Doom and gloom at the gas pumps

[sammyg2]

With crude oil prices skyrocketing for no logical reason, refineries across the country are losing money bigtime. They are making and selling gasoline for less that it costs to make it. Even the most efficient refineries are breaknig even on gas. Diesel is still profitable but in most cases it doesn't cover the losses from gasoline.
The major oil companies (who pull the oil out of the ground) are making more than enough money off the crude to cover their refinery losses, but the independents who have to buy crude are in trouble.
If crude continues to climb or stays at these high levels, the independents will have to start shutting down refineries.
That would leave only the majors and a drastic cut in fuel supply. If I didn't know better I'd be putting on my tin foil hat and screaming conspiracy. Drive out the competition and then double the price.
We may be looking at $5.50 or $6 a gallon for gas by the end of the year if something doesn't give.
This irrational run-up in crude oil futures is really going to hurt this country. I'm thinking 1929 or worse. Seriously, this is the stuff that science fiction books are made of.

[the]

Originally Posted by sammyg2

1/16/08
Well all that drove the stock down bigtime. My reaction? Throw good money at bad, of course
Seriously, I went long on 4800 options of TSO expiring May 16th and 3150 of VLO expiring on March 21st.
If the stocks go up half as much as I orighinally predicted, I'm golden. If not ...... We'll see.

How's it going?

[Neilk]

May 06, 2008: 04:59 PM EST

DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

Oil refiner Tesoro Corp. (TSO), pinched by rising crude prices and narrower margins for its finished products, reported late Tuesday a first-quarter loss of $82 million, or 60 cents a share.

The company posted net income of $116 million, or 84 cents a share, a year ago.

Overall refining margins fell to $6.54 a barrel from $13.50 a year ago.

[the]

Ruh roh. Was WI Wide Body (RIP) correct?

How did you do in the market this year?

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Welcome to 1975 all over again.

[kach22i]

This is a new twist.

I don't like the looks of it.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

who is trying to destroy the U.S. economy?

[The Gaijin]

Maybe $6 a gallon gas will kill the SUV and McMansion obesity epidemics, give us a real energy policy and make us realize who our friends really are.

Nobody said it would be easy.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by The Gaijin

Maybe $6 a gallon gas will kill the SUV and McMansion obesity epidemics, give us a real energy policy and make us realize who our friends really are.

Nobody said it would be easy.

Great Britain, but they are inching away, slowly.

We knew who our friends were in 2003 when we invaded Iraq. Basically Australia and GB.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by The Gaijin

Maybe $6 a gallon gas will kill the SUV and McMansion obesity epidemics, give us a real energy policy and make us realize who our friends really are.

Nobody said it would be easy.

Nope.

All it will do is inspire another few years of grandstanding politicians passing even more useless legislation that will only eliminate more choices and freedoms and impose greater burdens on what's left of the middle class.

The SUVs will simply go down in price/value/demand, meaning that every zit-faced 17-year-old will be rollin' in a 2002 or 2003 Escalade with 22" dubs because mommy & daddy won't want the SUV anymore to get to work (too expensive). But the kids don't have anything better to spend their money on so they'll end up with 'em. Just what we need. Thousands of dumb kids at the wheel of 7,000-pound unstable death machines with poor brakes. Fun times ahead.

WRT McMansions - most of them are already built. Not gonna' change anything. If anything, the bozos in gubmint will want to "solve" the problem by forcing even more stringent energy codes. Now I'm all for efficient buildings and sustainability, but it should be a CHOICE by the owner/developer, not mandated by some do-gooder politician that doesn't know jack schit about construction. If so-and-so wants to piss their money away air conditioning the outdoors or whatever, why shouldn't they be allowed to do it? As long as they're paying for it, what's the problem? FWIW I always try to suggest the "good" solution (the sustainable one that considers life-cycle costing, etc.) but ultimately if the owner says, "give me the cheapo, less-efficient one and I'm okay with paying more in the long run", it's their call is it not?

Point is, this will be just another thing that gets exploited by our over-controlling moron bureaucrats to levy more restrictions/taxes/controls on the populace. Then they'll step back and pat themselves on the back for how great our "free" country is.

[nostatic]

I've been an advocate of higher gas prices for a long time. I think that people need to get out of cars and onto bicycles and motorcycles. A little fresh air, exercise, and no eating/drinking/talking while getting from point A to point B.

[turbo6bar]

Sorry, this too easy. I do agree with ya on the oil prices. It's getting ridiculous. I really am trying to conserve fuel and be smart. The only downside is my productivity goes down. Catch-22.

With housing prices skyrocketing for no logical reason, renters across the country are losing opportunity bigtime. Homebuilders are making and selling homes for far greater than it costs to build. Even the dumbest flippers are making 100% profit for doing nothing. Rental properties are still profitable but in most cases the rent barely covers rising expenses and taxes.
If housing continues to climb or stays at these high levels, the non-owners will have to start living in tent cities and Hondas.
We may be looking at $10million, 500 sf starter homes in South-Central Los Angeles at the end of the year if something doesn't give.
This irrational run-up in housing prices is really going to hurt this country. I'm thinking 1929 or worse. Seriously, this is the stuff that David Lereah books are made of.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by the

Ruh roh. Was WI Wide Body (RIP) correct?

How did you do in the market this year?

RIP, Was he banned or something? I hope he is not dead.

If he was banned, I am 2 for 3 on people on my ignore list being banned, crazy chick better watch out or she will make me 3/3

Originally Posted by nostatic

I've been an advocate of higher gas prices for a long time. I think that people need to get out of cars and onto bicycles and motorcycles. A little fresh air, exercise, and no eating/drinking/talking while getting from point A to point B.

Way higher taxes on fuel. We need to use less fuel and money talks. trouble is that gasoline taxes are regressive.

I need to get a shower in my office so I can bicycle commute.

[the]

Originally Posted by nostatic

I've been an advocate of higher gas prices for a long time. I think that people need to get out of cars and onto bicycles and motorcycles.

NS's dream future

[the]

Originally Posted by Tobra

RIP, Was he banned or something? I hope he is not dead.

I think he was banned from PPOT.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

The folks here espousing higher higher higher fuel prices, do you think the U.S. economy, especially the Middle Class, can survive the price hike on EVERYTHING delivered via truck and rail, and let's not forget shipping.

I received a white paper from Kuehne + Nagel the other day on fuel prices and ocean shipping. We're going to be paying a lot more soon for anything coming from overseas.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by the

NS's dream future

I see nothing wrong with that...and a lot right with it.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

The folks here espousing higher higher higher fuel prices, do you think the U.S. economy, especially the Middle Class, can survive the price hike on EVERYTHING delivered via truck and rail, and let's not forget shipping.

I received a white paper from Kuehne + Nagel the other day on fuel prices and ocean shipping.

fine, just raise taxes on consumer fuel.

[the]

Originally Posted by nostatic

I see nothing wrong with that...and a lot right with it.

I know you don't!

NS's Downtown LA, 2015.


Now, where'd I park that damn bike again?!?

[nostatic]

by 2015 the bikes will have embedded rfid so finding it will automatic. And it might eve make decent espresso...