Garage heat - learn me about propane

[notfarnow]

So over the past few months, my casual Friday nights in the garage have turned into a pretty regular show, with 4-10 people. Heck, now I'm even getting LADIES!!!

Anyway, it's starting to get COLD, and I'm the only one with double-layer coveralls. To be a good host, I really need to get some heat out there. Well, I really need it anyway, but the Friday Garage Nights have helped tip the scale.

So I've been postulating and hypothesizing, and have ruled out electric (my panel is maxed), wood (spooky in the garage, and would need a chimney) and oil (would need a chimney).

So, looks like propane is the answer. It's clean, it's cheap and from what I've read it's simple to install because I can go direct-vent. It's not the cheapest way to heat, but in this case simple trumps cheap.

I've seen a few good used ones for $200-$500, but I don't really know what I'm looking for. My garage is ~20' x 30'


Questions for the PPOT Brain Trust:

What do I need to know?
How many BTUs?
How long will a 20lb tank last (typically)?
How long is a piece of string?
Is this something I can install myself?
Why do I make things so complicated?
Wouldn't it make more sense to just lease a Hyundai and use the garage for parking cars, and have dinner on fridays instead of garage nights?
What is that funny lump on my ankle?

Thanks!

[Scott R]

Mine was very inefficient, took a long time to get the garage up to temp and went through a 20lb cylinder per use. I know have a regular furnace attached to my natural gas line, and a lot of insulation, and it stays at 60 even in the coldest weather. If I want to go wrench, I simply click the thermostat up a few notches and its at 70 in mins.

With the old propane heater it took an hour to get warm, and it never shut off. I know gas lines are furnaces are expensive, but its worth it. (and I also had a maxed breaker box, electrician just put a sub panel in)

[Porsche_monkey]

I am thinking 20 lb tanks ain't the answer. Rent a big tank.

Get a propane fired infra-red or a high efficiency forced air garage heater. Lennox has them on their web-site (the furnaces), Schwank has the 'tube heaters'.

You can instal them both yourself, but you would need to get an inspection for insurance (and maybe by-law) purposes.

The lump on your ankle is a calcium deposit developed from sitting at your government fat-cat desk job. I would suggest more 'out-door' time, ideally seated on a tractor, 9N or similar.

No charge for these gems.

Porsche_money M.D.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by Scott R

Mine was very inefficient, took a long time to get the garage up to temp and went through a 20lb cylinder per use. I know have a regular furnace attached to my natural gas line, and a lot of insulation, and it stays at 60 even in the coldest weather. If I want to go wrench, I simply click the thermostat up a few notches and its at 70 in mins.

With the old propane heater it took an hour to get warm, and it never shut off. I know gas lines are furnaces are expensive, but its worth it. (and I also had a maxed breaker box, electrician just put a sub panel in)

To be clear, I'm thinking of a furnace/heater that is permanent/semi-permanent and has to be vented, not just a propane space heater.

I have enough room on the panel for a furnace fan, not worried about that. Just not enough room for electric heat.

[Fritz Peyerl]

I got a ceiling heater forced air from Princess Auto for $600.00 plus I needed some B-Vent stuff. The heater is 40 000BTU and it heats my 24 x 24 ft garage to a cozy 60 degr.

My son uses one of those portable propane heaters and yes it's warm, but expensive on Propane.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

I am thinking 20 lb tanks ain't the answer. Rent a big tank.

methinks you're right

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

Get a propane fired infra-red or a high efficiency forced air garage heater. Lennox has them on their web-site (the furnaces), Schwank has the 'tube heaters'.

Yeah the ones I saw for sale locally are forced air. That's the route I'd like to take. Heats up FAST.

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

You can instal them both yourself, but you would need to get an inspection for insurance (and maybe by-law) purposes.

Hummmm. OK, I will talk to my insurance guy, and hide my collection of veggie tanks & filtration systems before he comes by.

No-go on the bylaw/building permit. I'm not letting them in my garage. Last time they came by, they made me cry.

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

The lump on your ankle is a calcium deposit developed from sitting at your government fat-cat desk job. I would suggest more 'out-door' time, ideally seated on a tractor, 9N or similar.

Ha! I work for the telco. They keep us warm by keeping us scared.

Agreed though, about the 9n.

Originally Posted by Fritz Peyerl

I got a ceiling heater forced air from Princess Auto for $600.00 plus I needed some B-Vent stuff. The heater is 40 000BTU and it heats my 24 x 24 ft garage to a cozy 60 degr.

Power Fist! Now we're talkin! How much propane do you go through? How do you have it vented?

[Porsche_monkey]

Princess sells this 'stuff': http://www.mrheater.com/products.asp?catid=40

Notice they have a DIESEL fired unit. Just sayin'.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

Princess sells this 'stuff': http://www.mrheater.com/products.asp?catid=40

Notice they have a DIESEL fired unit. Just sayin'.

Ha ha, yes I saw that diesel one. Not a vented unit though, which is what I want

This is the type of fellah I am looking for:
http://www.mrheater.com/productdetails_extended.asp?catid=50&id=117

Wonder how much propane it would take to keep me cozy for a typical 4-6 hr project night?

