Where is the genteel lifestyle today?

[Zeke]

In fact, what IS the genteel life these days? I'd like to feel like I'm sitting in plush leather, in a satin smoking jacket, sipping the best cognac, sharing a good cigar with great fellows in my company, all the while with a little classic jazz in the background on the perfect McIntosh analogue system. I don't want to actually do any of this, just feel that way about what I am doing.

I've lived pretty well most of my life. I have a decent house that is full of heirlooms and is kept nicely. I know my foods, eaten in the best restaurants, I know the wines, the sauces, all that. I've been to theater, to concerts, seen great conductors and performers. I'm not that well read or traveled, but I've done enough to not be a dolt at a cocktail party. I was raised solid middle class with plenty of money and played golf at the country club as a sub teen and teen. I've got almost impeccable manners at the table and elsewhere in the home and in public. (When I'm not being an ass ) I've worn custom tailored suits (no silk, however), wool slacks and cashmere sweaters and sport coats. I guess I saved the silk for socks.

I play a fundamental chess game. I thought I'd like to learn to play bridge, but then I thought maybe I wouldn't care for that too much. I'm not mathematically inclined like a good poker player, so beating people at games is not my cup of tea. In fact, I don't need to win at anything. Just be good at what I do. Maybe cards or board games are not too sophisticated anyway. Doesn't bother me either way. Perhaps I digress with the games.

Some things I have not done: I haven't shot a fine shotgun or ridden a great horse. I never learned to fly and so have not flown wonderful vintage planes. I don't particularly like the water, so I've not sailed a spectacular yacht.. Never played polo, that I can tell you. I speak and read one language.

The thing is, I'm not impressed with any of that or myself for having done any of it . If I was, I'd do it still. I felt like a teenager driving the '71S, M&K equipped 911. So far, I like the '88 Carrera better. In fact, I've made a decision to move to a 964 or 993 after this one, if it becomes viable. That's the only genteel thing I can think of that I like. Otherwise, I'd much rather make or build something. I prefer to work with my hands rather than sit at a desk.

BUT. I want a genteel lifestyle. Or at least I'd like to think I'm leading a lifestyle. Gentlemen ( and ladies), how does this work?

Don't tell me to go join Tabs for some of his espresso and then take in a buffet. I've been a veggie for 21 years, so all I get is rabbit food anyway. And, I gave up alcohol, so a single malt is lost on me.

BTW, why do I ask this question? Well, when I think that way, I'm happier. Less stress, too. Bottom line, I was born and raised in a white collar professional family and willingly launched myself into the blue collar world when I departed at age 18, repudiating all the entitlements of the bourgeois. Catch 22, ain't it? Someone will point out that money doesn't buy intangibles.

Let's hear it from the peanut gallery about your or your acquaintance's sophistication. If you want to call it that. Any terms are acceptable.

[masraum]

--scratch-- I ain't sher whut yer talkin' 'bout, but I sure is currius about the answers you git. --burp--

[Seahawk]

I thought I'd like to learn to play bridge, but then I thought maybe I wouldn't care for that too much.

Well, then, nevermind.

Honestly, trappings do not matter...being sophisticated is an illusion.

[m21sniper]

Jeez Milt, to me what you describe is hardly a middle class upbringing.

Played Golf at the country club? That is a whole different kind of middle class than the one i grew up in.

LOL.

PS: Congratz on your success thus far in life. Oh, and in your shoes....i'd have a drink and eat a big fat burger!

[Zeke]

sniper, upper class is reserved for the very, very wealthy and properly developed (schooling, finishing, etc.) individuals that have mostly a legacy and a lot of connections. Paris Hilton could have been one of those. John Kennedy JR. was one. Everyone else is middle class. Upper middle class, lower middle class, it 'is the biggest class and way beyond the majority belong in it.

There are country clubs and then country clubs. Some, are pretty inaccessible, no matter how much money one has. Community standing would actually be more important to join. I'd say the country club that fed me every Sunday evening during my youth was definitely middle class. I have no interest in that scene. I don't play golf anymore either, although, I taught my wife a pretty good swing!

[Jims5543]

I started to type up a book and deleted it.

I grew up pretty poor, when I was first married I didn't have much money either, we were a paycheck to paycheck house like my parents. I learned to do without and not bother looking at what others had and to be content.

