The Democrats did this- The Republicans did that

[rammstein]

Why is everybody SO suprised that the very fundamentals of human nature DO in fact exist in politics?

Facts:
1. Everybody is greedy.
2. Everybody does things for personal gain.
3. Everybody likes sex. Its great.
4. Everybody blames other people.
5. Everybody has skeletons in their closet.

For the love of sweet, sweet baby jesus, do we really need all of these "Now the democrats say Blah blah blah, when last year they said blah blah blah" threads?

THEY ARE ALL FULL OF $HIT.

This is the fundamental reason we need to give people as LITTLE power as possible, because the only loser is the American people when the govt gets control of anything. This is why socialism scares the piss out of me. I trust myself to watch out for myself, and nobody else. CERTAINLY no blood sucking bull$hitting politician who claims to have just the right committee to address my needs. Go to the frickin DMV. Just go there. How do you like it there? Now take that same group and put it in charge of health-care. Put it in charge of education. THEY WILL FAIL every single time. Deep down, in your hearts, you know that this is true.

Vote for Angry Rammstein in 2008.

[Dan in Pasadena]

Friggin Republican

[Moneyguy1]

It is far easier to blame others for our own failures than it is to accept responsibility.

[on-ramp]

Originally posted by Moneyguy1
It is far easier to blame others for our own failures than it is to accept responsibility.

but they do say "I'm sorry". they get on tv, apologize, conduct a hearing, an investigation, they write a report, someone publishes a book and makes lot of $ , and life goes on...

[stevepaa]

Only 3 and 5 apply universally. The rest are a mixed bag.

[boba]

Go ahead tell us what you really think, no need to hold back all friends here.

[Moneyguy1]

Or they go on TV with an evangilist, and make an open act of contrition complete with tears.

[rammstein]

Its all sickening. They are just as full of garbage as everybody else you meet in life. Even if a person starts off ok, in order to succeed in government you have to adopt the ways to move up. I will never not vote, but I think this year I am going to start writing in "go to hell". My voice will be heard.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Politicians are scum. Plain and simple. Don't care what label they slap on themselves, they're scum.

[rammstein]

So why do we have threads about how Bush has a more environmentally sound house than Gore?

SUPRISE!!!! Gore is full of $hit! Oh my goodness, how could this be? (Bush is full of it too, don't get me wrong here)

[stevepaa]

Originally posted by rammstein
So why do we have threads about how Bush has a more environmentally sound house than Gore?

Uh, because they can no longer succesfully attack human caused global warming,

so they attack the messenger

[rammstein]

Well, is he or is he not so full of his own feces that its coming out of his ears?

[cowtown]

Originally posted by rammstein
Go to the frickin DMV. Just go there. How do you like it there? Now take that same group and put it in charge of health-care. Put it in charge of education. THEY WILL FAIL every single time. Deep down, in your hearts, you know that this is true.

Vote for Angry Rammstein in 2008.

LOL - so many fail to understand this. They honestly believe a system with no incentives toward improving efficiency can do an awesome job. That "caring about people" or "liking government" can be the sole basis of solid policy.

Doesn't matter whether they're (R) or (D)...the only answer is to put them in charge of the bare essential public good unattainable by the individual...and nothing more.

You've got my vote...you need anyone to hand out pamphlets or something?

[Superman]

Originally posted by cowtown
LOL - so many fail to understand this. They honestly believe a system with no incentives toward improving efficiency can do an awesome job. That "caring about people" or "liking government" can be the sole basis of solid policy.

Doesn't matter whether they're (R) or (D)...the only answer is to put them in charge of the bare essential public good unattainable by the individual...and nothing more.

You've got my vote...you need anyone to hand out pamphlets or something?

I ran a government office for a decade. In that office, we processed something like seventy thousand documents that must be processed in order for contractors to be paid for their work on public works projects. So....as we processed these documents, potentially there were hundreds of millions of dollars in payments to contractors that could be held up if there was a backlog. There were times when there were backlogs. At one point, it was about two months. Think of it. Think of the value of a construction contractor's working capital. Again, this held up hundreds of millions of dollars. In sixty days, we're probably talking about a BILLION DOLLARS.

Now......why do you think we had this problem? Because I was a poor manager? Okay, sure, but besides that. Because my staff was lazy? I can tell you straight up that my staff was anything but lazy or inefficient. They were peerless, frankly. But here's the problem: They were understaffed. Underfunded. The money charged for processing these forms was EASILY enough to ENSURE that turnaround would be no more than three days, max. So are you wondering why those funds were not used to protect contractors' progress payments? Easy. It's a matter of public record. Our budget requests were denied. Now you should be wondering who denied those requests and why. Here's the good part:

The political party you guys like to demonize......approved my buget. That party wanted to get those funds to those contractors quickly and were willing to do what it took to ensure that. The other political party, the one you guys like to defend, the one those very contractors trusted and placed into office......denied my budget. Thereby punishing those contractors who, by the way, supported them. Why? Because the Republicans' hatred for government in general, and this (my office's) regulation in particular, was deep and furious enough that they were willing to deliberately ensure that the entire administrative function was tragically expensive. They wanted to ensure that my office lacked the ability to function properly.

