Tokyo Rose...then and now

[pwd72s]

A reminder.

During World War II, the Japanese developed a way to demoralize the
American forces. Psychological warfare experts developed a message
they felt would work, and they gave the script to their famous
broadcaster known as"Tokyo Rose." Every day she would broadcast this same
message packaged in different ways. The Japanese hoped it would have a
negative impact on American GI's morale. What was that demoralizing message?
It had three main points:

1. Your President is lying to you.

2. This war is illegal.

3. You cannot win the war.

Does this sound familiar today?

It is because we are being bombarded by Tokyo Hillary, Tokyo Harry,
Tokyo Teddy, Tokyo Nancy, Tokyo Murtha, etc.,and they have picked up the
same message and are broadcasting it on Tokyo CNN, Tokyo ABC, Tokyo CBS,
Tokyo NBC, etc., to our troops.

The only difference is that they claim to support our troops before
they demoralize them. Come to think of it, Tokyo Rose told the troops she
was on their side, too




(note...I posted this so whoever is doing the one star thing every time I post will have an excuse to do it again )

[scottmandue]

Somehow I think the guys and gals over there don't waste there time watching CNN/ABC/CBS/NBC.

Most of the soldiers I talk to don't seem demoralized at all... although some are snapping after witnessing the horrors of war. Don't know if there is anything we will ever be able to do about that.

[Moneyguy1]

Interesting comparison. I do not completely agree, but I do think had the prez been a bit more "honest and open" re: his agenda, there would most likely be less "opposition" to his actions and plans. His inability to clearly define the mission has been his greatest shortcoming.

Unilaterally invading a sovereign country is an iffy proposition and makes the invader look like AH looked re: Poland and the other European nations, claiming to liberate the citizenry. The rationale for the initial invasion has morphed over the last three years, so where "lying" may be a strong term "misled" may be applicable, and could even be interpretated as he himself was misled. The "You cannot win the war" is an incomplete statement. The war is unwinnable from a simply military standpoint, in my opinion. It will take a lot of diplomacy which seems to be in short supply when one will not interact face-to-face with one's "enemy". Once again, in my opinion, a combination of strength and negotiation will work far better than strength alone. Teddy Roosevelt had it right. "Speak softly but carry a big stick".

I do not like the comparison of those against current operations with Ms. Rose. This is still a free country and we still, at least for now, have the right to voice opposing views. Beware of losing this precious freedom. There are those here that unwittingly advocate totalitarionism and would be happy with a dictator, but only if that dictator shared their political and fiscal philosophy. Careful what you ask for.

Finally, whether it be Democrats or Republicans, when one party has both the White House and the Congress, oversight goes out the window and balance is lost. I love it when there is a split between the two.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally posted by pwd72s
(note...I posted this so whoever is doing the one star thing every time I post will have an excuse to do it again )

Don't worry Paul; you are in good company. There are several of us on the "one star" team. In the childish fashion so typical of liberals today, some one that we have obviously been getting to has decided to be clever in the only way he can. I see the almost immediate one star rating as a badge of honor.

[legion]

Originally posted by Moneyguy1
The war is unwinnable from a simply military standpoint, in my opinion. It will take a lot of diplomacy which seems to be in short supply when one will not interact face-to-face with one's "enemy".

Negotiate with who? Who is there to be diplomatic with?

Further, once the invasion starts, diplomacy is off the table. Diplomacy works best when you are the one wielding the threat of force. It doesn't work so well when you are trying to negotiate the withdrawal of your own military--you are the loser suing for peace. You have nothing to offer in terms of consequences if your terms are not met--and they will be ignored even if a formal agreement is reached.

[MRM]

It is possible to think the president has lied repeatedly and to believe that the war is both worthwhile and winable.

The entire problem with the war has been Bush's refusal to deal with the truth when the news was something he didn't like. As a result, the administration deals with bad news by denying it and trying to spin the facts to convince us that all is well when it isn't. Because the administration is so busy trying to convince us of things that are not true, we have been unable to make a frank appraisal of the situation and take the corrective action necessary. If it is not already too late, the refusal to make the necessary changes in strategy years ago has made the task infinitely more diffcult.

Compare the handling of the various Iraq scandals to the Walter Reed scandal. Once Bush came to grips with the fact that he couldn't deny that our soldiers were being treated badly, he fired the people responible and got people in place who could do the job.

