Coworker yelled at and berated me

mikester · 06:03 AM

So, yeah - I'm a guy and I can take abuse I feel pretty well. But I don't particularly like to tolerate things that are over the top.

I've got a server admin who is having trouble with his new storage arrays. For some reason the network isn't working right for him. We have been going around and around with him for the past 48 hours. The connections he is trying to make are through a firewall in our network, I have permitted what he asked me to permit. None of those permits are being used by his application though (which means the info he gave me was wrong) but I can see what is being denied and work around it. Permit what he seems to need, it still doesn't work but nothing is being denied.

He puts his PC in the same network, bypassing the firewall - it works. It absolutely is a network issue at this point. Never mind that during this entire exercise - the storage device's web interface is able to be reached from anywhere on our network. Because the application he's trying to use - isn't working through the firewall he wants me to do a blanket permit for everything possible so that nothing is being blocked. He doesn't want to listen to my explanation as to why that won't work or do anything to help (there isn't any traffic to permit - if there were I would see the denies in the firewall). He'll have none of it! He goes completely off on me - "I don't need to listen to your explanation of YOUR network problem!" then he goes on to elaborate about how I'm the network engineer and he's not, so he doesn't care about the technical stuff I'm talking about - all he cares about is that his stuff isn't working and he's tired of me trying to point the finger away from the network. If 'Frank' (one of our engineers who recently left the company) were here - he'd have it fixed by now.

So now, I'm ready to hang up but my coworker gets me to maintain - I believe this was a mistake - I should have hung up but I didn't. We continue, I do something short of a blanket permit - see nothing (as I expected), I do a couple of other things to verify that the traffic from his application is getting through the firewalls and finally tell him at this point there is nothing I can do. We'll have to setup our sniffer and look at it tomorrow. He's giving me grief for loosing two days which I come back with - 'you're not the only one who has lost two days'.

I wish I had hung up. Tomorrow I feel like I should ask his manager for someone else to work on this problem with because I would prefer not to work with the person again.

I wish I had hung up. I didn't, what can I do not besides just let it go. I'm fine with letting it go if that is the right thing to do, my understanding is that his guy is like this and that's just the way it is. If it happens again - click. period.

"Frank" - the former engineer was better than me overall - but I know these firewalls better than some of the developers who write code for them and "Frank" will be the first to admit that. "Frank" doesn't work here anymore - get over it.

VincentVega · 04-02-2009, 07:05 PM

That's the way security it, it's always a firewall problem. Assuming you have good logging, it's usually pretty simple to inform the app guys what's really going on. However, with your permit comments, I assume your really working on a router, not a firewall.

Chill out, it's only work.

mikester · 04-02-2009, 07:08 PM

No, it's a firewall not a router but that is besides the point. I'm not the one who lost his cool.

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

My boss makes everyone the guilty party, no matter the problem. Just about all of us have had our laptop hard drive crash at some point in the last two years. We cannot get onto the network any other way, only with our assigned laptops, which have to be shipped to tech support in NJ for repair. It usually means we can't work at all for about a week when this happens. When it happened to me, my boss's first question was, "What the hell did you do to it?' Uh, I was downloading porn and surfing for job leads. Duh. Last week I had a contract get disputed by a client's legal dept. Two conflicting clauses in it were written by my boss. No matter. It was my fault for not working on a renewal 60 days prior to expire, even though I knew my contacts there would be laid off about 50 days before expire and never could have renewed anything, even if they had wanted to. That's our punishment for not being our own bosses.

stomachmonkey · 04-02-2009, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikester

I'm not the one who lost his cool.

Exactly why hanging up on him would have been a bad idea.

No one can deny that you did everything that YOU knew you could do to solve the problem as well as doing everything that HE asked you to do to solve the problem.

You are clean.

This is either a one time blow up or will be a pattern with him.

Who knows, maybe the wife gave him a bunch of crap for giving his young boys a slingshot which they used to punch a hole in the neighbors window and it's gonna cost him $800 to fix.

Maybe he's just a dick.

I've been on both sides of this before.

Learned the first time that it's better to stay cool, the other guy will always look like an ass and you will look like the professional.

That approach served me well thru many encounters.

Forgot it once and coincidently it was the LAN guy that got me so worked up I found myself poking the CEO in the chest while screaming in his face "you're god damn ****ing right you will". Not a career move I recommend.

Good thing the CEO was a long time associate/friend and the guy that set me off had a reputation as an asshat, otherwise I woulda been the one hittin the bricks.

futuresoptions · 04-02-2009, 07:39 PM

Used to go through situations like this with some of our off premises monitored building automation systems... usually it turned out to be a pretty simple fix... just be methodical and it will work out... that always makes the customer happy.... and in the end will give you another weapon in your troubleshooting skills...

masraum · 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Martin

That's the way security it, it's always a firewall problem. Assuming you have good logging, it's usually pretty simple to inform the app guys what's really going on. However, with your permit comments, I assume your really working on a router, not a firewall.

