Belichick Mastermind revealed.

89911 · 09-12-2007, 06:23 AM

OK I'll admit I hate the Patriots. Yes they have beat up on the Steelers, and most of the time they were the better team. But if any of this is true, (and I'm not hearing else wise) I've got to really wonder if some of it's not tainted. Did you ever notice how they come up with a completely new game plan at halftime. Hmmmmmm. How there offense adjustments would smother other defenses pass rush so Brady could catch a Gatorade, see his baby being born, and then throw a 120 yard bomb. Hmmmmm. A guess last year, the camera equipment had some problems. Hmmmmmm. What surprises me is how this has brought out the Patriot haters in mass from every angle. Seems Belichick doesn't have too many friends. Even less now. We'll see how this year pans out. They better win the division and go deep into the playoffs, or the jig is up.

Porsche-O-Phile · Porsche-O-Phile's Garage

Whatever.

I'm sure all NFL teams do this kind of thing, and it'll be difficult (if not impossible) to prove anyway.

The Patriots are one of three teams that are going to win this year - Indy, NE or San Diego. Nobody else even comes close to the caliber of those squads.

85eurocarrera · 85eurocarrera's Garage

Yeah, the Giants stole our signals in the NFC championship game when we lost 41 to "donut", a few years back.

lendaddy · 09-12-2007, 06:46 AM

The impact on the game could be anywhere on the spectrum. I'm curious as to the depth of this. Defenses run plays just as offenses do so knowing what "play" they are running exactly would indeed be huge. Evidence of proactive line movements would likely reveal this.

89911 · 07:43 AM

Like I said, We'll see how this plays out. What I do know is no one is running to his defense. They were explaining it on the NFL channel the other night and its more then you think. If the person if filming the actual plays that are being shown on paper (When the defensive coach is huddling around the players with the photos of the offensive positions prior and post snap) and then going back and matching them with the signals being called. Thats pretty bad. It could only be done by someone on the opposing team's sideline and not a spy in the stands or on the other side. If he is so great, would he really have to stoop to this. Or is this what gave him the edge. Certainly wouldn't hurt.

lendaddy · 09-12-2007, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 89911

Like I said, We'll see how this plays out. What I do know is no one is running to his defense. They were explaining it on the NFL channel the other night and its more then you think. If the person if filming the actual plays that are being shown on paper (When the defensive coach is huddling around the players with the photos of the offensive positions prior and post snap) and then going back and matching them with the signals being called. Thats pretty bad. It could only be done by someone on the opposing team's sideline and not a spy in the stands or on the other side. If he is so great, would he really have to stoop to this. Or is this what gave him the edge. Certainly wouldn't hurt.

I could see this being orchestrated by one or two players before the coaching staff to be honest.

Z-man · Z-man's Garage

Is there any talk of taking away their win over the Jets last week? If it was proven they they were cheating and thus giving the Pats an unfair advantage, you would think it would be fair to punish them with a defeat instead of a win.

Then again, I'm a Jets fan, and I'll take a win any way I can get it!!!

-Z

lendaddy · 09-12-2007, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z-man

Then again, I'm a Jets fan...

-Z

I thought Jets fans were just rumor and folklore, like the yeti

gassy · 09-12-2007, 07:59 AM

They'll take away a few draft picks next year but it won't matter.

Z-man · Z-man's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by lendaddy

I thought Jets fans were just rumor and folklore, like the yeti

Just go to an at home Jet's game, and root for the opposing team.

I am sure you'll be getting a lot of Yeti foot right up yer....ascot...

-Z

on-ramp · 09-12-2007, 08:33 AM

the Patriots don't need to cheat to win. they work too hard to win.

lendaddy · 09-12-2007, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by on-ramp

the Patriots don't need to cheat to win. they work too hard to win.

Eric 951 · 09-12-2007, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by on-ramp

the Patriots don't need to cheat to win. they work too hard to win.

working hard at cheating.

belicheck is a pompous ass and this taints everything the pats have done since his arrival.

