1975 Rolls Royce Silver Shadow - tell me about it

[the]

My dad, who was kind of a car guy a long time ago, but has been too busy the last couple of decades, now has time on his hands. He has a friend who has a '75 RR Silver Shadow that he is interested in buying to fix up, something he and I would work on together.

These things obviously don't have huge value. He's looking at $5,000 or so.

I don't know much about the car yet, other than it may have been driven very little, or none, in the past 10 years.

My initial reaction is a car like that could be a bad deal even if it were FREE. My gut says that if it is true the car has not been started or driven, to just pass on it. I could see a ton of headache, and $30,000 later ending up with a $15,000 car that has little to no cool factor.

What's the general price range for these, the biggest things to look out for, and the very "low" price value for a complete, non-running (I'll assume non-running) '75? Is $5,000 low enough that we could get out relatively unscathed if we can't get it running fairly quickly and want to throw in the towel?

Also, any good websites?

[Sonic dB]

At 60 MPH, the loudest noise comes from the electric clock.

[Hugh R]

Old friend had one of that vintage, he said the air ride (I think) suspension was a pain and expensive. Can't help more than that.

[Nostril Cheese]

It's old and British

nuff said

[dd74]

And let's not forget, RRs are a favorite of Flip Wilson...

[speeder]

God, I forgot about that plate. he really got the only cool one, didn't he?

[Sonic dB]

I was checking out the Rolls' on Ebay the other day.
Most were LHD models w/ spartan interior guages
They did have a nice pull out park bench thing in the
dashboard though.

[epbrown]

I owned one up until a couple of years ago,* and I plan to get one again, possibly later this year. The model is much-maligned, but due to come into its own on the classic market, imo. Some analyst are turning around on it as well.

That said, I don't think any project Silver Shadow is worth saving, especially a car between 1974 and 1976. An engine rebuild could run as much as 20 grand, and a used engine would be about 10. The hydraulic brakes and leveling are not that problematic, but years of disuse will mean a lot of work - getting it done would be 2 or 3 thousand, I did it myself with $600 in parts. Because Rolls-Royces are rare, finding shops to work on them can be difficult. However, once you know them well, a lot can be done by the average mechanic at a Shell station. I've walked some through it and all were surprised how straightforward a lot of it is. Personally, I'd rather maintain a Silver Shadow than a 90s 7-series, S-class, or Jaguar.

If your dad is interested, finding a good Shadow and taking care of it would be much cheaper. You can still find good cars for mid-teens, excellent ones for low to mid 20s. The best place to look remains the RROC newsletter, but you can find cars listed in Hemmings, www.cctol.com, and of course eBay.

epbrown

* My old car, SRX 1327 is in the auction listings of Sports Car Market's January 2007 issue, Kruse Auction. The guy that bought it from me retired to Australia and the person he sold it to just auctioned it for $19,000. I bought it on eBay for $6700, but the next owner did a cosmetic resto.

[svandamme]

apparently they are great fun to drive into swimming pools...

[nota]

put a hemi in it
with a big supercharger sticking out the hood

[tabs]

Mr Brown forgot to mention contamination of the Brake/Leveling System. If that has occured run don't walk. If Mr Brown had not mentioned it I would have said PASS. Parts are expensive and some might be impossible to get. One thing about the Shadows is that they were made in enough quanity that parts should be available.

BTW: I owned a 76 LWB Shadow..

[epbrown]

Originally posted by nota
put a hemi in it
with a big supercharger sticking out the hood

Practical Performance Car magazine currently has a Silver Shadow track car - took it to the Nurburgring last issue, and they're adding a turbo as their next project. Given the rebuild cost, lots of Shadows have had Chevy crate engines installed as well. The Silver Shadow was built with a lot of GM parts (AC is from Cadillac, the trans is a turbo 350, iirc).

As far as parts availability: remember that RR/Bentley has never had much money for development. The 8-cylinder engine in the Silver Shadow (Britain's first production V8, I've read) was introduced in 1959 in the Silver Cloud and was still in production in 2000 when VW and BMW took them over. I think VW is still using the engine in Bentley cars not based on the Continental GT's W12 twin-turbo. The Silver Shadow fuel system is your basic SU carb set-up until '77, and then a CIS fuel injection system like the 911SC. I got almost all my parts from the local RR dealership. The one time they didn't have it in stock, I got it from a dealership in Indiana.

Seriously, the car isn't as tricky as it sounds. Even the braking system is only a mystery to Americans - it was licensed from Citroen, so Europeans find it much less daunting.

[Wrecked944]

epbrown: How was it to drive? Was RR ownership worth the financial and personal investment? I mean, aside from being quiet, is there any other reason to own a Rolls?

