I agree with Snipe...a good .22 is a lot of bang for the buck for plinking and target shooting....esp for a beginner. Savage makes some sexy ones as well. I had a .17 and while it was fun, I ended up giving to my brother who bought me a Remington 700 22-250. For varmit shooting I love the '250. I lucked out on a sale of ammo and ended up paying $15-16 (?) for 40 round value packs. May have been mispriced at academy sports, but I bought all they had in stock and went back the next week to buy more.

IIRC .17's were about $15 or so for 50 rounds. Hot little round but man will it move in a cross wind.

Went to hunting camp with a cheapo .22 semi auto and scope (Can't recall what it was ...maybe a mossberg? Paid $110 for the combo at wallyworld for my step son to learn to shoot on). Everybody had a ball shooting it especially the kids. Went thru 1,000 rounds. Next trip everybody had picked up similar ones to plink with. People forget how much fun a 22 can be. At $15 for 500 rounds you can't beat it.

Not to hijack...M21, what scope do you recommend for the 22-250? I rarely shoot beyond 3-400 yds...mostly in the 200 yd range. The cheap 3x9 scope on it now ain't cutting it. Reasonable priced scopes?

Oh yeah...keep in mind your scope will cost 50-100% of what the rifle costs if you get a good one.

I guess my vote it for the .22

Some pistols are interchangeable .22 and .22 mag.

I picked up some 500 rnd bricks of .22 for $13.99 yesterday.

The shelves were empty, and they had just put this up. All gone in 5 minutes.

In the Army we used militarized Redfield (ART IV) 3x9x40s on our M-21s until they were replaced by the M3A Leopold 3x9x40s (M-24s all use the M3A)

You can get both commercially.

I would imagine the M3A is a good bit more expensive (probably a lot more expensive, the M3A is pretty close to top shelf). Both should be way more than adequate for your needs.

+1 to that.

A M91/30 (or a M44) can be had for dirt cheap these days, many in outstanding condition. They're good, dependable guns and pretty gosh-darned accurate too.

A M91/30 retrofitted with a modern-looking composite stock, turn-down bolt handle and high-end scope can be built for an out-the-door cost of under $1,500 (most of that is scope). You end up with a pretty decent-looking long-range rifle that's accurate well beyond 600 yards. I ain't sayin' how I know this... ;)

Mosin-Nagants are like $100 these days. Get a couple dozen.

:) I have a heavy barrel Savage bolt action .17 HMR with AccuTrigger. Great little rifle. Add a scope and detachable bipod to it and it's the perfect long range varmint gun ;).

I've had a Redfield scope for years, but my understanding is they're not in existence anymore which means the "lifetime warranty" is also dead :(. Good scope though.

edited: Pasted from the web site:

WARRANTY INFORMATION
When Leupold purchased Redfield in April, 2008, Leupold did not assume the Redfield warranty. Because many Redfield customers have contacted Leupold with regard to the former Redfield warranty, Leupold is making this information available to Redfield optics owners.

At this time, two Redfield repair facilities are available should your Redfield product require service: ABO USA Inc (305-859-2010) and Iron Sight Inc (918-445-2001). The contacts provided are for information purposes only, as ABO Inc. and Iron Sight Inc. are not affiliated with Leupold & Stevens. Please contact them for all information regarding repair, service, and associated charges.

That depends on your definition of long range. Past 100 yrds. the .17 lacks killing power on anything bigger than a squirrel and very effected by any kind of wind. Personally I think the .17 is a pretty unstable round. For the cheap, I would go with .22. A good, cheap target gun, and a modest varmint gun at 100 yrds. I shoot ground hogs all the time, but my rifle of choice is the Howa 1500 in .22-250. The .22-250 is good from ground hogs to big bucks, a nice all around caliber.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237722898.jpg


Smoking accurate and at 100yrds+ they are D.E.A.D.

Varmint rifles and target riflles to me are two separate cats.

Is that stock one of your creations? Very nice!!!

Hey Keith,

No actually it is factory, and that is a factory photo. In this pic the Howa is at the top. The other two I did myself from semi-inletted wood I got on eveilbay. The middle one is my Browning .25-06, it puts holes in holes @ 100yrds.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237723695.jpg

beautiful guns Targa ..... what does "semi-inletted" wood mean?

this looks fun - though not legal
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HERE are some photos of a beautiful Ruger 10/22. i love this gun

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/edu22.htm

semi inletted means unfinished. you get the stock as a rough cut, bare wood with the everything cut just a bit over sized. you then have to fit the action, barrel, etc. Then glass bed everything, sand and finish. They look like this...


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237727276.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237727615.jpg


Some better, some are a lot more work. It depends on who turned it. Boyds gunstocks does a nice job also if you can find any by Fajen although they ore OOB there are a lot of them still floating around.

thanks

you do nice work!

Thanks, it is as much of a passion for me as P cars, although she has been gone almost 2 years now. This kinda fills the void.

22-250 sounds like a great round, but it is another one that isn't cheap, and in fact is more expensive than .223 (at least from my quick check).

That is part of a broader question of all these different rounds that are available...talk about lack of interoperability ;)

SR, i had this same rifle. Kick myself for selling it all the time. I sold it because i couldn't hunt with it in Pa.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/images/e22-1.jpg

I used to impress my uncles drunk buddies at his hunting camp by shooting dimes with it (nothing special, just 25 or 30 meter shots, but drunks are easily impressed).

I think .220 swift is pretty much considered to be the 'ultimate' varmint round, at least in gun magazines. ;)

.220 swift is the fastest velocity commercially available round out there I think. There is a lot of debate on whether slug size/mass/grain or velocity is the most effective way to get stopping power. I've read a lot of reports on hydrostatic shock from high-velocity rounds (like the swift). The theory is that the high-velocity impact induces compressive shock waves in the (non-compressible) fluids of the target's body, causing blood vessels and organs to rupture and explode even great distances from the impact site. I've read some ME (Medical Examiner) reports that call this a complete myth, some that completely support it.

The downside of the .220 swift is that it chews up barrels very quickly. Only a few hundred rounds and all but the best finishes get deteriorated.

.220 swift IS a barrel burner.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/compared_17HMR_22WMR.htm

Both rounds have strenghts and weaknesses.

I have found that at around 3,800 FPS with V-max Moly 55 grain coated bullets the barrels last as long as the 22-250.

The swift is the king of the varmint rounds they provide explosive spectacular kills on the gopher and prairie dogs. I loaded 300 round yesterday ( The gopher derby is in one month i'll take 500+ rounds for 2 days of carnage. I like it better than the 22-250 although the 22-250 & Ruger 204 are excellent rounds as well.


Gopher Be Gone !

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237769609.jpg

Unless those gophers are affecting your life or livelihood, that is just brutal, useless killing.