This is not an unusual story. Many of the government offices you guys find frustrating......are inefficient on purpose. Not by any decision or attitude within the administering agency. And not by the liberals who like government and want it to run smoothly. Which it could. I saw first hand how gubmit gets fukked up. It is fukked up deliberately by the elected representatives of people like you who hate government.

Frankly, I look at Republicans like I looked at Fastpat. As traitors. People who want to bring my government down. I saw it with my own eyes. I heard it with my ears. I read it in documents. There is a deliberate agenda among certain legislators to ensure that government offices are inefficient. Those legislators would prefer those government functions be privately contracted. So they can put your tax dollars into their pockets directly. And they're willing to mess up your quality of life in order to orchestrate that.

[cowtown]

Originally posted by Superman
Many of the government offices you guys find frustrating......are inefficient on purpose. Not by any decision or attitude within the administering agency. And not by the liberals who like government and want it to run smoothly. Which it could. I saw first hand how gubmit gets fukked up. It is fukked up deliberately by the elected representatives of people like you who hate government.

Well, at least you're finally admitting that, for whatever reason, government is indeed inefficient.

I'll leave the "people like you " attack unanswered, as I know you're just expressing your irrational anger (i.e. "I look at Republicans like I looked at Fastpat. As traitors.") At some point you'll mature....

One final thought: Does the fact that one "ran a government office for a decade" give one the perspective and judgement to evaluate what is efficient and what is not? You probably know what my answer to that question is.

But then, I'm just one of "those people."

[scottmandue]

I blame all the people who aren't me!

Ramm, are you running with the poopy head party?

[Superman]

Originally posted by cowtown
Well, at least you're finally admitting that, for whatever reason, government is indeed inefficient.

I'll leave the "people like you " attack unanswered, as I know you're just expressing your irrational anger (i.e. "I look at Republicans like I looked at Fastpat. As traitors.") At some point you'll mature....

One final thought: Does the fact that one "ran a government office for a decade" give one the perspective and judgement to evaluate what is efficient and what is not? You probably know what my answer to that question is.

But then, I'm just one of "those people."

I'm 49, Cowtown. I was not always a liberal. Watching the behavior of so-called "conservative" legislators is a big part of what opened my mind. There is a group of legislators in Washington State that are trying to make things run well.......and another group that is actively trying to ensure they fail. When someone deliberately tries to screw up the machinery you and I have paid for, and still pay for, and count on, then yeah. I get angry. And yeah, I wonder about people who are okay with that. You okay with that?

And as for qualifications, I wonder what value I should place on opinions that come from people who have no idea how gubmit works on the inside or where the problems are coming from. They see a long line when they are hoping to renew their driver's license, and they draw all sorts of interesting and ignorant conclusions from that. And then there are the people who are TOLD where the problems come from, and who dismiss that information out of hand because it conflicts with the very simple view they enjoy.

There are legislators who, like you appear to, hate government. You very possibly support them actively. So......don't come whining to the rest of us when your legislators are successful at ensuring those long lines at Department of Licensing.

[hardflex]

One final thought: Does the fact that one "ran a government office for a decade" give one the perspective and judgement to evaluate what is efficient and what is not? You probably know what my answer to that question is.

We'll apply the same logic to the Military guys in here, about the the war, then. Fair enough?

[Lothar]

If people would stop expecting government to solve every problem, thereby abdicating their individual liberties, there would be less government and less to complain about.

The failure of intrusive big government is obvious, yet people keep going back to the same well to get screwed one election after another.

[Seahawk]

Originally posted by hardflex
We'll apply the same logic to the Military guys in here, about the the war, then. Fair enough?

I don't understand your posit: The military is led by civilians, and, as of late, rather poorly.

There is excellence in both government and private industry, sloth as well.

For every poorly run DMV there is an Enron or Enron-lite.

I run a lagre military acquisition office with an annual budget in excess of a billion dollars, soon to much more. I work very closely with industry to, "build things" that the Navy wants to support our folks.

I have been able to recruit very talented civil servants and am slowly working on the less talented. There is a fairly small pool of talent and the other program managers and I fight hard to get and keep them. So it goes that within the larger framework of my organization, NAVAIR, there is a wide range of sucessful enterprises operating alongside NAVAIRs version of a DMV.

The non-governmental companies I work with (a "Who's Who of defense contractors) have all the same issues. I have two seperate contracts with a large, San Diego based mega-defence contractor and the disparity between the two programs is incredible. Same company, same complex: One attracts and retains talent, the other is a pariah. There is only so much talent, folks, I don't care who you are.

It all comes down to management, both in the government and the private sector.