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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
Posts: 51,063
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Another Exspoon of Mine For Sale
Here is a Carlos Gove of Denver City Percussion rifle that I bought a few years back and sold through Little John in SO CA. Only when I sold it it didn't have a lock, the wire wrappings around the stock or the Indian Tacks...I got $1550 on a $500 investment. Now the item is reserved with an estimate of $9500 to $12500. I guess if I enhance I too can make the big bucks
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06-21-2009, 02:13 PM
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Evolved
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,338
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Quote:"..it didn't have a lock, the wire wrappings around the stock or the Indian Tacks"
_____________________ Sounds like you sold him a box full of car parts and he restored it to drive-ability ..and the problem is ...what?
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Don't fear the reaper. |
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06-21-2009, 03:26 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
Posts: 28,957
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What he is trying to say is that someone took a fair looking rifle and added the tacks to the stock and wire to the forestock, trying to make it look antique. Evidently it worked as someone bought it for a lot more than Tabs sold it for.
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2021 Subaru Legacy, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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06-21-2009, 03:59 PM
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Evolved
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,338
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"it didn't have a lock"
_______________ Wow, nice car ...just missing the engine!
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Don't fear the reaper. Last edited by Mo_Gearhead; 06-21-2009 at 04:52 PM.. |
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06-21-2009, 04:49 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
Posts: 28,957
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Maybe he sold it without the caplock portion on the rifle. They just screw on with 2 screws...
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2021 Subaru Legacy, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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06-21-2009, 05:16 PM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
Posts: 51,063
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To begin with it was a VERY RARE item. Carlos Gove was an Indian Agent, Mayor of Denver, Rifle Maker and crack shot. He also was partnered with JP Lower and George Schoyen appreticed with him. Lots of Wild West History.
I sold the gun with out the Persussion lock, which was added, the wire and tacks...all to make it look like an Indian gun...
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06-21-2009, 05:26 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
Posts: 28,957
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Hey Tabs, what ever happened to the "Lugar" situation where the guy you sold it to "doctored" the paperwork? Hope he get in trouble over it.
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2021 Subaru Legacy, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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06-21-2009, 05:28 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Summerville, SC
Posts: 2,057
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Quote:
There are different theories on why it is "acceptable" to restore a collectible car, where it is not so with firearms -- the best explanation I've heard is that since the car has always required maintenance during its service life, "rebuilding" is acceptable in the collecting market. Firearms don't normally require "new parts" as part of their regular maintenance, thus, it is not acceptable to install them when something becomes collectible. Things like the Indian Tacks can actually have historical meaning; for someone to add them to a firearm that never had them historically, is to commit an act of fraud. Imagine if someone found an old 911, then counterfeited a serial number and body paint scheme to make it appear that it had a racing heritage -- you'd recognize that as fraud wouldn't you? That is what someone has done with this firearm; they have made it appear to have a "heritage" that is different than the one it actually had. |
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06-21-2009, 05:42 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
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Quote:
Hope it does not sell and he ends up living with it for a long time.
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2021 Subaru Legacy, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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06-21-2009, 05:48 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: secure undisclosed locationville
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did he carve "D. BOONE" into the stock as well?
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1971 R75/5 2003 R1100S 2013 Ural Patrol 2023 R18 |
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06-21-2009, 05:52 PM
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You do not have permissi
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: midwest
Posts: 39,937
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Look old and dirty?......just dip those coins in SilverX................
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06-21-2009, 06:05 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
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Quote:
__________________
2021 Subaru Legacy, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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06-21-2009, 06:23 PM
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Evolved
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,338
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I understand the concept that the man has doctored the gun to make it appear as something it isn't, my only reason for commenting at all was this:
The old saying of "lock, stock and barrel" relates to the components of a firearm. Imagine me being so silly to use a car analogy ...on a car forum. (BAN?) The Rug Doctor sells (for a profit) a gun missing the "lock". A car, minus the engine IMO. (Here ...take this thousand dollars and go find me a 'authentic lock' for a Carlos Gove of Denver City, Percussion rifle.) Carry on...
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Don't fear the reaper. |
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06-21-2009, 07:01 PM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
Posts: 51,063
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When I got the rifle it had a contemporary lock in it, Little John thught it would be better to remove that POS lock. Replacing the lock with a period lock would not be heresy, but the wire and tacks...nicht zu gut...
Mo you hit it on the nail head.... The Luger guy had the Listing pulled by Gun Broker..other than that I just don't know nor care.
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06-21-2009, 09:01 PM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
Posts: 51,063
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With the prices on 19th century Winchester and Colts hitting the stratosphere..it is becoming acceptable to RESTORE a gun. However down the road and several owners later..that gun might just appear for sale as an original.
Generally it is better to leave em as they are..any refinishing is considered to be verboten. The only exception to the rule is on British guns...they have a habit of refinishing their guns at the end of every hunting seaon or after a safari to Africa...
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Copyright "Some Observer" Last edited by tabs; 06-21-2009 at 09:17 PM.. |
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06-21-2009, 09:14 PM
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Registered
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Location: Higgs Field
Posts: 22,639
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Quote:
It is said there are now more "original" Cavalry Colt Peacemakers than Colt actually produced. Any time something becomes this valuable to the collectors and speculators, the fakes are going to emerge. And the prices are going to continue to escalate, far out of proportion to the items' real worth. In our own offbeat world of the 911, we have seen this happen to the early car. Prices escalating to the point where they became out of reach for the average enthusiast who just wanted to drive one. Fortunately, this one doesn't seem to have gotten the legs many had hoped, and prices are now dropping. I saw this happen with my favorite old firearms (single shot rifles and single action revolvers); where we were buying "shooters" to the tune of a couple hundred bucks and having a ball with them. Then, all of a sudden, every crapped out old rifle or revolver became "collectable". Snatched up not by enthusiasts, but by speculators. I was perusing the collection of a local that had done well in real estate; one of the largest collections of Single Action Armies on the west coast. Hundreds of them. Every caliber imaginable. Yet, when pressed, he could not tell me the "difference" (there is none....) between the .44-40 and .44 WCF. Didn't know the difference between black powder and smokeless powder. He knew what a "black powder frame" SAA was with regards to its value, but honestly had no idea how black powder differed from smokeless. To paraphrase a fellow Pelican, he "knew the price of everything, but the value of nothing". Such has become the world of the gun collector.
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Jeff '72 911T 3.0 MFI '93 Ducati 900 Super Sport "God invented whiskey so the Irish wouldn't rule the world" |
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06-22-2009, 06:07 AM
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You do not have permissi
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: midwest
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Quote:
Adding a reproduction part to a rifle to make it look "complete" might add some value to it, but it should be disclosed to the buyer. |
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06-22-2009, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
love it! now that there is funny stuff!
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poof! gone |
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06-22-2009, 08:02 AM
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