[fastfredracing]

I have two large reznor heater units. They are the type that have a fan built in. One is 200,00 btu, and the other is 130,000 Btu. Niether of these will run on a 20lb. cylinder. ( I tried) I have two large 100 gallon tanks to feed the large one, and on 100 gallon tank to feed the smaller one. The large heater heats a 35x130 ( 16 ft ceilings) building pretty good., but I may as well burn $20 dollar bills, as I have spent over 600 a month in the cold months in propane. Propane is less efficient than Natural Gas., But I was in the same situation as you, no gas available. I bought both units used, and had to retrofit both to run on propane. It is relatively easy, and maybe cost about 150.00 per unit to do it. I think there were different size orfices, a different gas valve., a different pilot tube, some deflectors, and some pressure adjusting. If you are not using this garage every day, they will work real good ,a little on the expensive side. I think my tanks cost something like $400.00 dollars a piece, but I was advised to use the larger tanks because of the fuel demands of these furnaces. My buddy used overhead radiant propane tubes, and these are sweet. If I had to do it all over again, that is what I would do . I dont know how large your work area is, but I used to use a small torpedo heater to heat the upper portion of my building, it is approx 30x45., 10 ft ceilings. It would heat the area well, but was noisy, smelly , and somewhat dangerous, if you are painting, or working around fuel. Best of luck , stay warm. Happy thanksgiving!!!

[stevej37]

I heat mine with a 75,000 btu Hot Dawg heater, which is the same as the Mr. Heater or Modine. Garage is 26x40 and it heats it up quickly. Being mounted at one end, it still moves the heat to the far end easily.

[Scott R]

Originally Posted by stevej37

I heat mine with a 75,000 btu Hot Dawg heater, which is the same as the Mr. Heater or Modine. Garage is 26x40 and it heats it up quickly. Being mounted at one end, it still moves the heat to the far end easily.

That's my exact setup, except on a three car, very cozy in the wintertime. And to be clear I was limited to 20lb cylinders by a zoning code.

[notfarnow]

So those smaller units, say 75k btu and under... they are cool to run on 20lb tanks? How long does a tank typically last?

If I get one of those heaters, will my garage floor paint itself, and grow a 4 post lift?

[Porsche_monkey]

Is your garage insulated?

Will you be starting from -20C and hoping to get to 20 C in an hour or two?

Used oil? http://www.cleanburn.com/ http://www.econoheat.com/


Make your neighbors drop off their 'waste' for you.

[notfarnow]

Originally Posted by Porsche_monkey

Is your garage insulated?

Will you be starting from -20C and hoping to get to 20 C in an hour or two?

Used oil? http://www.cleanburn.com/ http://www.econoheat.com/


Make your neighbors drop off their 'waste' for you.

Yep it's insulated, although drafty around the garage door. Unless we get 5+ days of -20*c , I never really see below -10*c.

Waste oil: have thought about it, because they will run on veggie oil. But they aren't approved for residential use. Plus, I already have enough tomfoolery in my garage. Propane appeals because it's small, simple and clean

[Tishabet]

My only experience using propane to heat a garage was with a three-bay, well insulated garage which I need to heat up to around 75 (outside it was around 35-40) to do some paint repair work on a car. I ended up borrowing a "torpedo" heater (one of the cylindrical ones) which attaches to a 20lb tank.

Of course that meant bringing it up to around 78, then shutting everything down so I could quickly paint while we were in the sweet spot. Still, doing so used up an entire 20lb tank.

[Tim Hancock]

Not quite the same conditions, but I heat my 20' X 25' (13' tall ceiling) workshop in my hangar with this 20,000 BTU wall mount non fan equipped propane heater. The room only has one exterior insulated wall, the rest of the walls are within my hangar. I keep this small workshop about 70 degrees year round and the little heater keeps up fine. My situtation is different though, as the other rooms of my hangar are typically heated to 40-45 degrees by separate overhead tube heaters to keep pipes from freezing when I am not working in the other rooms.

I can't tell you how much propane the wall mount uses, as the other larger heaters also feed off of a common large propane tank outside. My guess is that 30,000 BTU would be better for heating the place up quicker on Friday nights. From past experience in a 2 car garage, I can tell you that sealing up the leaks in the garage door will make a huge difference in your application.

[TWork]

I know you said wood is "spooky" but have you considered picking up a used pellet stove? We can pick them up around here between $300-1000 (depending on condition and whether they're self-igniting). Lot easier to control and will definitely warm the garage. Also, they can vent right through a wall. Just a thought.

[slodave]

How about a Samurai? Looks like they put out a lot of heat...

[billybek]

My 24x24 garage is very well insulated and sealed. I have a small Reznor horizontal unit heater that has a 40,000 btu/hr input. Rated at 80% it does a fine job of keeping the chill off the garage. I keep it just above freezing and it heats to a good working temp in short order.
Propane has about 21,622 btu per pound. So I would guess that you would burn two pounds per hour of continuous operation or there about.
The one nice thing about some of the horizontal units is that they can be side vented through a wall.

[billybek]

Originally Posted by slodave

How about a Samurai? Looks like they put out a lot of heat...

That would be enough heat probably for two or three heating seasons! LOL!