Outstanding Police Video

[DavidI]

I was recently sent a video regarding the president of the San Francisco Police Association. In July 2006, a San Francisco police officer was killed when a pursued car driven by a bad guy crashed into him. The media attacked the merit of pursuits.

I know this video is going to draw the fire of the Patsies, but I am posting it anyway.

David

[DavidI]

Police Officer Nick-Tomasito Birco
San Francisco Police Department
California
End of Watch: Wednesday, July 26, 2006

Biographical Info
Age: 39
Tour of Duty: 5 years
Badge Number: 612

Incident Details
Cause of Death: Vehicle pursuit
Date of Incident: Wednesday, July 26, 2006
Weapon Used: Automobile
Suspect Info: Charged with murder

Officer Nick Birco was killed when his patrol car was struck by a van being pursued by officers at the intersection of Cambridge and Felton Streets.

The persons in the van had been involved in an earlier robbery of an individual. The victim had accompanied officers during a search of the van and located it a short distance away. As the officers approached it, the van sped away.

The officers pursued the van until it struck the rear quarter-panel of Officer Birco's patrol car, causing it spin around and strike a utility pole. The van then struck two buildings and crashed. Officer Birco had aborted an attempt to lay down spike strips at the intersection and was moving his patrol car when it was struck.

All four persons were taken into custody. The three occupants of the van were charged with murder, manslaughter, and other charges.

Officer Birco was transported to San Francisco General Hospital where he was pronounced dead a short time later.

Officer Birco was a US Marine Corps veteran of the Gulf War. He had served with the San Francisco Police Department for 5 years and was survived by his parents, two sisters, brother-in-law, niece, and two nephews.

[Jeff Higgins]

Whatever happened in this case? It's been since last July; have the four people responsible been tried yet?

I have always wondered why our judges are not more visible, and more accountable, to the people. Here in Washington, we vote on them with no information whatsoever to go on. We have been told they need to remain insulated from the vagaries of public opinion, so that their sentencing practices are not swayed by a desire to get re-elected. So why do we vote on them in the first place? The right to vote for them implies the right to know their records as judges, yet we don't get to see those records.

[m21sniper]

First and foremost: My condolences to the family of the fallen Marine.

Moving on to the topic at hand, i am of a mixed mind WRT pursuits. Sometimes they're good, sometimes they're bad.

Now as far as the video, i understand the media's great LOVE of making a stink out of things they understand little about, but one quote by that spokesman really stuck in my craw.

"We have media people questioning the vailidity of the pursuit, as if that was the issue at hand."

Well, sir, you must understand that the criminals heinous record notwithstanding, YES, Police condut on pursuits is ALWAYS AN ISSUE AT HAND. Perhaps not 'the issue', fine, but it is ALWAYS an issue. The fact is that pursuits are very dangerous, and should only be engaged in when the conditions appear(please note that i said APPEAR, thus giving the cops full ability to use their own good judgement and realizing some mistakes can/will be made from time to time) to be permissive to such an activity.

Now not knowing the details of this incident i have no idea if it was justified or not, but i have seen cases in the past where i felt they were not, and i have seen cases in the past where i felt they were.

What's your take David? What would you have done differently if you'd been there?

Oh, and one other thing:

"Maybe we ought to sit in our stations like firemen and only respond when we're called, maybe that's what the people of SF want. I don't think so."

Well actually.....i would be absolutely fine with that. At least that way the cops might actually COME when you call them(as opposed to sitting at a speed trap or running 8000 tags at once fleecing the public for yet more money)

"Officer Berko did nothing wrong in this pursuit, and that will come out when the investigation is complete."

Sir, if the investigation is not complete, and if you are not one of the investigating officers....???

As far as judges being corrupt and incompetent, um, yeah...no shiit.

Again, my condolences to the Marine.

[DavidI]

Pursuits are extremely dangerous for everyone involved- the public, the officers, and the criminal. Until the penalties for evading are increased, the deterent level is minimal. The danger of absolving pursuits is that criminals can get away to commit more crimes. There are very specific limitations regarding police being allowed to engage in pursuits regarding the crimes. I support pursuits and have been involved in many either as the primary, assist, or supervisor.

If your mother, wife, or daughter was brutalized and the bad guy were within view of an officer and the guy got into a car and fled, would you support a pursuit? If your mother, wife, or daughter were going to school and were struck by a fleeing bad guy or a pursuing officer, would you support pursuits?

Technology hopefully comes up with a solution that reliably stops bad guys from fleeing. That will benefit everyone.

David

[on-ramp]

that's too bad. he's absolutely correct. judges are not held accountable for letting criminals roam the streets to hurt innocent people...

these cops put their lives on the line every day to protect us, it's an honorable thing, and it's a shame this guy was out on the street to begin with, net result being another cop killed.

and the media, well, there're the worst, just want to sell newspapers.

[m21sniper]

Originally posted by DavidI
If your mother, wife, or daughter was brutalized and the bad guy were within view of an officer and the guy got into a car and fled, would you support a pursuit? If your mother, wife, or daughter were going to school and were struck by a fleeing bad guy or a pursuing officer, would you support pursuits?

