Hi-Def DVD- damn standards war!

[Neilk]

It's so annoying that Toshiba and Sony can't agree on a standard format for Hi-Def DVDs. I just saw that Target will only carry Blu-Ray players for the Christmas season and Blockbuster only rents Blu-Ray as well. Great, a Blu-Ray player is $500 when a HD-DVD is 1/2 that! I'd love to get a Hi-Def DVD but I don't want to get stuck with an obsolete player, plus we really like the Blockbuster online program.

This standards fight isn't helping anyone. I'll just sit on the sidelines until some one waves the white flag or dual format players become affordable.

[BlueSkyJaunte]

'Hi-Def'?? What the hell is that? 720×480 should be enough for anybody...

[Rich76_911s]

LG makes a player that plays both formats, don't know how much it costs though. In the end I don't think either format is going to win. Movies are already comming in online, that is the way I see it going into the future.

[island911]

Don't worry about picking the winning standard --neither will 'win'. They will both be replaced by yet another standard before either emerges as the winner.

Techno standards are moving faster and faster. The days of decades-long standards are gone.

IMO

[jriera]

LG BH-100 around $1,200

Until we have better/faster internet connectivity being able to watch HD movies online (no torrents/downloads) still a nice-impractical idea

[island911]

I wasn't referring to internet connectivity standards. I expect the next "DVD" standard will support better frame rate. ... (most) all displays support minimum 2x the current HD-DVD standards. Also, expect even higher resolution to be on the table.

[Drew001]

Originally Posted by Neilk

Great, a Blu-Ray player is $500 when a HD-DVD is 1/2 that! I'd love to get a Hi-Def DVD but I don't want to get stuck with an obsolete player, plus we really like the Blockbuster online program.

This standards fight isn't helping anyone. I'll just sit on the sidelines until some one waves the white flag or dual format players become affordable.

Buy a HD DVD player and you will probably have your obsolete player.
Blu-ray is killing HD DVD. Here are the latest numbers:


The reason you see cheaper HD DVD players is because they are desperate. Blu-ray is gaining momentum and they need to do whatever they can to try and stop that, but they will fail.

Blu-ray is the better format and it will prevail. Blu-ray has much more movie studio support (only Universal is exclusively HD DVD), much more consumer electronic manufacturer support and Blu-ray has much more disc space.

Once Universal weakens due to lost sales and starts releasing Blu-ray discs it will be game over for HD DVD.

Originally Posted by island911

Don't worry about picking the winning standard --neither will 'win'. They will both be replaced by yet another standard before either emerges as the winner.

Techno standards are moving faster and faster. The days of decades-long standards are gone.

IMO

I really don't think we'll see anything new within the next five to seven years.
Most of the studios are behind Blu-ray and it took a lot to get them there. Licensing, digital rights management, content security and distribution deals are very complicated. Anything beyond Blu-ray or HD DVD isn't really on the horizon as far as the content providers are concerned.

Besides, it's taken more than two years for the major studios to switch from DVD authoring (which will continue for a few more years) to Blu-ray and HD DVD authoring.

[island_dude]

BLU-RAY also has a very consumer unfriendly DRM system and is field unpalatable (your DVDs can change the software in your player). I am already sick of the way DVDs try and control what you watch and at what pace. I have a couple that force you to watch the stupid preview commercials no matter what. The BLU-RAY format offers a whole shop of horrors of possibilities in this area. Sony has a really bad reputation as far a protecting consumer interests. Anyone remember the root kit SW installation from their CDs a while back?

I may have to wait this one out.

[island911]

Originally Posted by Drew001

Buy a HD DVD player and you will probably have your obsolete player....
The reason you see cheaper HD DVD players is because they are desperate. Blu-ray is gaining momentum and they need to do whatever they can to try and stop that, but they will fail.....

So you reallly believe that the massive force of SOny Blu-ray will CRUSH the HD-DVD standard to the scrap heap .... recycled heap of history, BEFORE both end up there? ...Seriously?

