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Hey Leland, do you go by "lelandeod" on another forum? The handle reminded me of you.
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Well, today was a totally unexpected $800 shopping day for AR parts. So I'm selling my SIG P229 in NP3 to cover some of the damage. I listed a stripped lower and lower parts kit on our local gun nut BBS and had it sold in under five min. with multiple offers. Man, it's getting nuts out there with AR stuff. I'm in the wrong business.
http://www.fototime.com/32FA2E967615684/standard.jpg |
Things slowed down quite a bit with AR parts. There's already signs of dealers liquidating the overstocked at pre-election prices. Come November or so there may be some hard to refuse deals. But the temptation to buy now is strong :). That's a good looking Sig, Rick. Build yourself an AR pistol from that Spikes lower to make up for the loss of the Sig :)
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What would you guys consider pre-bubble pricing on .223 ammo? Military surplus is around $350 per 1000. I was thinking about getting a Mini 14, but ammo pricing is pushing me away from .223 and towards a rifle based on 7.62. Does .223 always trade at a premium to 7.62?
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Ammo will probably be elevated for awhile because some of the new owners are still stocking or learning to shoot. If you're going to have only one rifle and you want lower cost ammo 7.62 is probably the way to go.
Here's a thought-you can get an AR and have two rifles for the cost of 1.5. You can fit a 7.62 barrel to it, add bolt and magazine and you can shoot cheap Russian ammo. If you happen to have a quick change upper receiver you can swap in a couple of minutes. There is some tuning involved but once done you should have some fun with it. Also, if you don't have a finicky barrel in 5.56 you can shoot Wolf or Bear ammo which is pretty cheap. With the dropping prices of ARs you might consider them over the mini. |
I've been debating whether to go Eotech or Aimpoint for quite some time. Both have their strengths and weaknesses, but in general I like the parralax (sp) free optics. My feeling is that in a panic situation (meaning any time I have to use the AR for real) I want to point and shoot, not worry about my position, alignment, etc...
If I can find my summary, I'll post it later. |
Since we're back on topic:
Read this thread. I was ready to buy an Aimpoint until I decided on the M3 version. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=124&t=447314 I can't recall if it is posted in that thread but the guy destroyed one to verify the internals weren't just taped on. Jurgen- you can get a .22lr conversion for an AR and shoot all the cheap ammo you want. Spikes and CMMG have stainless steel kits that work great. |
Yup, I go by lelandeod on many forums. Pelican was the first BBS I found way back in "the day" and I really didn't grasp the purpose of an internet "handle". So, I used my real name.
Haven't done that since. :) |
Cool. It's funny who you can run into on the web :)
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If the choice is either an Eotech or an Aimpoint I would go for the Eotech. The Aimpoint (M68) is probably the most common optic in the Army and given the choice most soldeirs will fight for either an ACOG or an Eotech. Truth be told most soldiers try to get an ACOG because it makes their rifle qualification a near certainty. But like many have stated here there are many great options out there. Leupold makes a nice 4 power scope, and the new Elcan goes between either 4x or no 1x. It's a pricey piece of glass though.
Matt |
Here were my notes on Aimpoint vs. Eotech. (Never tried the Acog (Trijicon), but I'll take a look, IIRC those are big $$$)
Aimpoint + Battery Life way higher. Aimpoint waterproof at higher depths. insane battery life....10,000 hrs on one battery simple operation...single roll on/off control rheostat comes with lens covers. (can be used as an Occluded Eye Gunsite in very bright sunlight) Rugged choice of 2 or 4 MOA dot Aimpoint - Broken optic renders unuable More expensive of the 2. Expensive mounts, no mount included. 30mm tube very slightly slower than Eotech window Dot initially harder to locate in bright sunlight Eotech + Faster aquisition of targets, especially close range Smaller dot (1 moa), less obscuring of the target at range. 65 MOA circle w/ 1 MOA dot. Lets you pick up targets fast and still be precise. Lots of brightness adjustments several models with different batteries, including easy to find AA batteries. Built in mount, commercial QD mounts available. Less expensive than a comparable Aimpoint. Rugged Can be used with partially obscured optic Eotech - Too frequent brightness adjust if moving from shadow to bright (like in a forest) Push buttons harder to operate under stress. On--touch a button. Brighten, touch 1 button (repeatedly). Dim, 1 button (repeatedly). Off, hold both buttons at once. |
After some reserch, I think Im gravitating to the Eotech. When I hit the range this week, i'll try a few out before I drop the $$
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Good video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TF6fGJiXoNA&NR=1 Most of the issues he had with the Eotech are resolved using the GG&G quick cam mount and covers. Nice package deals from GG&G |
My brother just bought an ACOG last night. IMO a lot of this stuff is VASTLY overpriced.