[stevepaa]

SOS
30 years later.

from wikipedia

"The name is associated with Iva Toguri D'Aquino (born Ikuko Toguri, July 4, 1916, Los Angeles, California - died September 26, 2006, Chicago, Illinois). A U.S. citizen by birth who was visiting relatives including a sick aunt in Japan at the time of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, she was unable to leave after the start of hostilities. She was subsequently treated as an enemy alien and refused a war ration card due to her refusal to renounce her American citizenship.[1] "A tiger does not change its stripes" is a quote attributed to her.[1]. To support herself she took work at the Japanese radio show The Zero Hour[2] as a transcriber and later as an on air announcer named "Ann" (for "Announcer") and later "Orphan Ann".[1] Her producer was an Australian Army officer, Major Charles Cousens, who had pre-war broadcast experience and had been captured at the fall of Singapore. Cousens had been tortured and coerced to work on radio broadcasts,[1] as had his assistants, U.S. Army Captain Wallace "Ted" Ince and a Philippine Army Lieutenant, Normando Ildefonso "Norman" Reyes. Captain Ince was also tortured into working for Japanese Radio.[1] Toguri had previously risked her life smuggling food into the nearby Prisoner of War (POW) camp where Cousens and Ince were held, gaining the inmates' trust.[1] Toguri would host a total of 340 broadcasts of The Zero Hour.[1]

After she indicated her refusal to broadcast anti-American propaganda, Toguri was assured by both of them that they would not write scripts having her say anything against the United States.[1] After the war, she was investigated and released when the FBI and the U.S. Army's Counter Intelligence Corps found no evidence against her. "Tokyo Rose" was actually a legend generated by allied military personnel for the amalgam of female broadcasters working for the Japanese government.[1] At no time did Toguri call herself "Tokyo Rose" during the war. Further, true to the word of the two prisoners of war that Toguri worked under, no anti allied propaganda was found in her broadcast.[1] However, upon her request to return to the United States to have her unborn child born on American soil,[1] the influential gossip columnist and radio host Walter Winchell lobbied against her. She was brought to the U.S., where she was charged and subsequently convicted of treason.[2] Prior to her being brought back to the U.S. for trial, her baby was born but died shortly after.[1]

In 1949, D'Aquino was convicted of one of eight counts of treason by the U.S. government.[3] She was given a sentence of 10 years and a $10,000 fine. Her attorney, Wayne Collins, citing the gross unfairness of it, called the verdict "Guilty without evidence".[1] After six years, she was released and moved to Chicago, Illinois, where Chicago Tribune reporter Ron Yates identified her. Yates later went on to discover that Kenkichi Oki and George Mitsushio, who delivered the most damaging testimony, lied under oath.[3] They stated they had been threatened by the FBI and U.S. occupation police and told what to say and what not to say just hours before the trial.[3] On January 19, 1977, she was pardoned by U.S. President Gerald Ford, who also restored her citizenship.[4] She died in a Chicago hospital, of natural causes, on September 26, 2006, at the age of 90.[5][6][2]"


Maybe you deserve no star when you have nothing to support your statements

[stevepaa]

or
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/5389722.stm

Death ends the myth of Tokyo Rose
By Adam Blenford
BBC News



Iva Toguri's trial was one of the most expensive of its time
Iva Toguri D'Aquino, widely known as Tokyo Rose, who has died in Chicago aged 90, remains the only US citizen convicted of treason and pardoned by her country.

When she was convicted by a court in San Francisco in 1949, few worried that the case against her rested almost entirely on the word of two US-born men who worked on a Japanese propaganda radio station during World War II.

A US citizen of Japanese descent trapped in Japan when war broke out, Toguri had worked under their supervision, allegedly broadcasting fictitious propaganda to US troops in an effort to undermine their morale.

Even the FBI would later admit that the station's broadcasts did little harm, and may in fact have raised US spirits.

But according to Ronald Yates, a journalist who would later reveal that the trial witnesses lied under oath, by the time the case came to trial many in the US had been convinced of her guilt.

"There was a lot of racism in America in those days, racism against anybody," he told the BBC News website.

When journalist Walter Winchell told the nation in 1948 that Tokyo Rose was coming home and denounced her as a traitor, a clamour grew for Toguri to be tried, Mr Yates said, despite US officials in Japan having already cleared her of any crime.

"It was an election year, and President Harry Truman was getting a lot of letters from angry voters accusing him of being soft on traitors.

"So he decided to get her."

Golf course revelations

In San Francisco, seven of eight counts of treason were dismissed by the court.

But the testimony of Kenkichi Oki and George Mitsushio was strong enough to win a conviction on the one remaining charge.

The FBI told us we would have to testify against Iva or else

Kenkichi Oki
Trial witness

They told the court she broadcast messages to the US fleet rejoicing in its apparent defeat in battle.

"Now you fellows have lost all your ships. Now you really are orphans of the Pacific.