Family comes first, if you love you wife and kids and long to spend all your free time with them you will live a happy, full life.


I would lie if I did not say as the years have gone by I have not grown to like the finer things, but, they are not important to me.

I stayed in Westons, W's and Ritz Carlton's, but have no problem checking into a LaQuinta Inn or Holiday Inn Express.

I have eaten at 5 star restaurants, but I am just as at home at a Waffle house.

I have been to posh A list clubs but prefer to sit on the back patio with a friend and drink a beer.

I find it rather uncomfortable to go to 5 Star restaurants and 5 star hotels. The typical client is a pompus a-hole sizing you up to see if you measure up to them. They are obsessed with what everyone else is doing and have to be one up on everyone.

I think its a sad life.

Same goes for track days, there are guys there in their Pasta Rockets that will barely speak to you, especially me in my RX7 that blue books for $3K. I dont care, I make friends with the Muatang, Camaro and Honda guys and have a blast.

There! I wrote another book.

Bottom line, yeah the Upper Class living is cool but I do not care to be around the people and I honestly do not find it that important.

Now I am off to finish my $8 bottle of wine.

[fastpat]

It ain't in Long Beach.

[Grady Clay]

Milt,

I agree with Jim but from the other direction.

You (and I) have found our way there. I grew up similarly; boarding school, country club, deb parties. After college I traded gad school and a MBA for starting a Porsche business.

As I’m sure you notice, I like the technical aspects. There is far more than that. I only interacted with successful professionals – that was who owned Porsches. Of course there were some idle rich who made their money the old fashioned way (they inherited it) to spice things up.

No one owned their 911s because they needed transportation. It was all about fun. Of course what was fun was as different as all the people. To some it was status. To others it was competition or technical and many other. To some (mostly DIY) just hanging out at the (social) parts counter made their day.

You are leading that genteel life right now.

“I'd like to feel like I'm sitting in plush leather” In a Porsche seat.
“in a satin smoking jacket” A Nomex driver’s suit.
“sipping the best cognac, sharing a good cigar with great fellows in my company” Solvent and MFI unburned hydrocarbons with your friends adjusting the MFI…
“all the while with a little classic jazz in the background” Your ‘71S at 7300 rpm.
“on the perfect McIntosh analogue system.” A 911!

And all the other.


“BUT. I want a genteel lifestyle. Or at least I'd like to think I'm leading a lifestyle. Gentlemen (and ladies), how does this work?” You are there and don’t realize it.

Where else but Pelican (and a few others) can you interact with very knowledgeable and like-minded friends? Your computer screen is the smoking lounge at the club (without the smoke). You can sit around, swap stories and plan the next adventure.

Is it exactly the same as when my great grandfather entertained Pierpont Morgan in his library? No, and I don’t want it that way. I would much prefer to lie on a creeper and have you show me your latest creation.

I’m not dismissing all the other. Everything has its place in life. I would put family and raising kids very high on my list.

Best,
Grady

[fastpat]

Well said, Grady. The Genteel Life is a state of mind, something we Southerners have known all our lives.

[Zeke]

Originally posted by fastpat
It ain't in Long Beach.

No, it ain't. I was born here. It was different then and even not that long ago. Mainly a large city by the beach. Lots and lots of retired folks from the Midwest come here to live. Reasonable manufacturing, retail and maritime enterprises. Then, the old folks all died.

Now the place is the poorest city in the state for population 100K>. 6th in the US. Boeing bought Douglas and tore it down; subdivided it. Developers razed hundreds of single family homes and put 8 units on 2 lots with 8 off street parking spots. The city government has been corrupt for decades. Might actually be OK now, but way, way too late.

I moved to South Orange County (you know, the TV show) to a planned community for 13 years. Tough place to live for a nice guy who liked his tools. I lived in 2 other towns of 25K and couldn't make a living. I couldn't crack the good ol' boy network and I didn't have the rest of my life to try.

Long Beach has offered me half a million people within 8 travle miles, something I cherish after driving 25K+ miles/yr in OC, never leaving the county. This is for contractor type of work. Now, I drive 3-4K business-wise.

There is some 2nd generation oil and shipping money here, but not like some other areas nearby. Then, there's the new money. That's the rub.

