Continental, Lycoming, Corvair and Prosche

[daepp]

Is their a link here? I know Mooney used a Porsche engine on a limited basis, but that's not what I'm talking about.

These engines are all too similar to not be related somehow. Flat opposed, split case, etc. Did they all license from Porsche?

Anyone know which evolved first? Wasn't Porsche using its flat engines while the aircraft industry was still using radials and in-lines?

[Joeaksa]

Continental and Lycoming were making both radial and horiz opposed air cooled engines long before Porsche was in business.

That said, the engines are very much alike in many ways and it would not be a stretch to assume that the old man had seen a horiz opposed aircraft engine and decided to incorporate it or its ideas into his cars.

The early radial engines were very different in that the entire engine assy turned, not just the crankshaft and the prop was bolted to the engine. Later ones were changed where the engine was bolted to the airframe and only the crankshaft moved the prop. This style of engine was used up until the last prop/piston fighters then started to lose favour to the jet engines.

[daepp]

All unrelated???

[rouxroux]

...and many companies build V8's as well. Just a good, basic design.

and don't forget, Chevrolet did the 6cyl. a few years ahead of Porsche.

[rouxroux]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

Continental and Lycoming were making both radial and horiz opposed air cooled engines long before Porsche was in business.

That said, the engines are very much alike in many ways and it would not be a stretch to assume that the old man had seen a horiz opposed aircraft engine and decided to incorporate it or its ideas into his cars.

I guess you could say he was a German Preston Tucker.

[tcar]

Originally Posted by rouxroux

...
and don't forget, Chevrolet did the 6cyl. a few years ahead of Porsche.

Beat me to it... Corvair.

[cashflyer]

Some early engines, such as the Continental A-40, did not have a split case.

Continental engines were also used in tanks and cars - such as checker cabs.

The radials in which the engine turned were called rotary radials. They produced almost unmanageable amounts of what you would know as torque-steer. Some companies today still produce aircraft using fixed radial engines.

[tcar]

The Tucker, in 1948, had a flat 6 air-cooled Franklin helicopter engine that was converted to water cooling.

[304065]

Continental A-40, 1931.

VW beetle dates from late '30s.

[cashflyer]

Originally Posted by john_cramer

Continental A-40, 1931.
VW beetle dates from late '30s.

I was pointing out that not all boxer type engines have a split case.

Originally Posted by daepp

These engines are all too similar to not be related somehow. Flat opposed, split case, etc. Did they all license from Porsche?

[URY914]

[URY914]

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by URY914

Sweet, Porsche Mooneys!!!!

[URY914]

It's all about knowing where to look...

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by cashflyer

I was pointing out that not all boxer type engines have a split case.

Believe that the A-40 is the only horiz opposed Continental aircraft engine that did not have a "split case." It was just too much hassle to work with the solid case and every subsequent engine that they produced split the case.

Interesting tidbit of information... what is used to seal the two cases together on early four banger Continental aircraft engines?

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A very fine silk thread is used between the two case halves to seal them. No sealant, gasket or the like is used, just the thread. Do not know of any other engine in the world that uses this method.

[Tim Hancock]

I use the double strand of silk thread on Lycoming also with a very light film of sealant to hold it in place.

[Normy]

The reason for the horizontally-opposed engine? It allows better air-cooling without increasing frontal area drastically. This is why the majority of aircraft flat engines use a pushrod valve train- it interferes less with cooling air flow. The 911 motor with its' SOHC heads and cam chains works because it has a cooling air fan, something that aircraft engineers want to avoid.

Radials are very light for their power, and quite rugged, but they have enormous frontal area. The V-12 engines used in WWII fighters were superior from an aerodynamic standpoint, but they were heavy and they had the "achilles heel" of liquid cooling.

[cgarr]

This is one sweet set up! Note the twin mags running right off the cams.

[TimothyFarrar]

Originally Posted by daepp

Is their a link here? I know Mooney used a Porsche engine on a limited basis, but that's not what I'm talking about.

These engines are all too similar to not be related somehow. Flat opposed, split case, etc. Did they all license from Porsche?

Anyone know which evolved first? Wasn't Porsche using its flat engines while the aircraft industry was still using radials and in-lines?

Related in that both early air cooled porsche and general airplane prop motors are from the same era of engine design strategies. Aircraft engines really haven't changed that much because of regulation, it's simply too expensive to do a new design (and thus wouldn't be profitable for anyone to do so).

[kach22i]

FYI: BOXER ENGINES
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This one is cool.
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