[Dottore]

Originally posted by JanusCole
epbrown: How was it to drive? Was RR ownership worth the financial and personal investment? I mean, aside from being quiet, is there any other reason to own a Rolls?

Also an ex-Shadow owner - albeit only briefly.

Why own one? Well if you dig the whole Britsh leather and walnut thing - that might be a sufficient reason. The smell of the interior is addictive - and hard to explain if you haven't experienced it.

Driving it is a bit like sailing. You tack to the left, and then to the right, and hope the car goes approximately where you want to end up. It's a very regal sort of transport. You don't really drive - you just sort of waft from place to place. If you're arrogant enough you might even imagine that this elevates you above the masses - who merely drive.

I wouldn't have another because of the headaches - but it certainly is a very unique automotive experience.

[epbrown]

Originally posted by JanusCole
epbrown: How was it to drive? Was RR ownership worth the financial and personal investment? I mean, aside from being quiet, is there any other reason to own a Rolls?

As someone that's owned Porsches and BMWs, I've heard questions familiar to everyone on the board: "For the same money, you could get a Corvette\Camaro\STi, etc." We all then launch into discussions about quality and engineering, and say we'd rather own a 20-something Porsche than a 5-year old Corvette.

Those same arguments apply to Rolls-Royce - their engineering focus is different, but they went after their goals with the same dedication as Porsche, BMW, or Ferrari. Sitting in a Silver Shadow, there's nothing you'll look at or handle and say "Wow, that's cheap." Historically, the cars have always cost about the price of a comfortable suburban home, and they live up to it. The carpets are made of quality wool, bound with quality leather, the front seats will rival a comfortable leather armchair in any upscale furniture store, while the rear seat is pretty much a 54" sofa. The switches in my '66 were chromed organ pulls set in a burled wood dash, and the headliner was cloth (though full leather was an option). There are lots of cars you can get for the same money as a Silver Shadow, but none of them will be as well made and luxurious. As with my Porsches, whenever I worked on my Rolls I was always impressed with the thought and care that went into everything I handled.

If your dream car is a 911 2.7RS, this 4800-lb. car with 200 bhp and a 0-60 of 11secs is going to disappoint. As written above, it's made to waft along quietly and comfortably. RR switched to a rack-and-pinion steering system in '77 so the handling's a bit sharper, but it's still more 70s Cadillac than 70s Mercedes-Benz. But if you get one for what it is and use it for what it's supposed to do, it's as pleasurable to own as a Rolex or old Nikon camera.

And for me, the appeal is that like those quality items, it's something I could keep my entire life and enjoy, in spite of more modern fare becoming available.

[Dottore]

Originally posted by epbrown
There are lots of cars you can get for the same money as a Silver Shadow, but none of them will be as well made and luxurious.

Well made and luxurious I grant you. But often not particularly well engineered.

I didn't work much on mine - but I recall standing next to my mechanic on a number of occasions when he would just throw up his hands and swear at the lack of forethought...hoses impossible to get at, screws in places where they couldn't be undone...all that typically British stuff.

[nineoneone]

They were all hand made and assembled. I remember my dad saying that the fenders were hammered into place. All the interior is matched leather or wood down to every detail. Lots of stainless in places it should be. Paint 3 feet thick hand rubbed 27 coats of lacquer, lol looks that way to me.

[Racerbvd]

I would drop a Z06 motor in it and build a clone of the one in Gumball Rally!!!

[widebody911]

Originally posted by Racerbvd
I would drop a Z06 motor in it and build a clone of the one in Gumball Rally!!!

...and then have your friends take pictures of you jumping it with one of your BMX bikes...

[epbrown]

Originally posted by Dottore
Well made and luxurious I grant you. But often not particularly well engineered.

I didn't work much on mine - but I recall standing next to my mechanic on a number of occasions when he would just throw up his hands and swear at the lack of forethought...hoses impossible to get at, screws in places where they couldn't be undone...all that typically British stuff.

I thought mine was a doddle to work on. In fact, I was suprised how easy because early in my ownership, I took the car to a mechanic recommended as an expert in older European cars and he flat out refused to work on it. Poking around over the weekend, wondering what I'd gotten myself in to, I discovered the problem was a $16 part (purchased from the local dealer) that was pretty easy to replace. Mechanics are people to, and I think too many have bought into horror stories about Silver Shadows.

Like a Ferrari, they're built with the idea that rich people that will never work on the car will own them, so it's made without regard to minimizing labor-hours for repairs, but at least with a Rolls every repair instruction doesn't begin "Step One: Remove engine from car."

In the end, it's really just a collection of systems familiar in other cars from the period. The only unique component is the engine, and that's also the most reliable/trouble-free if it's been cared for properly (driven regularly, oil changed, and coolant flushed annually).