Chill out, it's only work.

Actually, he's probably working on a Cisco ASA which use Cisco Router IOS like access-lists.

I will admit, occasionally there are network issues (rarely

) that cause problems with other things (servers, apps, etc...), but it seems like 90% of the time, the problem is NOT the network (or even more commonly blamed, the firewall) and it's our job to prove it to the other folks.

It's very common to be in the situation... "Poke a hole for my app." "What protocol/port does your app use?" ".... ." And yeah, a lot of the time when they finally come back with something, it's often either wrong or only part of the picture. As network guy, I think we are the red-headed step-children of the IT world despite the fact that if we didn't keep stuff running, everyone else would be screwed. And if we didn't have so much integrity, the folks that irritate us would be screwed.

Wow, sounds like that guy is a real jack hole and would suck to work with. It seems that you've got a couple of options.

Option 1 Retaliate. Make him look/seem really stupid. That will often take the wind out of someone's sails.

Option 2 Just ignore when he's being an ass. Don't respond to his obnoxious statements. When he gets done ranting, ask him a question about the matter at hand as if he hadn't just said anything.

Option 3 Don't deal with him when he's being an azz. Just hang up. Maybe call his boss and tell him that you'd like to work with someone who's interested in fixing the problem instead of *****ing and berating you. If you really want to go the official route, go to HR. Most places have a policy against harassment these days.

slodave · slodave's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by masraum

Option 1 Retaliate. Make him look seem really stupid. That will often take the wind out of someone's sails.

Option 2 Just ignore when he's being an ass. Don't respond to his obnoxious statements. When he gets done ranting, ask him a question about the matter at hand as if he hadn't just said anything.

Option 3 Don't deal with him when he's being an azz. Just hang up. Maybe call his boss and tell him that you'd like to work with someone who's interested in fixing the problem instead of *****ing and berating you. If you really want to go the official route, go to HR. Most places have a policy against harassment these days.

I always preferred option option 1.

Bill Douglas · 04-02-2009, 07:49 PM

You do your job and he do his. Help him a little in case he lies and complains, that way you can say you had more than co-operated. And definetly don't give blanket access even for a moment. If something nails your network you are in trouble.

legion · 04-02-2009, 07:51 PM

I was going to lunch with some coworkers one day a year or so ago. One of the guys on my team is a heavy-set 40-year old gay guy with a massive superiority complex. Anyway, he asked me some question about the Porsche (I still had it at the time). I started to answer his question, but he cut me off before I could finish:

"NO ONE WANTS TO HEAR ABOUT YOUR CAR CHRIS!!! WHY DON'T YOU JUST SHUT THE F*** UP ABOUT IT ALREADY!!!"

"You're the one that asked me about it."

That didn't slow him down. Never mind that I have to put up with 5-10 minutes of baby talk with his partner 2-4 times a day. Never mind that when he comes in he picks someone out to tell a long, boring, pointless story about some family member of his every morning.

A few months before this, I had to invite him to a meeting as my backup. It was a precarious situation and it had taken me months to build the other team's trust and get them on my side of an issue. I was almost over the hump and almost had their agreement. He started screaming at the other team's lead. He sent months of careful work on my part down the toilet in 30 seconds. I quit inviting him to meetings after that, but the damage was done.

This guy has stabbed me in the back every opportunity he's had. He's made up stuff about me and complained to my (our) manager about it. He's an incessant brown-noser. He's also not very good at his job.

I still haven't forgotten and I'm waiting for the opportune moment to get back. I will forgive one or two transgressions, but not a deliberate pattern of malice.

KaptKaos · 04-02-2009, 07:56 PM

Send an email to your boss, his boss, CIO etc. stating that Mr. *****head has asked you to open all ports from segment A to segment B removing all security and you just wanted to make sure that they were ok with it.

If they say yes, then open it. I doubt they would.

I'd also point out that its pretty silly that the Server guy doesn't even know what ports his apps need and that now you need to waste more of your time throwing a sniffer on there to see what's being blocked.

Bet ya the bastard has a broadcast (non-routed) protocol and doesn't understand that you can't route those through a firewall. Bet ya lunch.

VincentVega · 04-02-2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

No, it's a firewall not a router but that is besides the point.

Sure, whatever. I work for the competition.

If it really bugs you talk to your HR guy. A simple, "I'm not sure what's appropriate on my part, but X made me uncomfortable." That's what HR is for.

mikester · 04-02-2009, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaptKaos

Send an email to your boss, his boss, CIO etc. stating that Mr. *****head has asked you to open all ports from segment A to segment B removing all security and you just wanted to make sure that they were ok with it.

