mtn lions - jeff higgins

[charleskieffner]

mtn gatos can still be hunted with dogs. actually i dont know of any outfitter that doesnt use dogs. success rates are high. gato population has skyrocketed in wet areas and gone down in dry areas.

but for the most part anything north of the rim is prime habitat. elk herds have exploded and deer is making a comeback gradually. with all this meat on the table gatos having litters and high survival rates.

if you send me your e-mail i will dig thru my stack and send you a pic showing size of cats here. this particular juan was nailed north of prescott by a car. owner called game and fish and they responded. cat turned on officer despite wounds and officer nailed it dead. the picture and the relationalship objects in the pic will show you we grow some mighty big assed putty tats!

we have one that has been sighted at airport where i work. i have not seen it but i have seen its cat tracks and its a healthy medium size puddy tat. the game here in carefree town limits is beyond belief as well as cave creek. just in my yard the other few nights a pack pod school covey of jave-leaners was cruising thru driving all of our dogs nuts. had a coupla lil footballs(babys) also.

all game has thrived since the rains. also PEEEE-TAA has put pressure and restrictions on trapping so furs are not drawing big bucks and to trap has become a PITA for many so populations of varmints have grown.

a tag is $10 bucks. its the time you dont have a tag that you will see them. sooooooo we will all have tags for puddy tats. this makes it fun for those that dont have an elk tag that we drag along to help get meat out. its the law here you must remove all meat before packing out the rack. if you do it vice versa you are poaching and thats when game and fish take your truck your guns your camping gear your wallet your soul your life and generally fuch it all up for some time to come.

the more rugged the area, the more katz you will find. they love rocky areas like we have right here and for many miles north of us. i literally can throw rifle in truck and in 15-20 minutes go legally hunting for deer pig mtn lion bear if drawn, and all the small game you want.

our unit is conifer forest into juniper going north into gramma grasslands heading towards grand canyon. juniper islands for miles. elk go in to hide and puddy tats nail them. eat their fill and then bury them for later. have found (2) cow elks dispatched this way and i'll tell ya the hair goes up on yer neck when you find that surprise. smell is usually how you find them. but looking for circling BUZZARDOS is always a dead(get it) giveaway for us to go explore and find out whats over dem dar hills!

when varmint calling here it is wise for all young inexperienced grasshoppers to put their back against an area where a cat cannot come up behind you or over you and turn you into kitty poop. this has happened a number of times while blowing varmint calls. kitty -1.......hunter- 0.

[targa911S]

Yes a buddy of mine in Idaho was attacked while taking a whizz in the woods ice fishing. He got the critter off him and it retreated. He got pretty scratched up.

[Joeaksa]

Friend of mine outside of Wickenburg has them in his front yard all the time. He lives just South in the open range and hills area and they are reproducing like mad. They carry a "hog leg" on their hip just in case...

[RoninLB]

Originally Posted by charleskieffner

but for the most part anything north of the rim is prime habitat. elk herds have exploded and deer is making a comeback gradually. with all this meat on the table gatos having litters and high survival rates..

I should have known about all this last year... crap, my loss.






ranger in Sacramento area told me everywhere north to border is infested with cats.

i camped with a gemologist that was hunted by a cat for 3 hours daytime.

Oregun ranger told me their males get to around 125# and have 10-12 sq mi range.

Part time ranger in N Dakota who only knows a little said that cats are being heard of more and more. Also said rumors are 200# males.

I have a series of 5 pics leading to the area where cats come to water up routinely 75yds on other side of stream of my favorite camp in Or.




i think i got most of the slang? I'm from another country.

[Jeff Higgins]

Our population is up here in Washington as well. Problem is, the general public has no effective way to hunt them. We all get the "full meal deal" when buying our tags, which is a deer, elk, cougar, and bear set. The state gives us a good break when buying all four. One would have to get damn lucky to see a cat up here, though, with the nature of our terrain. Hunter success on them is all but nil. Funny, though, the guys running dogs kill just as many in any given year as they ever have. It's just that the state pays them to do it, rather than private hunters. They get labelled as "problem" animals and are quickly hunted and dispatched. And, essentially paid for by the hand wringing liberal ninnie taxpayers of King County who used the size of their voting block to tell the rest of us we couldn't use dogs.

Charles, sent you a pm - I wanna see the pics...

[Superman]

I've never been exposed to the practice of hunting big cats with domestic dogs, so I wonder what keeps the dogs alive. A cougar would make short work of a domestic dog.