Ya know, this is not 1982, when corner video stores had to make decisions about which boxes of VHS would sit on their shelves. This is a qtr century later, when Netflix (et al) have warehouses in low rent industrial areas.
You may as well claim that iTunes M4a standard will crush MP3 standard. (note, even iTune fans don't care for the draconian lock-down of the M4a standard ....who's going to like Sony's? --as island_dude points to.)

Furthermore, the cost of goods, for either player or disk, is minuscule in comparison to what they are currently selling for. For Sony to have a chance of disposing of the competition (anytime soon) they will have to be selling their players in the ~$50 category, and their disks below $10. (both do-able ... but of course, both want to sell for what they can)


Either way, those consumers who want to knock out one standard or another --in a "oh, MY standard won / will win" sort of a way, are just plain stupid.

[alf]

Blu Ray=Sony=BetaMax

I really dislike Sony and their BS proprietary standards.

[Drew001]

Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts

Right, I think the primary reason why Blu-Ray is technically leading the charts is because the PlayStations come with them built-in. I'm not sure who uses a PS3 for HD DVD watching though...

-Wayne

Blu-ray is not "technically" leading. It's overwhelmingly beating HD DVD is actual sales. Just one example:

When Disney debuted both Pirates of the Caribbean films on Blu-ray against Warner's dual Matrix box sets on HD DVD. According to Home Media: "The two “Pirates” films sold a combined total of nearly 47,000 units, while the higher-priced “Matrix” sets sold about 13,900 units." So more people purchased BOTH Pirates BDs than purchased any Matrix box set - even the cheaper one. Warner's recent The Departed provides another case in point. By their own admission, the studio sold 58,300 copies on Blu-ray and just 35,300 on HD DVD.

And Wayne, I'm guessing that you meant HD in general in that last sentence and not HD DVD since the PS3 only plays Blu-ray discs and DVDs, but not the HD DVD format.

[Drew001]

Originally Posted by island_dude

BLU-RAY also has a very consumer unfriendly DRM system and is field unpalatable (your DVDs can change the software in your player)....The BLU-RAY format offers a whole shop of horrors of possibilities in this area. Sony has a really bad reputation as far a protecting consumer interests. Anyone remember the root kit SW installation from their CDs a while back?

I may have to wait this one out.

Both Blu-ray and HD DVD use the same DRM scheme called AACS. Blu-ray has an additional layer called BD+ that isn't enabled yet.

99% of consumers are going to buy a disc, play it at home and then put it on the shelf. The DRM in either one of these formats aren't going to effect any of these people.

I know it's really in vogue to hate Sony - and for good reason. They have tried to force many proprietary formats to the consumer, but Sony is not Blu-ray.
Blu-ray is a consortium of motion picture studios, consumer electronics manufacturers, media providers and software companies.

Here's a list of Blu-ray supporters which far outweighs that of HD DVD and that's one of the main reasons that Blu-ray will be the dominant HD format.

[Drew001]

Originally Posted by island911

So you reallly believe that the massive force of SOny Blu-ray will CRUSH the HD-DVD standard to the scrap heap .... recycled heap of history, BEFORE both end up there? ...Seriously?

Yes, I do.

Here's a little part of a long article from Digital Bits about why Blu-ray will win:

Meanwhile, Blu-ray is just as good technically and quality-wise, it has the support of EVERY HOLLYWOOD STUDIO BUT UNIVERSAL, it has the support of the MAJORITY OF HARDWARE MANUFACTURERS, and nearly the ENTIRE computer industry. There are lots of great titles coming out, many more titles are on the way, there are more models of stand-alone players available and they're getting cheaper all the time. Blu-ray Disc is by FAR the smarter choice. If you want spend the safe money, there's your best bet.

Let's look at the studio support side. HD-DVD has just one major exclusive studio supporter: Universal. Blu-ray has FIVE exclusive studios: Disney, Fox, MGM, Lionsgate and Sony. Which exclusive group do you think is more likely to go format neutral first? (FYI, the other major studios - Warner, Paramount, DreamWorks - already support both formats, and New Line has indicated that they'll likely do the same.)