Just as assuredly as i'd oppose them if my mother, wife, or daughter was killed by a cop cruiser on a pursuit.

Double edged sword.

Technology hopefully comes up with a solution that reliably stops bad guys from fleeing. That will benefit everyone.

David [/B]

Such technology has existed for a very long time, it would just have to be implemented. Any digital combo-coded transmitter could disable any selected vehicle with electronic ignition, ECU, or an electric fuel pump with the simple flick of a switch. You'd have to retrofit recievers and switches in all the older cars, but it could easily be done from a technology standpoint. Of course that would be stringently opposed in the courts.

[DavidI]

Originally posted by m21sniper
[B]Just as assuredly as i'd oppose them if my mother, wife, or daughter was killed by a cop cruiser on a pursuit. Double edged sword.

This is exactly what I said......

[i]Such technology has existed for a very long time, it would just have to be implemented. Any digital combo-coded transmitter could disable any selected vehicle with electronic ignition, ECU, or an electric fuel pump with the simple flick of a switch. You'd have to retrofit recievers and switches in all the older cars, but it could easily be done from a technology standpoint. Of course that would be stringently opposed in the courts.

This is not perfected. If it was, the police departments would have implemented it long ago. Unless you are some super genious that has a secret. If you do, I want to be a partner to become rich, David

[m21sniper]

Originally posted by DavidI
[B]This is exactly what I said......

So then i was agreeing with you. Don't be so shocked.

This is not perfected. If it was, the police departments would have implemented it long ago. Unless you are some super genious that has a secret. If you do, I want to be a partner to become rich, David.

The technology is not just available, it's also very old.

All you need is a switch attatched to a reciever that will open a circuit to cut off power on demand. It could either be radio wave or IR LOS controlled. The catch is you need a reciever and switch installed in the target car, which could be compelled by passage of some new law.

It's remote control car technology. Child's play.

What YOU'RE thinking of is a device that could just shut off any car with some sort of EM emmission- like an EMP, and no, that does not exist quite yet(not at a price a dept could afford anyway).

Police have not implemented either because you have no constitutional or legal authority to do so. Hopefully, said authority will never exist. You guys have far too much power already.

[DavidI]

Originally posted by m21sniper
It's remote control car technology. Child's play.

What YOU'RE thinking of is a device that could just shut off any car with some sort of EM emmission- like an EMP, and no, that does not exist quite yet.

Police have not implemented either because you have no constitutional or legal authority to do so. Hopefully, said authority will never exist. You guys have far too much power already.

You are a funny guy. If something were installed into everyone's car, what would prevent someone from disconnecting it? Think about all of these brilliant 18 year olds who create super viruses. LoJack works because it is not in most cars. Bad guys don't know whether a car is equipped.

Here is a question for you. Don't interject all of your "Snipey logic" and "Patsy logic" into it. Literally, what powers do police have that residents of America do not?

Let's see how educated you are......David

[m21sniper]

You are a funny guy.

Thank you for noticing.

If something were installed into everyone's car, what would prevent someone from disconnecting it?

Stupidity, apathy, and ignorance. That covers about 90% of the populace.

Think about all of these brilliant 18 year olds who create super viruses. LoJack works because it is not in most cars. Bad guys don't know whether a car is equipped.

And think of all those morons that you arrest on a daily basis. Some of them are lucky to tie their shoes. In the repo bidness we use a box that has to be authorized every so often, and is done so everytime a payment is made by swiping the box with an electronic keycard. If the customer doesnt come in, the car is disabled, we go get it.

You'd be amazed at how easy they are to disable...and equally amazed at how many morons dont even have the first clue that its installed to begin with, or who know it's there and still make no attempt to disable it either before or after the thing turns their car into a 3500lb paperweight.

Here is a question for you. Don't interject all of your "Snipey logic" and "Patsy logic" into it. Literally, what powers do police have that residents of America do not?

Let's see how educated you are......David

What other logic am i supposed to employ? It's like asking me to answer a question verbally, but not do it in english.

I only speak english....

[DavidI]

Originally posted by m21sniper
What other logic am i supposed to employ? It's like asking me to answer a question verbally, but not do it in english.

I only speak english....

How about factual based information instead of Philly Repoman-isms?

David

[m21sniper]

Sorry man, Philly repo-isms are all i got, just like LAPD cop-isms are all you got.

We are what we are.

As far as your question, if you want any kind of meaningful answer, you are going to have to be more specific.

[David]

I agree with everything he said and I believe journalists try to be way too politically correct.

On the other hand, I also believe if we stop or at least redirect the unwinable war on drugs, judges will have more time in court and more room in prison to put violent offenders like these guys away.

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by DavidI
I know this video is going to draw the fire of the Patsies, but I am posting it anyway.

David

I'd work for that guy.

[Craig 930 RS]

To be a cop in liberalville.............gawd, what a pain in the ass.

Common sense is rare, what a great 'speech'. Thumbs up.

[speedracer]

There was an interview with him on our local radio here in Canada. He tells it like it is. Hopefully more people like him will continue to be heard and things will start to change eventually.