I'm a city boy these days but that was not always the case. In a former life I lived in a logging town in the middle of nowhere. "Nowhere" is excellent, and I mean excellent sportsmans country. Great hunting and fishing. Many of the guys I know who like to be in the woods......carry a sidearm. The purpose of that tool is self-preservation. I don't know much about men hunting cats, but I do know about cats hunting men. And as with any of those wild creatures, they have the advantage. They have the home field advantage. Firearms make it a fair fight.

[charleskieffner]

believe it or not..............most dog teams are BEAGLES!!!!!! ie: SNOOPIES! some are also yer typical redneck hound doggies but in the field you usually see a majority of beagles(garbage dogs ask me how i know!). alot of times you will run into hunters looking for their dogs despite having them collared,booted,covered in flouescent orange vest etc. these guys are like really really nice to you if you find one of them.

yes alot of times when cornered a dog or two three get nailed by paw or worse. but usually the cat is scared as hell of 10 or so dogs chasing it that it trees itself pretty quickly. secret is when you take shot is to kill it real damn dead or usually a dog two three get some nasty from the cat and then you have a BIG PROBLEM trying to shoot the cat and not a dog which is trying like hell to get the cat(see cluster-fuch).

all in all our chance is an opening in the juniper islands, el paso natural gas pipeline cut or any open area they cut across to bean one. but on other side of coin, if you take the shot hitting or missing you have now spooked the hell out of the elk!!!! which sucks mega big time!

[Jeff Higgins]

I used to know a guy out in the shop whose cousin ran dogs for bear and cougar. He used full sized hounds of various sundry lineage; don't ask me which kinds, because I don't know the breeds at all. I went out after black bear in our North Cascades, up by Ross Lake, several times with them.

That was back in my early 20's, when I was still playing soccer and riding bike. I was in the best shape of my life. I couldn't keep up with these guys; no way, no how. It takes a special kind of fitness, toughness, or what have you to "run with the big dogs". Don't get me wrong; I had a blast, and we were quite successful on the bears. But anyone who claims this is "cheating" or in any way "too easy" has simply never tried it.

So the guys running beagles on the cats must run them on rabbits as well, I assume? I think most guys with dedicated cat/bear dogs use hounds of some kind, don't they? At least in the dense woods around here, a beagle would have a tough time getting over and through the underbrush, accross the rock slides, and stuff like that. I see guys running them east of the Cascades, where we have pretty open sagebrush country, but the deep woods would soon defeat one of the little fellers.

[M.D. Holloway]

we have our share of Bobcats but yet to have a big'n. Here are the tracks for you woody guys...

[charleskieffner]

jeff higgins i sent you pic hope you got.

as far as beagles go we have seen them from the nasty dezert obviously booted up all the way to the pines. last ones we saw were by crown king az. which is very very rugged and was home to the yavapai apache. juniper scrub and granite rock. the dogs had their tonques out but had a smile on their face big time.

rabbits here are by the bazzillions. it really is a lot lusher of a dezert than most realize. actually the lushest most diverse most populated critter dezert in the world. you really have to be deaf dumb and blind not to go out and see SOMETHING!

since we still have cold nights all reptiles lay low until sun gets warm. snakes are usually just sunning themselves. as the heat comes on they get to moving around more. when heat hits 110 degrees or so thats when they revert back to nocturnal hunting.

when humidity arrives in july they revert back to a day night time regime. hot hot days you will not see alot of reptiles unless you spook a whip tailed lizardo, horney toads,skinks, etc. and those always sound like a snake rattle so it adds to the fun.

[rcm]

This is good ifo. Just in the last 3 weeks or so there has been many sightings of a large male wondering the in about a 25 square mile area. Estimated size is 6 feet long, head to tail, not including the tail. Lots of pics from game cams in the area. One is from a porch, he is looking in on their poodles. The key here is look where I am, said to be none here. Fish and Game flatly denied the were here until they saw the pics.

[MRM]

I love big cats. They are very fragile so having them around says good things about the habitat and environment. The wild should be wild and it should have some big cats in it. As for any humans that can't adapt, they keep our breed strong too.

[Drago]

I've got a buddy who gets called to hunt cats with his dogs (working dogs, don't know the breed...I've seen one clear an 8' fence though). Jeff, you may have met him. Eric Lundeen.

[Burnin' oil]

When I was a kid, my dad and a friend ran hound dogs around Mariposa for bobcat, raccoon and bear. I don't recall that they ever shot a lion. I'd wake up in the morning and there would be stripped carcasses hanging on the front porch.