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-   -   Where did they come from? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/406271-where-did-they-come.html)

Shaun @ Tru6 04-29-2008 03:49 PM

As a bio/biochem major (a long time ago), I appreciate what science has to offer in terms of absolute proof as well as theory.

Here is an interesting resource: http://www.bradshawfoundation.com/clottes/

A worthwhile read (need to click on all 8 pages)

Shaun @ Tru6 04-29-2008 03:52 PM

I miss science.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_the_Earth

trekkor 04-29-2008 03:53 PM

If it's 40,000 years old there must be some proof.
Show it!

I'm not a jerk. I'm very friendly and mean no harm.
Just a tiny little jab, that's all.
I'm harmless.


KT

trekkor 04-29-2008 03:57 PM

Sure let's do it again.
Are we already in re-runs? :D

Why stop at the age of the earth, the age of the universe is much more fun?

Guesses at best.


KT

dewolf 04-29-2008 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915215)
If it's 40,000 years old there must be some proof.
Show it!

I'm not a jerk. I'm very friendly and mean no harm.
Just a tiny little jab, that's all.
I'm harmless.


KT

No Trek, you said they can't verify it. Put your money where your mouth is. You say a lot Trek and come up with nothing. Prove to an entire nation of people you know more about their history than they do. You can't, can you? Don't beat around the bush Trek, I'll be here for a while so I'll await your answer, and I'll forward your evidence on to the Australian Aboriginal Council.
Still waiting for Jonah

dewolf 04-29-2008 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915223)
Sure let's do it again.
Are we already in re-runs? :D

Why stop at the age of the earth, the age of the universe is much more fun?

Guesses at best.


KT

It's funny to see you get sarcastic when your called out. You always avoid the answers don't you. Get taught that on Sundays? I have a friend who is a JW, Robert Palumbo. Very, very nice man. He never avoids giving answers. He simply says, " I don't know", or " we don't know".

trekkor 04-29-2008 04:04 PM

You have no evidence.
It's no biggie, no one does.

Man was created 6,000 years ago.

What did you want to know about Jonah?


KT

dewolf 04-29-2008 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915240)

Man was created 6,000 years ago.

KT

prove it. lets see it. proof positive. where's your proof. your dating methods are flawed. I'll await your answer again

As for jonah, go back and read

trekkor 04-29-2008 04:14 PM

Quote:

Lets start with how Jonah survived inside a whale shall we.
Very likely, the same way the three Hebrews survived the fiery furnace of Nebuchadnezzer.

I'm not really sure, the Bible doesn't say.



KT

Shaun @ Tru6 04-29-2008 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915240)
You have no evidence.
It's no biggie, no one does.

Man was created 6,000 years ago.

What did you want to know about Jonah?


KT

Trek, please help me here. I can understand your skepticism of basic scientific principles. But I see you say there's "no evidence."

is there evidence you have that man was created 6,000 years ago?

trekkor 04-29-2008 04:35 PM

Review world history.

Why did it just start 6,000 years ago?


KT

Shaun @ Tru6 04-29-2008 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915291)
Review world history.

Why did it just start 6,000 years ago?


KT

I don't understand how you arrived at world history starting 6000 years ago. What are your sources?

dewolf 04-29-2008 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa (Post 3915308)
I don't understand how you arrived at world history starting 6000 years ago. What are your sources?

The bible is his only source

dentist90 04-29-2008 05:25 PM

I think that the assumption that if something isn't a huge monument or written on stone it didn't exist is flawed. Even as late as 15th century most North American natives didn't have a written language. They had a strong oral tradition ( but you know what can happen to stories with repeated re-telling). The drawings they made were from organic pigments on skins and bark, all of which degrade readily. So, according to the 'documented history' approach, Native North Americans don't exist, or must have sprung up just before 'civilized' man found them?
I don't have scientific proof, but I'm fairly sure our native peoples have been around more than 500 years.

Shaun @ Tru6 04-29-2008 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dewolf (Post 3915354)
The bible is his only source

Are you sure? I don't think so.

Trek, please let me know your sources.

Shaun @ Tru6 05-03-2008 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915291)
Review world history.

Why did it just start 6,000 years ago?


