Shimano Ultegra VS. Campagnolo Centaur....help me bike heads.

[HardDrive]

I am looking for a new bike.

I was planing on getting a Specialized Roubaix Elite. The frame is beautiful, and provides a superior ride. Those little 'zertz' shock absorbers aren't just a gimmick. They really work.

But given the price, the parts list is pretty lame. Alex wheels? Common....junk.

So my LBS (Recycled Cycles, Seattle) has built up a couple off Surly frames with a damn nice component list. Beautiful bikes. Not light to be sure, but that steel is smmmooooooooooth.

They want $1600 for a the bikes. One if full Ultegra, the other full Centaur.

This bike is for training/light touring, not racing.

I have never ridden a Campy bike, but it took me all of 2 minutes to dig the setup. Shifting seems to be very positive, and the fact that you can skip down multiple gears is nice.

But I'm not to familar with Campy. Is getting parts difficult? Is it difficult to find wheels with Campy hubs?

Remove my ignorance by answering me these question three:

1) Does $1600 seem over the top for the bikes I am describing?

2) Do you feel Campagnolo gear is better than Shimano?

3) Would it be a better idea to get the Specialized, and slowly upgrade?

Thank you.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

I'm not as familiar with the Campy Centaur line but I just got done building a LeMond Zurich for my wife with full Ultegra 6600 components - they rock. Very solid, precise and well-made. Honestly if you took the labels off them and sat them side-by-side with a lot of my DuraAce stuff, I'd have trouble telling the difference. They're very good components. Centaur is kind of Campy's mid-to-high-end model, not quite Record, but good.

Parts are parts. You can find Campy stuff easy enough if that's your preference. I'd test ride both and see which one you like better. I went with Shimano since the frame came with a front deraileur and Flight Deck brifters, otherwise I'd have had the same dilemma.

Try bikeforums.net. Good site.

[cantdrv55]

One of our bike club members have the Specialized you mentioned. Beautiful bike. He can't say enough about those Zerts. I thought they were gimmicky also but he is so persuasive since he drops me each and every time. Those pieces don't seem degrade the frame's stiffness. Very efficient.

No experience at all with Campy but my bike's Ultegra FD and RD works flawlessly and sooo smoothly.

[nostatic]

Surly is made overseas and the frames aren't that expensive. $1600 seems high to me. If you want a steel frame/bike look used. That being said I'm going to get one of the new Salsa Cassaroll frames. At $550 for frame fork (Taiwan build) it is a bargain.

I don't know anything about the Specialized but have the new catalog here as we just bought a new mtn bike for my son. I'll read up on them.

[Jim Bremner]

shimano fails = replace the whole unit

campy fails = replace a spring

I like the feek of the shifting of the campy

I had planned on building a Soma Smoothie, with Campy Centaur and IRD carbon for and bars just prior to my motorcycle wreck

I might build it up shortly

[dd74]

$1600 is not bad for an Ultegra-spec bicycle. For that price, I'd hit it just for the parts and get a better frame later.

As to how Ultegra compares with Centaur, I've been told their quality is similar. All I really know is I have about 10,000 miles on my Ultegra, and it hasn't missed a beat yet.

With that said, the caveats are in the details. As I understand it, gear ratios are limited with Shimano (Ultegra and Dura-Ace), so you should consider that depending upon where you'll ride and your level of fitness. Campagnolo may have more gear choices. I also heard one or the other (Shimano or Campy) can't be speed-shifted through their gears (skipping gears?) in their current model - which would be a drag when climbing then quickly descending.

As an alternative, I'd also look into SRAM as an alternative, which is made here in good ol' California (I think).

As to the frame...hmmm...well Taiwan and China are truly producers I try to avoid with bicycles. I've known too many Colnago and Pinarello riders who pay a lot of money only to break their bottom brackets or stays from improper TIG welding and/or assembly. When you're ready, there are many deals to be made on year off model that are true Italian-frame bicycles. For instance, this Cinelli frame...

...retails for about $1,400-$1,800, but was being sold around August for $650.
I bought one to replace my LeMond Zurich, and so far is the best frame I've ridden in over 20 yrs.

[nostatic]

If you get the right guy welding, you're fine. The Salsa bikes are done at a small shop in small batches over in Taiwan. Rivendell frames are made that was as well. I've seen crappy workmanship from bikes built everywhere...just depends.

I had a Campy setup on my VaMoots many years back. I like it a lot better than the Shimano STI as I don't like the swinging brake lever. I eventually settled on barcons (old school) and ditched all integrated solutions.

