Au contraire - my position is that you are convinced you are right in the absence of any evidence to support your views. Subtle, but important difference. Additionally, you refuse to alter your views even when faced with incontrovertable evidence that your views are incorrect (hence your connection to the "Flat Earthers").

You must have me confused with someone else. Where have I posted "we can't know", etc.? That is not my position.

We agree to disagree yet again...

Steven Hawking is utterly insignificant on a galactic scale, just as are the rest of us.

Faith? The man's a seriously smart mother-Edited - language removed, Z-man.

It's as simple as that.

It could be that i know of him and his scientific opinions on these matters because i read his books compadre.

Hating on a cripple is no way to score points with me dude.

Are you really this looney in real life, or just here?

LOL, starting to see the light, eh?

My grandfather is a thumper of the highest order and we ribbingly (that can't be a word) go back and forth on this stuff all the time. It's entertaining once you realize that your logic has no effect on them:D

I say that not to mock, it's just an observation of the power of faith. It's interesting to face-to-face debate a believer, it's amazing really.

There is no debate happening here.
( Where is your position? ) ( you have none! )

How long has man been able to see beyond the solar system?
Now the universe is collapsing? Guys... :rolleyes:


Call me whatever you like. It has no effect on me.
( I won't even return fire... )


KT

You are you and I am I...

WYSIWYG ( What you see is what you get.) SmileWavy


I'm a straight shooter.:)


KT

How can anyone debate whether they believe there is a higher purpose? Only a single person can debate THEMSELVES on that subject.

Um...since the first man opened his eyes? I guess that question must be deeper, because that was a pretty easy answer.

No, expanding...close, but not quite.

I assume you're replying to me? First, I didn't call you anything unless you're offended by "believer." Second, my position is nothing other than scientific understanding. I was simply stating my amazement at the attitude of those that believe. You can't honestly tell me you don't see why non-believers wouldn't be shocked by it are you?

I wasn't trying to offend. I'm the Daddy damn it, when I try to offend you you'll know it:D

Snipe referred to me as 'looney'.



KT

I guess I should have been more clear.

How long has man been able to see with a measure of understandng beyond our solar system? ( modern telescopes )


KT

IROC calls me delusional and the gallery cheers...


Silly boys :)


KT

Ancient Chinese had a very good understanding of the cosmos. Have a read of some their works.

I don't think anyone is saying they have faith in him, but a deep respect for his knowledge and understanding.

As Steven Weinberg would say of champions of science; Hero's, not prophets.

No silliness. By definition, you are delusional. You simply share a delusion with millions of other people so you perceive it as acceptable. An unbiased person sees you as completely delusional, nonetheless.

We're here to help if you'd like.

So, Mike? According to you.

The Majority of people that have ever lived, were in fact, actually delusional?

Sit down!


KT

Now now, i merely asked if you were looney in real life too. :)

By definition, yes. They might have meant well and only went along with what was the popular belief at the time (like many people do now), but they were by defintion delusional. If you look back at the "majority of people who have ever lived" and examine the gods and deities they worshipped, exactly how much evidence is there to support the existence of those deities? Are you going to argue that there was evidence for Zeus or Apollo's existence? Or that there actually was a Sun god? Or that volcanos were deities that demanded sacrifice? You have evidence that all of the various Hindu gods really exist? You're going to argue that there actually was evidence to support these people's beliefs?

One defintion of delusional is "a false belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence". Did throwing virgins into volcanos really make crops grow better? Or was that a delusional belief? I vote for delusional, but you're welcome to present evidence to the contrary.

I'll sit down now. :)

Actually, they were mostly just conned and manipulated by the ruling elite since the scientific method and a good scientific counter-argument was not available to refute the magical thinking until relatively recently. :D

So fellas, show me a past/present/future world leader ( and the list will be short ) that wasn't/isn't delusional.

Happy voting!! :D


Lovely.


KT

Well thanks for screwing this thread up with your stupid religious hokus-pokusness Trekkor. :(

And just so I'm perfectly clear... :rolleyes:

The scientists, many who spend there life/time/energy/resources developing military devices are the ones who have it all figured out?


Everybody!! Hey you over there!! Get in line!


"The sarcasm is strong in this post"...


KT

KT, do you have kids? If so are you raising them JW? That would support IROC's statement that folks tend to go along with the popular/family belief. Again, if you have kids, what would be the consequences if they, as adults, came to the conclusion that JW is not the truth (for them), and they choose another path?

There is only one person on this thread who claims to have it all figured out KT.

Let's see, I said the name of the only true God once and never even mentioned the Bible until now.

Embrace reality!


I did use sarcsm and a lot of smilies, but that wasn't your gripe! :o


How did I wreck the 'precious thread' anyhow?
If you were king, how would you have liked it to end?:confused:


KT

I have no kids and I have NEVER made the claim to have it all figured out.


KT

You have a whole page worth of loopy religious ramblings in this thread, and you want to know how you screwed it up?

With your close-minded "my way is the only way" mentality.

I'm one person. I mean no harm.


KT

Do you believe in 'truth', Mike?


KT

Ok so no kids. Can you at least project the answers? Never made the claim...so does the bible hold all the answers to the worlds problems or not. Did you not state that you know the truth and the one true God?

Be more specific, Snipe.
What are you upset about?


KT

Yes, yes and yes!


KT

You didn't answer the question...:rolleyes: All I can take from your response is "Yes - I have it all figured out".

To be perfectly honest, I think the word "truth" is thrown around much too casually by people who assume that they alone have insight into what they believe "truth" to be (mostly religious people). I, personally, see the world as a multitude of shades of gray where "truth" is an elusive quantity in constant flux brought about by the changes in a person's knowledge and experience.

I do not hold the same beliefs now that I did ten years ago and I fully expect my beliefs to change in the next ten years. I have opinions on "higher purpose" and "the meaning of life" just as anyone else does. My main difference and why I haven't really discussed them in this thread as they are merely my opinions and my opinions are no more valuable than anyone else's.

Do you think you know what "truth" is?

On a number of issues there is absolute known truth.

I believe every question has an answer. A 'right', 'correct' or 'true' answer is obtainable.

Do I have them all? Not by a long shot.
Do I have some. Yes.


Thanks for the thougtful post, Mike. I appreciate that very much.


KT

LOL, frequently wrong but never in doubt. But, that is the definition of delusion.


"Those afraid of the universe as it really is, those who pretend to nonexistent knowledge and envision a Cosmos centered on human beings will prefer the fleeting comforts of superstition. They avoid rather than confront the world. But those with the courage to explore the weave and structure of the Cosmos, even where it differs profoundly from their wishes and prejudices, will penetrate its deepest mysteries."
CARL SAGAN, Cosmos

Yes.

Yes.


Yes.


David, I'll make every effort to answer your questions.
If you are asking me if I know everything, the answer is a solid no.
If you are asking me if I have a basic grasp on 'life's questions', then yes.


KT