Women complain..

livi · 04-08-2009, 06:10 PM

..that they only get 80% of the men´s salary.

But COME ON!?!

They have their own salary too!

Sorry. Turning a bit silly half threw yet another, never ending, night shift. This viral infectious season just never seems to end. A non stop stream of bronchiolitis and gastroenteritis.

Tobra · Tobra's Garage

the dreaded choke and puke at the ER

That is pretty funny though.

on2wheels52 · on2wheels52's Garage

"choke and puke"
I haven't heard that combination of words for almost 30 years. One of the mechanics where I worked used it to describe the restuarant he went to lunch (daily). I thought it was an old navy term; he also had an interesting name for a certain kind of meat sandwich.
Jim

PorscheGAL · PorscheGAL's Garage

As a woman I am going to say:

Most women deserve 80% pay. Women take more time off of work for kids. If they want equal pay they have to do equal work.

cmccuist · 04-09-2009, 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

As a woman I am going to say:

Most women deserve 80% pay. Women take more time off of work for kids. If they want equal pay they have to do equal work.

That's a good point Steph. One thing I noticed as an engineer where there is not a lot of female representation - they make the same money as the men!!

Because they do as good a job typically.

Rikao4 · 04-09-2009, 05:59 AM

well I told my ladies..tell your husband to take the kids to the Dr. once in awhile..
your just as important ...
work's for me ...

so I take the 'kids' to the vet..

Rika

legion · 04-09-2009, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

As a woman I am going to say:

Most women deserve 80% pay. Women take more time off of work for kids. If they want equal pay they have to do equal work.

I think this is mostly to blame for this so-called disparity.

My manager is a woman. Her husband is an analyst. (Same position as me.) Care to venture any guesses on who has primary childcare responsibilities? (It's the husband.) Who makes more? (My manager.) Who works harder in general? (My manager.)

I've seen this over and over. In most couples with children, the person who has the primary childcare responsibilities earns less and the person who takes on the role of "provider" earns more--regardless of sex. I've also found (anecdotally) that most women prefer childcare and most men prefer to be the provider.

PorscheGAL · PorscheGAL's Garage

The problem is that I have heard "feminists" say that women should be paid equal even if they don't put in the same time at work. I am all for people getting paid their worth but man or woman should not expect the same pay if they are gone more.

In our family my husband is the breadwinner. He is in sales. I had a female sales person complain to me that it was unfair my husband made more than her. They are paid commission and she was gone 6 weeks for maternity leave. What did she think was going to happen if she didn't make a sale for 6 weeks?

Heel n Toe · 04-09-2009, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

I had a female sales person complain to me that it was unfair my husband made more than her.

This is the reason it's not a good idea for everyone in a company to know what everyone else makes.

I guess in sales it might be different... some might say it's a motivator for those who make less to see potential income if they work harder/smarter.

But generally, only bad things come from people knowing the size of their coworkers' paychecks.

PorscheGAL · PorscheGAL's Garage

They know because the company ranks sales reps. The company releases how much your sales are. Every rep gets the same percentage regardless of their sales so anyone that can do math knows how much you made.

VroomGrrl · 04-09-2009, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

As a woman I am going to say:

Most women deserve 80% pay. Women take more time off of work for kids. If they want equal pay they have to do equal work.

As a woman I am going to say: WTF????

a) kiss my childless azz - I'll take the 100% pay for 100% work, thank you.

b) men and women should BOTH take time off to care for children if they want to, with BOTH their pay adjusted accordingly. Or not. I have no problem with liberal family leave benefits. To the extent that parents are out of the office more often than non-parents, that doesn't bother me. I consider it doing my part to support the continuation of the human race of which I am a member.

PorscheGAL · PorscheGAL's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by VroomGrrl

As a woman I am going to say: WTF????

a) kiss my childless azz - I'll take the 100% pay for 100% work, thank you.

b) men and women should BOTH take time off to care for children if they want to, with BOTH their pay adjusted accordingly. Or not. I have no problem with liberal family leave benefits. To the extent that parents are out of the office more often than non-parents, that doesn't bother me. I consider it doing my part to support the continuation of the human race of which I am a member.

I'm sorry you were offended. My point is that Equal Work=Equal Pay.

Jeff Higgins · 04-09-2009, 07:57 AM

I'm going to stick my neck out here and undoubtedly be called some kind of male chauvanist pig as a result of what I'm about to say.