If they say yes, then open it. I doubt they would.

I'd also point out that its pretty silly that the Server guy doesn't even know what ports his apps need and that now you need to waste more of your time throwing a sniffer on there to see what's being blocked.

Bet ya the bastard has a broadcast (non-routed) protocol and doesn't understand that you can't route those through a firewall. Bet ya lunch.

I've already made my coworker who was on the phone with me and the dork at the time that same bet.

mikester · 04-02-2009, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masraum

Actually, he's probably working on a Cisco ASA which use Cisco Router IOS like access-lists.

I will admit, occasionally there are network issues (rarely

) that cause problems with other things (servers, apps, etc...), but it seems like 90% of the time, the problem is NOT the network (or even more commonly blamed, the firewall) and it's our job to prove it to the other folks.

It's very common to be in the situation... "Poke a hole for my app." "What protocol/port does your app use?" ".... ." And yeah, a lot of the time when they finally come back with something, it's often either wrong or only part of the picture. As network guy, I think we are the red-headed step-children of the IT world despite the fact that if we didn't keep stuff running, everyone else would be screwed. And if we didn't have so much integrity, the folks that irritate us would be screwed.

Wow, sounds like that guy is a real jack hole and would suck to work with. It seems that you've got a couple of options.

Option 1 Retaliate. Make him look/seem really stupid. That will often take the wind out of someone's sails.

Option 2 Just ignore when he's being an ass. Don't respond to his obnoxious statements. When he gets done ranting, ask him a question about the matter at hand as if he hadn't just said anything.

Option 3 Don't deal with him when he's being an azz. Just hang up. Maybe call his boss and tell him that you'd like to work with someone who's interested in fixing the problem instead of *****ing and berating you. If you really want to go the official route, go to HR. Most places have a policy against harassment these days.

There are network issues, this I am almost certain isn't one of them. It's an older PIX by the way. I am not the option 1 kind of guy. I really have been considering telling his boss or my own boss that I would rather work with someone else on this problem. This guy has been belligerent and when I called him out on it he flew even farther off the handle. He doesn't want to listen to my observations on the network side and without that - we aren't going to be able to fix it. Let me work with someone else please.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Martin

Sure, whatever. I work for the competition.

If it really bugs you talk to your HR guy. A simple, "I'm not sure what's appropriate on my part, but X made me uncomfortable." That's what HR is for.

Oh, Really? Hiring?

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

Tell HR that he hit on you and you now feel uncomfortable since you like him as a friend, but aren't interesting in him that way.

Schumi · 09:33 PM

When situations like this arise in my work.. I just make the other people feel stupid with over-the-top spreadsheets, graphs, papers, and equations to prove my point.

If I have a problem that I cannot shut them up about... I just cool off, go home, and resort to alcohol. Because that is always is the right answer.

svandamme · svandamme's Garage

well, i had a problem with an MS cluster once... clearly a network problem as the failover worked fine as long as you stayed in the same lan segment...
but the network dude would have none of it... so i ordered the cisco tac team, MS and compaq onsite on the same day... told em : deal with it.
Turned out the Cisco thing was ignoring gratuitious arp requests...
they swapped out one little daughter board, for another one that had the exact same FW and HW version.... and it worked...
Then i told em to send the 3 bills to the Network guy... that blew his budget for the next 2 trimesters

masraum · 04-03-2009, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by svandamme

well, i had a problem with an MS cluster once... clearly a network problem as the failover worked fine as long as you stayed in the same lan segment...
but the network dude would have none of it... so i ordered the cisco tac team, MS and compaq onsite on the same day... told em : deal with it.
Turned out the Cisco thing was ignoring gratuitious arp requests...
they swapped out one little daughter board, for another one that had the exact same FW and HW version.... and it worked...
Then i told em to send the 3 bills to the Network guy... that blew his budget for the next 2 trimesters

I'm sure it was the way your cluster was forming the packets initially.

It couldn't have been a Cisco problem.

GrandmaSideways · 04-03-2009, 04:44 AM

People like this, especially the gay guy you mentioned, remove themselves from the company pretty fast.
Breathe deeply. Be the bigger man.

red-beard · red-beard's Garage

I'm working a deal with a mid Tennesee business. The guy I'm working with is out doing auction work, so I contact his father / business owner to get a status update on a piece of equipment.

As soon as I start talking, to just a status up date on the repair of this equipment, he goes off on me. I mean screaming and threanten to un-do our deal. I can't get in any words and I'm about to go off on him. Finally, I get him queit enough to shut down the call. I call his son, the one I normally work with. Yep, dad's a drunk.