No class whatsoever. Just like on TV.

Grady, thanks man. I was on that thought already as I wrote, "In fact, I've made a decision to move to a 964 or 993 after this one, if it becomes viable. That's the only genteel thing I can think of that I like." I could have more than one, actually. A 60's Ferrari, an early 911 coupe and a later 90's something 911 would be all the "gentility" I would ever need.

Pat, I hear ya. I lived in AL for one year. My wife is from the South. Many a true lady have come from the South. I'm pickin' up on what you're puttin' down.

[HardDrive]

I have experienced many world pleasures. My wife and I are comfortable with our income and investments.

But ultimately, the finest moments in life are very cheap.

Deer hunting with my father in Northern Michigan.

Playing soccer with my daughter with the trees bursting with fall color.

Making love.

Material goods are nice. I think people who say they don't matter are full of baloney. But you should view them for what they are: Amusements.

[djmcmath]

This "happy place" you seek really is a state of mind, Grady's dead-on. My parents have essentially no money, but live comfortably on a hillside in North Idaho. Happiness is fresh espresso in the mornings (I built the espresso machine for them), while watching the fog melt out of the valley below. Happiness is the pain easing out of your bones in front of the fire while watching Hogan's Heroes (or Andy Griffith, or whatever), after a long day of good manual labor. Happiness is finding a good deal at the local St. Vinnie's.

No, money sure doesn't buy happiness. But then, happiness isn't semantically what you're looking for; I think it sounds more like contentedness. Someone wiser than I once wrote: "I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation." Sadly, he never really elaborated on the concept, so the rest of us are left in the dark.

[nostatic]

I spent all day yesterday at a Buddhist training/retreat. All told, about 4 hours of meditation. Wasn't 5-star anything except for frustration at dealing with a devil mind and wants/desires that never are quenched. When it was done I was exhausted and my body hurt. I took home two things:

1. every week/day/moment is a fresh start
2. everything is workable

Richness is found in the oddest places, and beauty is found everywhere, especially where there is no fear. Take a read here:

http://www.shambhala.org/about_shambhala.html

And Pema is great:

http://www.shambhala.org/teachers/pema/

As is Thich Nhat Hanh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thich_Nhat_Hanh

[lendaddy]

What'd that run ya?

[nostatic]

a lot less than you probably lost betting football today

[m21sniper]

Originally posted by milt
sniper, upper class is reserved for the very, very wealthy and properly developed (schooling, finishing, etc.) individuals that have mostly a legacy and a lot of connections. Paris Hilton could have been one of those. John Kennedy JR. was one. Everyone else is middle class. Upper middle class, lower middle class, it 'is the biggest class and way beyond the majority belong in it.

There are country clubs and then country clubs. Some, are pretty inaccessible, no matter how much money one has. Community standing would actually be more important to join. I'd say the country club that fed me every Sunday evening during my youth was definitely middle class. I have no interest in that scene. I don't play golf anymore either, although, I taught my wife a pretty good swing!

I would say those are social elites. We have very, very different definitions of the classes, but it's no biggie, doesn't really matter.

[lendaddy]

Originally posted by nostatic
a lot less than you probably lost betting football today

Hey now, I cleared $40 today......but alas I was not enlightened

[Zeke]

Wait....some don't seen to understand. To begin with, one has to know the definition of genteel: "having an aristocratic quality or flavor : (stylish) b : of or relating to the gentry or upper class c : elegant or graceful in manner, appearance, or shape d : free from vulgarity or rudeness" courtesy of Merriam-Webster online


We might be talking about a state of mind, but it's not a meditative state, eh? And not simple loving moments with family. Being genteel is a feeling of well being, no doubt, but there is certainly some intrinsic value involved. Using the playing soccer with the daughter example, the only thing intrinsic I can see there is the ball. Or the field.

A little snob appeal has to be invoked here. Handled well, there is nothing wrong with snobbery, AFAIC.

[Moses]

Originally posted by nostatic
Richness is found in the oddest places, and beauty is found everywhere, especially where there is no fear.

Plus, when you die, on your deathbed, you will receive total consciousness." So you got that goin' for you, which is nice.

[nostatic]

sell Bushwood?!?!?!