50 Worst Cars of All Time

[frogger]

From Time.com. Some might be controversial, others are a no-brainer.

http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1658545_1657686,00.html?cnn=yes

[sammyg2]

Lemme see if I got this right, they named the corvair, pinto, gremlin and pacer, but left out the chebby vega?
You gotta be kidding.
Obviously these people don't know squat about cars. They made their list based on appearance and publicity and not mechanical reliability or utility.
The gremlin and pacer were ugly, but were reliable and utilitarian. They worked well. The pinto was a fine economy car and they sold a zillion of them, but they got a bad rep because 1 out of every gazillion of them caught on fire in a rear end collision.
The early corvair was a fine car as long as you kept the air pressures set close to recommended. The later corvairs were very good cars but that Ralph Naderjackass screwed it all up in an attempt to get rich and famous.

As a comparison, the average vega engine had a lifespan measured in months .All you had to do was overheat it once (which wasn't hard to do) and the sleeves would come loose in the block. Then they would leak oil and water and smoke and everyhing else you could imagine. Most unreliable POS I've ever seen that didn't come from Great britain. But it didn't make the list because it wasn't ugly enough.

They should stick to writing stories about Paris hilton and that dead blond bimbo playboy bunny and leave cars to those who know something about them.

[scottmandue]

Lots of great cars on that list, proving Time.com is completely clueless when it comes to automobiles IMHO.

[jcommin]

I had a little trouble with this article too.
The Pinto: POS
Vega: rust bucket and oil burner
Corvair: Actually a great car. Ralph Nader never drove one.
AMC models. Maybe ahead of their time.


The worst in my book: Edsel: ugly, down right ugly
Any early 1st generation Toyota or Datsun
80's GM cars. A dark decade for GM.

[rouxroux]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

As a comparison, the average vega engine had a lifespan measured in months .All you had to do was overheat it once (which wasn't hard to do) and the sleeves would come loose in the block. Then they would leak oil and water and smoke and everyhing else you could imagine.

Sammy, actually it was quite worse than you wrote. The earlier Vega engines did not even HAVE the sleeves. just the aluminum block. It was funny, as we had a '71 notchback that never had a problem, but when I bought a '74 GT, it had a casting hole that wept from the water jacket. The replacement engine they gave me DID have the sleeved inserts, but I just got them to give it to me in crate form, as I dropped a small-block into the Vega, and used the replacement engine in a "Frankenstein" bug-eye Sprite.

[on2wheels52]

I'd give them a 7.5, at least they brought some memories back. The mid 70's Triumph TR7 (could just as well have added the MG line) were on target. As a gas station mechanic I wittnessed a pair self-destruct over a couple of years. I was in the heart of Cadillac country (Palm Springs) but can't recall any Cimarrons. Sevilles I remember, I still rember my fellow mechanic John saying "it looks like it was hit in the back by a freight train". Why no Lincoln Versiles (sp) in the list? We called them $10000 Mavericks. Present wife arrived with an '80 Chevette in '85, it served us well for a few years. Near the end we had front end shock mount trouble, seems the upper mount was the inner fender liner, a few years in Iowa rotted it out. It ended it's service with us was as a three shock vehicle.
Jim

[Dan in Pasadena]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

Lemme see if I got this right, they named the corvair, pinto, gremlin and pacer, but left out the chebby vega?
You gotta be kidding.

As a comparison, the average vega engine had a lifespan measured in months .All you had to do was overheat it once (which wasn't hard to do) and the sleeves would come loose in the block. Then they would leak oil and water and smoke and everyhing else you could imagine. Most unreliable POS I've ever seen that didn't come from Great britain. But it didn't make the list because it wasn't ugly enough.

Sammy, You've got some things right and some wrong here. I bought a brand new Vega GT in 1974 when I was 17 years old. Yeah, yeah, go ahead and offer an opinion on that purchase (I'd probably agree), nevertheless the choices in that price range new in those days was pretty much a Vega, Pinto, Super Beetle, or Opel Manta. I paid $3600 out the door, tax and license included. I couldn't imagine paying over $3000 for a Bug (I should have!)

The Vega did NOT have cylinder sleeves....not until it was rebuilt that is! It had one of the original high silicon content aluminum blocks (they HAD to use the casting plants they'd built for production of the recently Nader-killed Corvair). They used a honing process that was SUPPOSED to remove the aluminum and leave the pistons to essentially ride on a film of silicon. Didn't work consistently in practice. Also, a BIG problem was the head had the upper part of the valve stem down deep in a casting hole. The valve stem had a little O ring type seal on it which quickly hardened and was more or less useless so once that happened, oil would drip down the valve stem int othe combustion chamber and the engine would burn oil. That was a big problem because if you weren't diligent as hell you'd be running nearly out of oil quickly. It BARELY had a 5 quart capacity. Once one quart was in the top end, one in the filter and one was in the crankcase if you were a quart down (or more) from not checking constantly, you had only one more quart or less coursing through the engine!

Now, mine was METICULOUSLY maintained. It was waxed EVERY time I washed it and I washed it at the very least, weekly. I blew excess water out of cracks, etc. I babied the hell out of that car...it rusted anyway around the hatch window. It pains me to agree they were lousy cars. Mine was a lot of fun and looked great but in truth it was a pretty bad car.

P.S. STILL glad I didn't buy a friggin Pinto. Wish I'd bought the Manta.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

"Biturbo" is, of course, Italian for "expensive junk." At least, it is now, after Maserati tried to pass off this bitter heartbreak-on-wheels as a proper grand touring sedan. The Biturbo was the product of a desperate, under-funded company circling the drain of bankruptcy, and it shows. Everything that could leak, burn, snap or rupture did so with the regularity of the Anvil Chorus. The collected service advisories would look like the Gutenberg Bible. The only greater ignominy was the early 1990s Maserati TC, a version of the Chrysler Le Baron (a flaccid, front-drive, four-cylinder loser-mobile) with the proud Mazzer Trident on the nose. Finally, sir, have you no shame?

