your neighborhood, targeting people who are indistinguishable from you, except for their ideas, lots of innocent people are going to die.
Correct, to a point. a.) Even the idiot that runs the UN admonished Hezbollah for hiding among innocent civilians. 2.) Carpet bombing would cheaper for Israel and have a higher physological effect on the locals.

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
The Arab world was not on Hezbollah's side in general until after about a week of Israeli bombing of civilians, tourists, etc. Then opinion shifted.
Again, correct, to a point. Not a single Arab Jew, Christian or Hindu supported Hezbollah. It was only the Muslim Arabs that provided support to Hezbollah. Iran and Syria continue to provide arms and supplies.

If you want to know how bad this situation may become, take a look at this ABC News story.

Here is another way of looking at this. Imagine _____ (you fill in the name), the worst possible extreme right winged religious leader in the US becomes President for 20 years. That is exactly what we have with the radical Muslims. They are accountable to no one and they will find a way to exert their will.

And to be clear, their will is "convert" or "die."

Tim Hancock 08-03-2006 09:02 AM

Tech, simple question. Who would you rather see come out on top in this "fight", A: Hezbollah or B: Israel? AFTER answering the simple A or B question, THEN feel free to dance all around and make fun of the simple question.

speeder 08-03-2006 09:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
As I suspected, you did not read your links.

The Arab world was not on Hezbollah's side in general until after about a week of Israeli bombing of civilians, tourists, etc. Then opinion shifted.

Exactly.

I have a question for anyone on the right: Quickly, w/o googling for 15 minutes, which type of muslims are the Hezbollah? And which type are the overwhelming majority of muslims in the world? Which group does not even consider the other to be "real muslims"?

This would be a start to having a basic, 6th grade level understanding of the situation in terms of who is whose ally and why.

techweenie 08-03-2006 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Halm


Here is another way of looking at this. Imagine _____ (you fill in the name), the worst possible extreme right winged religious leader in the US becomes President for 20 years. That is exactly what we have with the radical Muslims. They are accountable to no one and they will find a way to exert their will.

And to be clear, their will is "convert" or "die."

But don't you agree that the radical Muslims are not a majority in any country?

Radical Muslim leaders had failed everywhere except Afghanistan until 9/11/01, when they suddenly looked like the winning team to the disaffected Muslim youth. That permanent 'chip on the shoulder' of young Muslim men suddenly was removed by radical Islam.

Yes, radical Islam is strong -- much stronger now than before the US helped give it power by using it as a tool to fight the Soviets. And stonger still since 9/11.

But radical Islam is not powerful enough to threaten the US in any meaningful way. Its threat to the US is way overblown for political reasons. For the most part, its followers are incapable of operating outside their own villages or sects because of a near-total lack of education.

There is a BBC documentary never shown in the US -- and probably never to be broadcast here -- but it can be seen on Google video. It's called "The Power of Nightmares" and it is an eye-opening story of, among other things, the birth of radical Islam. I recommend watching part 1 for background.

1967 R50/2 08-03-2006 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by speeder
Exactly.

I have a question for anyone on the right: Quickly, w/o googling for 15 minutes, which type of muslims are the Hezbollah? And which type are the overwhelming majority of muslims in the world? Which group does not even consider the other to be "real muslims"?

This would be a start to having a basic, 6th grade level understanding of the situation in terms of who is whose ally and why.

Well, I'm not on the right, but anyone should be able to tell you that Hez is mainly Shia. Sunni is the majority sect and they consider the Shia to be heretics.

...but you don't need to be a majority to cause a problem.

Quote:

Originally posted by Techweenie


Radical Muslim leaders had failed everywhere except Afghanistan until 9/11/01, when they suddenly looked like the winning team to the disaffected Muslim youth.

Not accurate in the least.

Long before there was Afghanistan, there was Iran. And the radicals have managed to be quite successful there for some time. The current Iranian Pres was part of that original radical movement.

Hez is completely their tool, in part to breed more radicalism.

That is all.

Halm 08-03-2006 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
But don't you agree that the radical Muslims are not a majority in any country?
Are you forgetting Iran? Maybe not at the grassroots level, but in the religious and political arenas there the radicals have total control.


Thanks for the The Power of Nightmares heads up. I will try to watch it ASAP and see how it compares to Ghost Wars history.

techweenie 08-03-2006 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1967 R50/2
Not accurate in the least.

Long before there was Afghanistan, there was Iran. And the radicals have managed to be quite successful there for some time. The current Iranian Pres was part of that original radical movement.

Hez is completely their tool, in part to breed more radicalism.