KT

Trek, waiting for your sources on man being created 6,000 years ago.

sammyg2 05-03-2008 06:26 AM

The last time we had this argument someone brought up some cave paintings in France and said they were 27,000 years old.
I checked, the scientists who tested the age of the paintings came right out and said that their testing methods were flawed and not deemed credible because of the materials used to paint the pictures, but they "THOUGHT" the age was about 27,000 years old based on what everyone else was saying.
LOL there's your freaking science and hard data for ya.

sammyg2 05-03-2008 06:30 AM

The oldest living thing on this planet is a tree. It is about 5600 years old, based on what the scientists say.
These trees are capable of living for tens of thousands of years, according to the same scientists. So why is the oldest known living thing on this planet only as old as the biblical flood, even though the scientists say these trees can live many times as long as that?

dewolf 05-03-2008 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyg2 (Post 3921752)
The last time we had this argument someone brought up some cave paintings in France and said they were 27,000 years old.
I checked, the scientists who tested the age of the paintings came right out and said that their testing methods were flawed and not deemed credible because of the materials used to paint the pictures, but they "THOUGHT" the age was about 27,000 years old based on what everyone else was saying.
LOL there's your freaking science and hard data for ya.

The oldest living thing on this planet is a tree. It is about 5600 years old, based on what the scientists say.
These trees are capable of living for tens of thousands of years, according to the same scientists. So why is the oldest known living thing on this planet only as old as the biblical flood, even though the scientists say these trees can live many times as long as that?

In paragraph one you mock science, yet in paragraph two you agree with science?. Gee, it wouldn't be because (supposedly) it backs up your fairytale would it? Typical religious hypocrisy.

sammyg2 05-03-2008 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dewolf (Post 3921760)
In paragraph one you mock science, yet in paragraph two you agree with science?. Gee, it wouldn't be because (supposedly) it backs up your fairytale would it? Typical religious hypocrisy.

No. Wrong. I never agreed with them, I just used their own indecisions and flawed theories to demonstrate ho inaccurate it is and how unsupported the arguments made here are when they are based on what these scientists say.
BTW,you need to chill. Either that or ESAD.

dewolf 05-03-2008 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyg2 (Post 3921791)
No. Wrong. I never agreed with them, I just used their own indecisions and flawed theories to demonstrate ho inaccurate it is and how unsupported the arguments made here are when they are based on what these scientists say.
BTW,you need to chill. Either that or ESAD.

LOL, I think your the one who needs to chill. ESAD, very Christian of you. Like I said, hypocrite. Back to your fairy tales boy

sammyg2 05-03-2008 07:31 AM

I've met many people from Australia over the years. One of them I actually liked.
The rest of them were, well they were like you.

dewolf 05-03-2008 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyg2 (Post 3921820)
I've met many people from Australia over the years. One of them I actually liked.
The rest of them were, well they were like you.

WTF has that got to do with it. Fortunately I'm not as stupid as you and realise that most Americans are friendly well natured people, unlike you. Hypocrite. Again, back to your fairytale boy. LOL

dewolf 05-03-2008 07:41 AM

Actually I'm beginning to see a pattern between you religious people here. You all seem to be very aggressive when questioned about your beliefs. I can see what a peaceful bunch you really are. The only one that hasn't resorted to name calling or aggressive behaviour is Trekkor.

trekkor 05-03-2008 08:01 AM

Even though we disagree, I thank you for seeing who I am.

Again much appreciation and thanks.


KT

dewolf 05-03-2008 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921860)
Even though we disagree, I thank you for seeing who I am.

Again much appreciation and thanks.


KT

Agreed. I know your a good hearted bloke Trek. Cheers.

m21sniper 05-03-2008 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa (Post 3911027)
Just looked it up, thanks, appears to be the answer.

pretty sad really. God creates us, we f'up, finds one good guy and his family, destroys the rest of the world, and in just a few generations we're trouble again. Makes you wonder why he didn't just end it all instead of scattering across the Earth.

God isn't so good in the futures market, that's for sure.

You know, if there is a good, i'm pretty sure you're totally screwed.

m21sniper 05-03-2008 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3915240)
Man was created 6,000 years ago.

KT

That seems to be a wildly ridiculous statement from where i sit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dewolf (Post 3921760)
In paragraph one you mock science, yet in paragraph two you agree with science?. Gee, it wouldn't be because (supposedly) it backs up your fairytale would it? Typical religious hypocrisy.

I believe he did it to mock science directly.