LOL! LOL! LOL!!!

[grudk]

I stopped reading after the Model T. To include it in a list of 50 worst cars means they have no concept of automotive history. Their rationalization is absurd.

[hardflex]

while their sense of Automotive History may be suspect, their writing is great. It had my laughing loudly at a few, such as this, about the MGA

Along the way, somebody decided my little car was anemic — hey! I resent that! — so MG offered an optional high-performance engine with dual overhead cams, thus the "twin cam." It was a leaking, piston-burning, plug-fouling nightmare of a motor that required absolute devotion to things like ignition timing, fuel octane and rpm limits, less the whole shebang vomit connecting rods and oil all over the road.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Agree with a good number, disagree with some.

[Les Paul]

He said the Corvair had a 4 cylinder like the Bug. Yea, he knows his stuff.

[lm6y]

The reason the model T was one of the 50 worst, is because it let us consume fossil fuels.

"A century later, the consequences of putting every living soul on gas-powered wheels are piling up, from the air over our cities to the sand under our soldiers' boots."

Would have been a much better read if they would have left the politics out, but Time just could not help themselves.

There were several other digs I noticed too.

[kstar]

Reading this thread reminded me of the Bricklin. Every one I saw when I was growing up was always falling apart - haven't seen one on the road in twenty years or so.



FWIW.

Best,

Kurt

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by lm6y

The reason the model T was one of the 50 worst, is because it let us consume fossil fuels.

"A century later, the consequences of putting every living soul on gas-powered wheels are piling up, from the air over our cities to the sand under our soldiers' boots."

Would have been a much better read if they would have left the politics out, but Time just could not help themselves.

There were several other digs I noticed too.

I agree it'd be nice if they could have left the politics out, but I think they're actually right on this one. Few inventions have singly led to more destruction than the automobile. I love cars, don't get me wrong, but to simply turn a blind eye to the terrible effect they've had on our planet (especially with the multiplier of rampant overpopulation) would be kind of ignorant.

The comments about the stupidity of the Explorer Excursion and (especially) the H2 I completely agree with. Big, bland, dumb.

It's pretty obvious these guys are not terribly fond of GM also. . .

[sammyg2]

At the same time the gasoline powered vehicles were being developed, there were diesel powered vehicles. And steam powered vehicles. And alcohol powered vehicles. I'm not sure but there may have been electric vehicles.
The gasoline powered vehicle succeeded where the others fell by the roadside.
WHY? because it made more sense. it was economical. It was powerful. It was convenient. It was reliable (when compared to some of the others).
Sure you can sit here today and say it was a bad idea, but it succeeded because it was a GOOD idea. It worked better, so they built it. The model T and model A just took it and made it more available to the masses.

Oh, and saying that the automobile is responsible for terrible destruction or damaging the planet is hogwash IMO.
Scare tactics that are politically and monetarily motivated and based on false science, absurd conclusions and assumptions.
The automobile has done much more good for mankind than harm.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

No, I'm saying over-use of it was damaging to the planet. The advent of automobiles created a lot of good things - it allowed cities to become more spread out for one thing, rather than slums and tenement houses that were packed on top of each other. On the one hand this was good. On the other, it gave rise to urban (and suburban) sprawl, but I blame unchecked human reproduction for this more than the automobile or any technology per se.

Virtually all problems boil down to one simple truth - there are too many damn people on the planet. Way too many.

If our numbers were more sustainable and supportable, the negative effects of technology wouldn't be multiplied so much and it wouldn't be nearly as bad.

Back on subject, I think overall cars have been a zero-sum game. The bad aspects are more-or-less offset one-for-one by the good aspects.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by Les Paul

He said the Corvair had a 4 cylinder like the Bug. Yea, he knows his stuff.

He said that?

I am surprised they did not put Tucker on the list because they did not make that many cars. I had a Pinto and a friend with a Chevette. Reliable, cheap transportation. Had a buddy with a Gremlin, V-8, standard shift and blue jean upholstery, even had Levis tags on it. Pretty great car really, though kinda ugly. Everyone I know with a V-8 Vega loves it, they never went long on the stock motor.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Guy I knew back in high school built a V8 Vega - scary fast car. Modified Chevy small-block, 383 cid, nitrous, radical cam, all kinds of toys that for the time period were very "hot". I think he was putting down over 350 hp at the wheels, which in 1987-88 was substantial.

[911pcars]

They could have easily expanded the list to 100. The term "Ugliest" should have been included in the article title.

Random comments:

- Humorous commentary but did notice a few errors (e.g. Corvair 6 cylinders, not 4).

- Vega engines lasted only slightly less than the steel they used for the eventually corrosive-filled chassis. Early Honda Civics had similar rust problems (how many early Hondas do you still see on the road?

- Vega cylinders were unsupported at the top much like some recent BMW engines that also failed because of this design feature.

- Vega cylinders were part of the engine casting and used the same basic Alusil process used by Porsche, MB and BMW engines. Unfortunately, GM's early attempts were prematurely inadequate. The German versions used aluminum alloys specifically concocted for this application and are either separate (Porsche) or included within the block casting.

- You can tell I had a Vega (Corvair too).

- While driving the roads and freeways, I often concentrate looking for examples of good car design among those around me. I have the advantage of personal opinion and passing time to review recent car design. But IMHO, I can say that our streets and highways are filled with more mediocre and mundane examples than one would imagine.

Sherwood