I have yet to meet the woman working in my profession that can even begin to hold a candle to the men. Not one, in darn near 30 years.

I'm an engineer, and I design tools and equipment used in the rework and repair of large commercial aircraft. Much of what I design is used to retrofit, rework, or maintain in service aircraft per some kind of a service bulletin. The really fun stuff, however, is what we call "incident repair". Fixing damaged aircraft. It is simply amazing what a creative pilot, ground crew worker, food service worker, mechanic, or whoever can come up with to damage these things. Some are more or less "routine" to varying degrees - skin replacements around doors damaged by food service trucks, lower aft fuselage damage from a tail strike, nose gear collapse from slamming it down too hard, etc. Some are really "out there", and typically seen only once or twice in someone's entire career.

Even the "routine" repairs vary significantly by the amount of damage done, and other problems uncoverd during the repair (corrosion and cracking in surrounding structure, old "repairs", etc.). It's just like digging into and old car, especially if the aircraft have changed hands several times, have been maintained by various MRO's of varying capabilities, and by carriers with varying wallets. Just like old cars.

The universal problem with women engineers in this environment is that they don't work on old cars. Hell, they don't work on anything mechanical, as a rule. I only use old cars as an example because this is a board for old cars... Anyway, women simply do not have the mechanical background in the real world that is essential to being effective in this capacity. Some men don't either, and they don't last around here, either. However, everyone who has made it in this whacky little niche has been a man - bar none.

We very much have to think on our feet, under a great deal of pressure when in the field. Just imagine dealing with a customer who owns a $150 million dollar piece of revenue generating equipment that currently isn't, because it's grounded. What we do is extremely time-sensitive, seat-of-the-pants, and often carried off with "locally available materials". And resources - machine shops, fabrication shops, weld shops, etc. It's "McGyver vs. Rube Goldberg" all the way, with points for creativity.

While we have had several try, I have never met a woman that can do this. They may very well be fine engineers sitting back at their desks doing "clean sheet" design work and whatnot, but they fall on their faces in the field. Should they be paid as much as the guys who can do it all, when we typically have to send a guy or two in addition to her anyway, just to cover these shortfalls? The guys are just as adept as the women when back home in the office, at that kind of work. Who should be paid more?

Zeke · 04-09-2009, 08:14 AM

Did everyone miss the humor and irony?

"...that they only get 80% of the men´s salary.

But COME ON!?!

They have their own salary too! "

The way I read Markus' is that women ONLY get 80% of the man's and 100% of their own household income. You guys and gals are too quick to jump.

Heel n Toe · 04-09-2009, 08:18 AM

Tobra got it.

I got it.

That's 3.

Moses · 04-09-2009, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins

I'm going to stick my neck out here and undoubtedly be called some kind of male chauvanist pig as a result of what I'm about to say.

I will not share my observances of women in the operating room. Nope... Not going there. Biting my tongue. Not gonna say it. Gotta go now...

Zeke · 04-09-2009, 08:33 AM

I think that cat is outta the bag.....

Jeff Higgins · 04-09-2009, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milt

Did everyone miss the humor and irony?

You have got to be kidding. Do you really think anyone missed it? Do you really think we are "too quick to jump" because we somehow missed the humor and irony? No one here missed it - this little quip has made the rounds for decades; I would be very surprised if anyone here had not heard it before. Some of us were merely using it as a springboard to comment on the issue it highlights. That's what we do around here.

Zeke · 04-09-2009, 08:47 AM

I don't know, Jeff, the comments were getting pretty serious. I saw a train wreck coming.

I love it when Markus uses the words "half threw....(the) night" and this starts ideas about hurling. You guys are brutal.

Jeff Higgins · 04-09-2009, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by milt

I don't know, Jeff, the comments were getting pretty serious. I saw a train wreck coming.

I love it when Markus uses the words "half threw....(the) night" and this starts ideas about hurling. You guys are brutal.

Yeah, I guess you are right. This place has a habit of taking the most innocuous, light hearted statements and going to the races. Need a mountain? Just bring us your molehill...

One of my favorite bumper stickers: "Driver carries no cash - he's married". We could go on and on about "the boss..." in any household. Just let me say this - I wear the pants in my family. The exact size, color, and style my wife tells me to....