New England Cheaters.

Jim Garfield · 09-12-2007, 08:49 AM

I really don't see how this is such a big deal, teams would be stupid not to try and figure out the other teams hand signals. The college teams counteract this by having three or four guys sending signals - obviously only one is the right one and only the guys on that team know which guy to watch.

Mule · 09-12-2007, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by on-ramp

the Patriots don't need to cheat to win. they work too hard to win.

That's why they made them cut Tom Shaw from the payroll.

Dude, just like it's impossible to be right all the time, in theory at least, it's impossible to be wrong all the time too. You seem to be blowing that to smithereens.

Porsche-O-Phile · Porsche-O-Phile's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z-man

Then again, I'm a Jets fan, and I'll take a win any way I can get it!!!

If you're really a Jets fan, you NEED to!

This is much ado about nothing. The Patriots will still easily be one of the top tier teams in the league.

What's next? They going to mandate big giant sheets in front of each teams' bench so the opposition can't see what they're doing back there? This is inconsequential.

BTW NE by 10 this coming weekend.

sammyg2 · 09:29 AM

wah

I have to ask, does anyone out there actually doubt that every single team in the league doesn't do the exact same thing?
Why do you suppose that every single coach in the league (that isn't working for the jets) covers his mouth when he sends in a play?

In baseball, reading the coaches signals has been part of the game as long as I can remember. That's why the coaches give so many complicated signals, so the other team can't read them. They also change the signals during the course of the game.

If the jets coaches are dumb enough to give signals that are easy to read, then it's their problem and not the patriots.
IMO this is not cheating at all, it's called playing the game, It is just being smart (or not depending on which side of the field you are on). If it's visible out there in the open then it's fair game.

Now there was a scandal a few years ago that was completely different. Seems the home team was caught tapping into the opponent's signal from the booth to the sideline to the quarterback so they could hear everything that was said or heard through their headphone/mic system. The dumbasses forgot to make it a one-way survelance and they acidentally keyed their mic early on in the game and got caught. Now that's cheating.
They took away the headsets from both teams for the remainder of the game and then the NFL covered it up hush hush to avoid the bad publicity. Lots O'people lost their jobs and were banned from the NFL for life but it barely made the news and then only as rumor or unsubstantiated and denied accusations.

before you ask, I heard all about it second hand. My brother is friends with a guy who was a player on one of the teams, and even though the player had been forced to sign a letter of non-disclosure he told my brother all about it. If he got caught talking about it he would get fined big time and suspended but he had been injured and was already out of the league at the time so there was little they could do to him.

One of these days it will prolly end up in someone's biography.

PS the only time you would ever catch me rooting for the jets would be if they were playing the raiders.
I don't necesary dislike the raiders, but I hate the raiders fans. Bunch of low-life gang member criminal wanabees (with the exception of present company of course).
PPS I'm not a fan. Fan is short for fanatic and I'd be ashamed to be fanatical about a silly sports team.

Mule · 09-12-2007, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Garfield

I really don't see how this is such a big deal, teams would be stupid not to try and figure out the other teams hand signals. The college teams counteract this by having three or four guys sending signals - obviously only one is the right one and only the guys on that team know which guy to watch.

Steroids aren't a big deal either, except they have rules against it.

lendaddy · 09-12-2007, 09:34 AM

Players on the field have always tried to interpret signals, this is no big deal. If you have a guy taping the signals then extrapolating their exact definitions at halftime then finally relaying them to the field play by play in the second half... well that's a major problem. Assuming that is what was happening.

Porsche-O-Phile · Porsche-O-Phile's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mule

Steroids aren't a big deal either, except they have rules against it.

I agree - on this one I fully think Rodney Harrison should have been suspended (which he was). Similarly, NE should get penalized for this if it's proven. Fair enough.

Guarantee every other team (and probably NE too) will still be doing this come Sunday, they'll just be more careful to not get caught.