That is all.

Don't agree. Before Afghanistan, Iran was not sufficiently "radical" for the folks we're talking about. Radical Muslims are happy only with a government like that of the Taliban -- enforcing Shia law at the point of the sword on the streets. Iran is still not to that point, today. It's considered 'secularized' by the Jihadists we are concerned about.

While Iran seems "radical" to us, there is a whole other mindsel among true radical Muslims.

And, BTW, the Israeli attacks are helping forge alliances between Sunni and Shia that will spell even more trouble for the region.

1967 R50/2 08-03-2006 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
Don't agree. Before Afghanistan, Iran was not sufficiently "radical" for the folks we're talking about. Radical Muslims are happy only with a government like that of the Taliban -- enforcing Shia law at the point of the sword on the streets. Iran is still not to that point, today.
Actaully, Iran has Sharia law (SHARIA not Shia...thats a religion) and has had it since the revolution (and even before) and it is much more severe than most gulf states.

It was not enforced at sword point. They used guns.

Bottomline: They are quite radical and are known to fund even more radical organizations such as Hez. Making excuses for them doesn't cut it.

Now really, that is all I have time for.

Tim Hancock 08-03-2006 11:29 AM

What is the moral to this story? It sounds like some think we should appease all who wish us harm and cave into any of their demands (wouldn't want to upset these peace loving folk anymore right?).

Palestinians want Irael... The US should should assist those poor Hamas folks with another holocaust.

Iraq wants to conquer Kuwait..... The US should have assisted the Iraqies instead of stopping them.

Iraq wants to continue non compliance with the UN's resolutions..... The US should have turned the other cheek.

Iran wants to build nukes so they can turn Israel and maybe someday some US cities into rubble..... The US should provide them with the materials to do so.

A bunch of nutjobs training in Afganistan want to blow up some more buildings in the US...... The US should build some twin towers for them so that they can do it again.

After all what is a few thousand US deaths here and there in the grand scheme of things.

If we do all of the above, maybe we will not run the risk of "offending" these b@stards and then if we beg real nice like and keep allowing them to go to school in our country, marry our women and even live here, they will be content (as long as we as Americans do not set foot on THEIR soil).

:rolleyes:

dhoward 08-03-2006 11:30 AM

Aww...
You're just and old, crankey bastard now...

techweenie 08-03-2006 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1967 R50/2
Actaully, Iran has Sharia law (SHARIA not Shia...thats a religion) and has had it since the revolution and it is much more severe than most gulf states.

It was not enforced at sword point. They used guns.

Bottomline: They are quite radical and are known to fund even more radical organizations such as Hez. Making excuses for them doesn't cut it.

Now really, that is all I have time for.

D-oh, yes, I meant Sharia law.

So it's been suggested that Iran is run on a day-to-day basis the same way Afghanistan was under the Taliban... that's not the information I have.

I would like to see some independent source for this.

BTW, Sharia law is understood to be the basis for the Iraqi constitution. But I don't believe they plan to stone women for walking unescorted on the street as happened in Afhanistan... at least I hope not.

1967 R50/2 08-03-2006 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by techweenie
D-oh, yes, I meant Sharia law.

So it's been suggested that Iran is run on a day-to-day basis the same way Afghanistan was under the Taliban... that's not the information I have.

I would like to see some independent source for this.

BTW, Sharia law is understood to be the basis for the Iraqi constitution. But I don't believe they plan to stone women for walking unescorted on the street as happened in Afhanistan... at least I hope not.

Well, that took about 2 seconds:

Woman sentenced to Stoning:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=7843

But apparently they have seen the light and decided not to stone for the moment...they will hang instead.

Stoning repeal:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2609597.stm

Hanging instituted:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=893

or maybe they will be whipped:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=634

Numerous other articles about oppression of women in Iran:

http://www.wfafi.org/e-zan.htm

techweenie 08-03-2006 11:48 AM

Even the Brits have figured out that sooner or later, you've gotta talk with folks.

We must rethink the War on Terror - Blair
By Rosemary Bennett in Los Angeles and David Charter

FIVE years into the War on Terror, Tony Blair called yesterday for a “complete renaissance of our strategy” to defeat militant Islam.

Speaking in Los Angeles, the Prime Minister admitted that the use of force alone had alienated Muslim opinion, and said that there was now an “arc of extremism” stretching across the Middle East and beyond. He called for an “alliance of moderation” that would combat terrorism using values as much as military might.

On a day when four British soldiers were killed by insurgents in Afghanistan and Iraq, the Prime Minister’s words were an apparent admission that the use of military force alone had failed.