How the hell did you miss the obviousness of that?

Quote:

Originally Posted by dewolf (Post 3921807)
LOL, I think your the one who needs to chill. ESAD, very Christian of you. Like I said, hypocrite. Back to your fairy tales boy

Civics lesson of the day:

That is a highly offensive term in America when used as you just used it. Don't use it around blacks(seriously- it could get you killed) or anyone at or near the poverty line when you are here. In many cases, this is true even if you know the person well.

Shaun @ Tru6 05-03-2008 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921860)
Even though we disagree, I thank you for seeing who I am.

Again much appreciation and thanks.


KT

You ever gonna answer the question Trek?

m21sniper 05-03-2008 08:49 AM

He's probably going by this:

"Oldest Written Form
Some people base their answer on which language got written down first. If you're counting absolute oldest, probably Sumerian or Egyptian wins because they developed a writing system first (both start appearing in about 3200 BC). If you're counting surviving languages, Chinese is often cited (first written in 1500 BC), but Greek is a possible tie because it was written in Linear B beginning ca. 1500 BC.*

*Data from "Ancient Scripts of the World" (http://www.ancientscripts.com)"


You can't have written history without writing, right?

I am pretty sure that man predates the oldest recorded written language by a looooooong time.

trekkor 05-03-2008 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa (Post 3921912)
You ever gonna answer the question Trek?

You mean the one about man existing no more than 6,000 years ago?

The 'scientific' evidence ( or lack thereof ) shows this to be true.

Man leaves traces of himself everywhere he's been. ( litterbug! )
Before the Bible's account of creation, no litter!

The evidence clearly is NOT there.
Unless you include the 'seems, mights, appears to be, could be's, etc, etc' which, of course, have no real proof!


KT

m21sniper 05-03-2008 08:57 AM

You discount fossilized tools and spear points, etc?

trekkor 05-03-2008 08:59 AM

Quote:

pretty sure
I missed that one :D

Man was created with the abilty to think and communicate.


KT

Shaun @ Tru6 05-03-2008 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921922)
You mean the one about man existing no more than 6,000 years ago?

The 'scientific' evidence ( or lack thereof ) shows this to be true.

Man leaves traces of himself everywhere he's been. ( litterbug! )
Before the Bible's account of creation, no litter!

The evidence clearly is NOT there.
Unless you include the 'seems, mights, appears to be, could be's, etc, etc' which, of course, have no real proof!


KT

Absence of evidence isn't evidence.

What are your sources for man existing for 6000 years? I don't know how much more clear I can be.

m21sniper 05-03-2008 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921928)
I missed that one :D

Man was created with the abilty to think and communicate.


KT

Sounds like an opinion to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa (Post 3921933)
Absence of evidence isn't evidence.

Sure it is.

There are no living T-rexes. How do i know? Never seen one. Now go ahead and tell me there is no evidence that there are no T-rexes.

trekkor 05-03-2008 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa (Post 3921933)
Absence of evidence isn't evidence.

What are your sources for man existing for 6000 years? I don't know how much more clear I can be.

Are you suggesting that man has been here longer, even though no evidence exists to support that?

The evidence *should* be abundant and clear, without room for interpretation.
It is NOT.


Your turn:D


KT

trekkor 05-03-2008 09:14 AM

Quote:

Sounds like an opinion to me.
I understand your point of view.
There is NO other alternative, however.

( one real evidence and actual proof )

It's true, we do not understand creation. It doesn't mean it is false.
We may never fully understand creation. That would be OK.


KT

m21sniper 05-03-2008 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921941)
Are you suggesting that man has been here longer, even though no evidence exists to support that?
KT

You mean besides fossilized tools and weapons, of course.

http://www.icecaves.com/arrowhead.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 3921947)
I understand your point of view.
There is NO other alternative, however.
KT

Sounds like more opinion.

trekkor 05-03-2008 09:19 AM

Quote:

You mean besides fossilized tools and weapons, of course.
Yes, I've seen those. They're really cool.

They are not that old, though.

The rocks they are made from could be millions of years old, no doubt, but as tools...No.



KT

trekkor 05-03-2008 09:22 AM

I'm in the middle of a really interesting marble bathroom project. Fossils in every piece.

The bathroom is not even completed, but nobody thinks it's millions of years old because the rocks are :D



KT


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