The bottom line remains the same: Any way we slice it, when we look at ALL the facts, we think Blu-ray Disc remains the best bet in this format war, and the safer bet for consumers. That's just the way we see it.

We simply CANNOT and WILL NOT recommend to our readers that they adopt a format that only has the full support of just a HANDFUL of major hardware manufacturers and ONLY A HANDFUL of the Hollywood studios - no matter how cheap the price - when a format of EQUAL quality and FAR GREATER studio and manufacturer support exists.

Simply put: If you're still not quite ready to get into high-def discs, then sit tight a little longer. The prices, selection and features of both hardware and software will all improve in the months ahead. On the other hand, if and when you ARE ready to get into high-def discs... we say Go Blu. It's really a no brainer, folks.

Don't let your hatred of Sony keep you from seeing the obvious outcome.

[nostatic]

what are the porn numbers? That's what'll control it...

[island911]

Originally Posted by Drew001

Yes, I do.

...
Blu-ray has FIVE exclusive studios: Disney, Fox, MGM, Lionsgate and Sony.
..

Don't let your hatred of Sony keep you from seeing the obvious outcome.

Okay.

Which one do you work for? ...and which ones does Sony already own?

I have no hatred for Sony. I'm just saying Sony isn't going to dispose of HD-DVD the way VHS eclipsed Sony's Betamax. ...Sure, Sony is trying hard to undermine competition ... to control the market. After all "Monopoly" is the American way. ...no wait. . .. That doesn't sound quite right.

[MBAtarga]

Originally Posted by nostatic

what are the porn numbers? That's what'll control it...

A Google search returns the first link titled: Adult film industry embracing HD DVD.

The article cites lower costs of producing HD format vs. Blu-Ray.

[berettafan]

i wonder if you pull out PS3 from those pie charts what the change would be.

ditto on sony's tendancy to go their own way on stds. their b.s. memory stick is why i don't own a sony camera.

[WolfeMacleod]

Originally Posted by nostatic

what are the porn numbers? That's what'll control it...

I was just going to say that. Whichever media the Porn Industry adopts is the media that will become the standard.
Betamax woulnd't accept Porn.

[1973911s]

Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts

Right, I think the primary reason why Blu-Ray is technically leading the charts is because the PlayStations come with them built-in. I'm not sure who uses a PS3 for HD DVD watching though...

-Wayne

Most people will tell you the PS3 is one of the best Blu Ray players out today.

I am a HD DVD person, but will get a Blu Ray as there are lots of titles I would like to view.

[Drew001]

Originally Posted by island911

I have no hatred for Sony. I'm just saying Sony isn't going to dispose of HD-DVD the way VHS eclipsed Sony's Betamax.

You are right. It is going to be a prolonged battle, but the consumer is going to suffer because of that.

If you buy a HD DVD player, you must realize that you will never get HD movies from Fox, Lionsgate, MGM, Sony and Walt Disney.
If you buy a Blu-ray player the only studio that you will never see on Blu-ray is Universal.

Do you get that?
That's a huge disadvantage for HD DVD and for all consumers who buy a HD DVD player.
They don't tell you that when you buy one.

Eventually, because of Blu-rays momentum and HD DVDs loss of sales, Universal will switch from an exclusive to also supporting Blu-ray.
That will spell the end of HD DVD.

Sales rankings:
Top 10 HD titles sold


Top 100 HD titles sold


Blu-ray is dominating and will continue to do so.
If anyone is going to get into the HD realm, you should to know the facts in order to make the right choice.
Who has laserdisc players out there? Great format, but there's nothing ever going to be released on LD.
HD DVD is on the same road.

Oh, and porn isn't an issue.
Porn isn't nearly the player it was back in the day when the only place you could get porn was on VHS.
Porn is everywhere and it's free because of the internet.
Porn on Blu-ray will be as freely available as it will be on HD DVD. This is a non-issue.