----------full article----------
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2295604,00.html#cid=OTC-RSS&attr=World

techweenie 08-03-2006 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1967 R50/2
Well, that took about 2 seconds:

Woman sentenced to Stoning:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=7843

But apparently they have seen the light and decided not to stone for the moment...they will hang instead.

Stoning repeal:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2609597.stm

Hanging instituted:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=893

or maybe they will be whipped:

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=634

Numerous other articles about oppression of women in Iran:

http://www.wfafi.org/e-zan.htm


Thanks for these links. It appears as if Iran is currently run just about the way the Taliban ran Afghanistan.

So I have to amend my statment: no ME country other than Iran is run by radical Muslims.

As for my contention that Iran is more fundamentalist now than before 9/11, I'm happy to see any links that prove or disprove that.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by cool_chick
Ever notice how we didn't have any foreign enemy to speak of (apart from England, when we seceded from their rule) until the 20th century, coincidently when we became interventionists?
In one word, yes.

That was what the "progressives" of the late 19th and early 20th century were all about. Bringing various "progressive" ideologies to "backward" countries for their own good, either with their cooperation or with killing them until they cooperated, i.e. the Philipines in the case of the US government. It killed over 200,000 filipinos with a loss of about 5000 US servicemen, wiping out entire villages Liddice style, only more of them.

Interventionism was funded by the alleged change in the taxing power of the US government fostered by the 16th Amendment, and with voting for these "improvements" in government authority and power eased by the 17th Amendment.

Until we erase at least those two Amendments Americans will have a hard time bringing the federal government back under control.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fintstone
Amazing words from a man who has armed himself to the teeth as protection from the other rubes in rural South Carolina.
I'm armed to protect myself from guys that think like you do. Loyal to a government, but disloyal to principle and to America.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:25 PM

Quote:

I agree. Anybody without a basic knowledge of Islam should not waste Wayne's hard drive space by posting on this topic.
Well, well, that's as clear a posting of anti-Semitic* trash as I've seen on this forum.

Thanks for posting your true feelings.


*Yes, arabs are Semites like the Sephardic Jews.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by snowman
I am a simple person, Kill all the bastards before they kill you, that simple.
Simple minded is more like it, your idea is extremely complex in execution.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jyl
No reason for the Israelis to invite a "true test of courage" by grounding their planes. It is a war, not a sporting contest.

As I've posted before, I'm not so interested in the morality of the war in Lebanon. That way lies endless, unresolvable debate.

I'm more interested in the practicality. Are the Israelis doing what they need to do achieve their goals? Now that I see Israel sending 10,000 troops into Lebanon, I think they are moving in the right (practical) direction.

As for Hezbollah, they seem very practical. AFAIK they are doing exactly what they need to do to achieve their goals.

Practicality is what you want? Why didn't you say so. A total pragmatist would give nukes to Hezbollah and have them wipe out Israel, thus ending the conflict with the least number of casualties, and ending mideast conflict based solely on religion. Then the Shi'ia and the Sunni could fight it out without US involvement, and we could buy oil from the winner of that.

There's your practicality.

Pretty impractical in execution, just like Snowman's ideas.

fastpat 08-03-2006 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Halm
Correct, to a point. a.) Even the idiot that runs the UN admonished Hezbollah for hiding among innocent civilians. 2.) Carpet bombing would cheaper for Israel and have a higher physological effect on the locals.

Yeah, just like 9/11/2001 had a higher psychological effects on America "locals".

Bombing doesn't produce the results you apparently think it does, and never has.

Halm 08-03-2006 02:21 PM

Techweenie,

Ok, I just finished watching Parts I and II. Here are some quick “hip shots” before I watch Part III later tonight.

1.) This seems more like a veiled attack on the American Right than an explaination of how we got to today with respect to radical Islam.
2.) Kuta came to loath America for its lack of moral values, as he defined them.
3.) A few choice quotes from various Muslims:
a.) “Freedom will drag our county to the bottom.”
b,) “We are the correct Muslims.”
c.) “Kill our way to perfection.”
4.) These radicals see democracy as corrupt.


The one thing this helped me understand is why Muslims are killing Muslims in Iraq: Because they have not risen up and over thorough the government therefore they are corrupt and are to be killed.

The documentary does not go into, at all, the empowering effect Afghanistan had on OBL.

The documentary completely ignored that America’s involvement in Afghanistan was completely William Cassey’s private war.

So, what is this series makes you think we can have an Oprah chat session with these people and come away alive?


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