[Joe Bob]

Campy.....it's like comparing a Honduh and a Porsche. Campy is timeless, will last a lifetime. I also have a LeMond Zurich a combo steel and CF frame with the Campy Chorus Grupo. This is my last bike, no need to buy another short of an accident or loss due to theft...but I never let it out my sight except when in the garage...

[dd74]

Originally Posted by nostatic

If you get the right guy welding, you're fine.

Very true. And less and less do I discount frames made in Taiwan or China - but that's for the average rider.

The problem is the failure rate for serious cyclists on serious name hardware like those I mentioned. One would expect that on a Colnago, Pinarello or Bianchi that they can descend and sprint at 40-50 mph w/o their hardware failing them.

Aside from having a frame custom made, I think the best bet is to investigate the manufacturer and exactly what frames they make locally and which ones they license to have made overseas.

This is a good starting point:
http://www.virtualitalia.com/sports/bike_manuf.shtml

[dd74]

Originally Posted by mikez

I also have a LeMond Zurich a combo steel and CF frame with the Campy Chorus Grupo.

Where's your carbon on that frame? Mine was 853 w/ a carbon fork. I liked mine for its weight, but found it to be the most dangerous frame I've ever ridden. Its handling was so flexy in the back, I was afraid to sprint or descend with it.

Ultimately, I thought the thing to do to correct was replace the carbon fork with steel to even out the rear, but by then I found the Cinelli. Maybe it's the elongated top tube on the LeMonds, or possibly a rider needs to be sized one size smaller than with other frames.

[k9handler]

Shimano was on most of my bikes, but Campy Record was my favorite after some rides on a buddies bike.

[greglepore]

Campy is available. The usual issue is used wheels-many more Shimano than Campy, altho honestly, 10 spd Shimano cogs will shift in a Campy setup-ie you can use Shimano wheels and cogs. Campy shifters need spring replacement every 7k or so, not a big deal really, and are rebuildable. Shimano is not. Otherwise, I doubt you'd see any real difference besides feel.

[deathpunk dan]

The Roubaix Elite is a SWEET bike for its price point. The zertz make a big difference. I only know because some friends of mine have a small bike shop and let me borrow one of those models with the elastomer zertz in the fork and rear triangulate. There was a noticeable improvement in ride quality over my Specialized S-Works E5 Aerotec frame.

[Tim Hancock]

I think next week I am buying a "like new" '06 Specialized Roubaix Expert from my uncle for $1500 (it was my aunt's and my uncle just upgraded himself, his wife and daughter with Scott CR1's with all DuraAce). The Roubaix "expert" comes with Dura Ace rear DR and the rest is Ultegra. Probably more bike than I need starting out, but I can't pass up the "like new bike" (under 500 miles) from my unkle at that price complete with pedals and my choice of saddles.

Still plan to build my own steel frame someday, but this should get me riding.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Real men ride steel bikes.

[HardDrive]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

Real men ride steel bikes.

My daily driver.....

[JavaBrewer]

My advice in blue...

Originally Posted by HardDrive

1) Does $1600 seem over the top for the bikes I am describing?

No. A good bike & gruppo starts at $1500 these days and goes up dramatically from there. Look for sales if you can and definitely look used. Lots of new bikes are purchased with good intentions that only sit in the garage.

2) Do you feel Campagnolo gear is better than Shimano?

I don't but then like cars, foods, religions, and colors there are the loyalists. I rode thousands of miles on Shimano DA and then on Ultegra with zero issues. Ride them both to get a good feel of what you prefer. Parts availability is a draw.

3) Would it be a better idea to get the Specialized, and slowly upgrade?

You'll end up paying more going that route. Buy the bike you want with the components you want from the start. Again if you go with a used ride your $1600 will get you into higher quality stuff.

Thank you.

[SLO-BOB]

Originally Posted by Jim Bremner

shimano fails = replace the whole unit

While that may be sound advice, I've never had an Ultegra componant fail. I even had a rear derailleur on a mountain bike once. Never an issue. FWIW - I used to race and knew a lot of racers. The sponsored guys had Dura Ace because it was free. The guys that paid for their own stuff had Ultegra. It works. My Giant has it and I need nothing more.

No experience with Campy. I'm sure it's nice.

PS - I've always like Specialized. I wouldn't worry too much about off-label rims, bars, stems, hubs, etc. They all do it. If you shop around, you'll see that at each price point, you get a little more of a group.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

+1.

The only time I've heard of a Dura-Ace or Ultegra component failing was because of a crash. In that case, it doesn't matter what you have, you're replacing the whole thing - campy or shimano.

[jtkkz]

I like shimano.... best to probably test ride both and see which one you like better.... they may possibly feel very similar...