"How do you think you will ever get home," Toguri was alleged to have said, even though the US had just won a major victory at Leyte Gulf.

She was jailed for 10 years and fined $10,000, but was released after six years for good behaviour.

After her release she settled in Chicago, opened a business and sought to clear her name.

The breakthrough would not come until 1974, when Mr Yates, now a professor of journalism, was posted to Tokyo for the Chicago Tribune newspaper.


Iva Toguri never saw her husband, Felipe D'Aquino, after her trial
Mr Yates already knew of Iva Toguri from Chicago, and took a file on her out to Japan.

"One day I was playing golf with someone and just mentioned her. My golf partner said he knew Tokyo Rose, and he knew she was not guilty," he said.

He was put in touch with Oki and Mitsushio, who eventually disclosed their secret: "One day they just decided to come clean, and told me that they 'didn't exactly' tell the truth in 1948."

Oki said they had little choice. Japanese-Americans living voluntarily in Japan during the war years were seen by some as easy targets once the US won the conflict.

"The FBI and US occupation police told us we would have to testify against Iva or else Uncle Sam might arrange a trial for us too - or worse," Oki told Mr Yates in 1976.

"We were flown to San Francisco from Tokyo... we was told what to say and what not to say two hours every morning for a month before the trial started."

Memorable story

Ronald Yates' reporting in the Chicago Tribune fatally undermined the government case against Iva Toguri.

Other investigations followed, and a year later President Gerald Ford formally pardoned her on his last day in office.

Today, Hollywood producers own the rights to her story and a film adaptation of her life is in the pipeline.

Mr Yates, who has plans for a book recounting the entire story, retains a deep affection for the woman who never quite shook off the myth of Tokyo Rose.

The pair remained close until her death, and Mr Yates was with her when she received an award from the World War II Veterans Committee on her 90th birthday.

According to Mr Yates, Toguri viewed the ceremony as the most memorable day of her life.

"She risked her life in Tokyo in the war, taking medicines and food to prisoners of war. She never wavered in her support for the US," he said.

"And that's the sad thing."

It is sad that you continue to spread lies.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by scottmandue
Somehow I think the guys and gals over there don't waste there time watching CNN/ABC/CBS/NBC.

Most of the soldiers I talk to don't seem demoralized at all... although some are snapping after witnessing the horrors of war. Don't know if there is anything we will ever be able to do about that.

They do not sit there all the time and watch anything but when they are having chow or time off, they do grab a bit of news, and YES they do see this crap on the television.

Tokyo Rose is a direct comparison and the crap that Peloisi and Reid are spewing is just as bad.

[Zeke]

Originally posted by Jeff Higgins
Don't worry Paul; you are in good company. There are several of us on the "one star" team. In the childish fashion so typical of liberals today, some one that we have obviously been getting to has decided to be clever in the only way he can. I see the almost immediate one star rating as a badge of honor.

Too much trouble. I've only rated a dozen threads in 4 years just to skew the rating in my favored direction. To be first is silly to me. I think the admins can see who rates what.

[stevepaa]

Originally posted by Joeaksa
Tokyo Rose is a direct comparison and the crap that Peloisi and Reid are spewing is just as bad.

She did not do anything of a treasonous nature, the government did and so your comparison is apt.

[Tobra]

Steve, you need to take the euphemism "Tokyo Rose" in context. I consider myself to be a pretty well read individual, and I did not know the details you posted. I remember when Ford pardoned her, but was a little kid and did not pay too much attention to details. The government behaved badly, perhaps even in a traitorous way to a loyal citizen, but it certainly is not treasonous.

In this instance, Ms Pelosi in the House, and Ms DiFi in the Senate, are undermining the stated goals of this country. What would you call that?

Oh yeah, I mention those too fine upstanding gals because they both appear to have strayed from the straight and narrow ethically recently.

[stevepaa]

The term "Tokyo Rose" became a US propaganda tool to demonize a loyal citizen. Seems very apt to today's and the Vietnam era attempt by war mongers to demonize those who are anti-war.

Tobra, who makes the stated goals of this country, the President? Or Congress? or the people of the US? This president led us into an unnecessary war, unprepared, ill-equipped and ill-planned and it is your duty as a citizen to voice your objection. To do otherwise betrays the very nature of being American. The president derives his power from the will of the people, which is most directly expressed by Congress. Therefore Congress is the true maker of the stated goals for the country and the President is the administrator to carry them out.

The officially stated goals of the foreign policy of the United States, as mentioned in the Foreign Policy Agenda of the U.S. Department of State, are "to create a more secure, democratic, and prosperous world for the benefit of the American people and the international community."

A minority think the President has a plan to achieve this, the majority of Americans think he has set us back in our endeavors.