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Amen! |
Red dot trivia question! So who can name this piece of equipment for me? :D
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3...per/reddot.jpg This is the first red dot i had: http://www.aimpoint.com/cache/ttf/0e...a0eed6b8c8.jpg AIMPOINT 1000 And this is the last: http://www.aimpoint.com/cache/ttf/0e...70eeabe072.jpg AIMPOINT 2000 (mine was black) It was at this time that i realized that ANY optical sight, regardless of type or zoom, could be utilized as an occulated 2 eye binocular sight. But don't tell anyone, i'd hate to ruin the "racket" that these red dot sight companies have going. ;) Anyone of you fine lads would be better served with a 1.5-4x or 2-7x unlimited relief pistol type scope with illuminated reticle than most red dot type sights on the market. |
Not to jack this thread around too much but as it is already wavering a little; is it possible to make a stainless Colt AR barrel matte black? Ceramicote?
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There are some companies that have black treatments for stainless. I think Robar had one that i saw when Rick sent me the link to their site in my HK P7 thread.
AR related content, my god son in his uncle billy's gear: http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b3.../Mikeym161.jpg |
I have had good luck with Alumahide II from Brownells. It's a spray on epoxy coating. You bake it after it cures. This stuff comes in many colors and if applied correctly is very durable.
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Ok, the rifle kit I bought from Del-Ton comes with the front iron sight/gas block. Upper receiver is a flat top. What the hell to put on top? Do I want iron or something electric to co-witness with the front? I can't bring myself to spend the bucks on Aimpoint or Eotech. There are countless cheapo knockoffs I'm sure would get the job done. I could transplant the Millett Zoom Dot from my other M4, but then what to replace it with? That rifle has the flat gas block, which I don't want to change.
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Something like these: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138632613 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138720672 Or for a non flip-up rear with elevation adjustment: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138528810 |
Rick,
You can get a Magpul MBUS for the rear at about $55 +$0.01 shipping from AIM: http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/mpmag246a.jpg It fits under a magnifier nicely if you ever get one, say a set up like this with which a lot of BUIS are too tall to fit. http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/b...lamorshot1.jpg If you want a good low cost knock-off red dot, I really think you should consider the Primary Arms M3 multi-reticle sights. He's out of the 2 MOA multi-reticle right now, but he's expecting some before your Del-Ton kits should arrive. Marshall is a straight shooter and hasnt' tried to oversell his clones, which are sold along side his Aimpoints. His cantilever mount is nice and strong (puts the red dot at 1/3 co-witness). I don't see why some guys are willing to pay $100-$200+ for a cantilever mount from Larue or some of the favorites among the fanboys. Sure some have additional features, but IMO it's just fluff. When I was about to buy an Aimpoint CompML2, I shopped for a mount (Aimpoints don't come with a mount!) after which I said screw it. I would have spent $400 for the Aimpoint, then another $100+ for a mount. when I could have a mounted red dot from Primary Arms for $100. That was before I knew I could buy Marshall's $29 cant mount for the Aimpoint. I might have been OK with $430 or so for an Aimpoint+mount total, but for a lot less than that I now have two setups from PA, one with a 5X magnifier and one without a magnifier for a couple of different rigs. I really wanted the 10,000+ hr battery life of the Aimpoint, but figured it wasn't necessary if I just had a couple of spare batteries available for my PA sights. As it turned out, I picked up an LED flashlight from Walmart for $25 that uses two CR2 batterries. The light is less than 4" long of machined aluminum and fits in a 5-position quick dismount CAA holder that I got a while back. So I have a 115 lumens light that throws a beam 65 meters out for a total of no more than $65...and I have spare batterries for my red dot. As with Porsche parts, I can't stand to spend big money on over priced stuff that isn't necessary. The stuff we're buying for our range toys are just that...toys. If I was going into battle it would be a dififerent story. |
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1252245097.jpg
That's the setup my brother has on his AR. That Doctor sight is a complete and total ripoff (The freaking sight is $400, and the tiny little mount is another $100+ on top of it!!!), and the ACOG is not much better ($900 plus bucks, a good sight sure, but wtf). Both are blatantly over-priced prodcuts and that setup is no better than using regular tritium night sites with an on the handle high quality illuminated reticle 1.5-4x power scope (preferrably with milspec dots). A setup that would cost about 1/5th the price. I didn't tell my brother this because i didn't want to hurt his feelings, but it's the truth. |
ok, some noob questions again. what is a 'weaver' style mount, as opposed to a typical 'rail' mount? Does the weaver mean the 'hoop' portion, but they stillconnect to the rail? Im doing some searching for a handle mounted Aimpoint mount and ran across a few questions...
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They're almost the same thing really. A weaver usually just has less machined slots.
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eric Anyone go here: http://www.snipersparadise.com/ |
I think a guy named Low Light runs their forums there. I don't really know him, but he seems quite knowledgeable from the posts ive read, if it's the site i'm thinking of.
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eric |
ok, so an Aimpoint CompML3 will mount to a weaver handle top mount, like this one?
http://www.gunaccessories.com/ar15/ar15scopemounts.asp (scroll down to view) |
It should rattlsnake.
I was looking at this scope tonight for my AR. It's about perfect for real world capability when paired with tritium night sights: http://images.aandhmarketing.com/big...r/stm2732g.jpg 2x7x32, illuminated dual color mil-dot reticle, and one tenth of the cost of a magnified ACOG. On 2x with both eyes open and the reticle turned on it would work quite well as an occulated "Reflex" type sight, while still giving good long range capability on 7x. |
Snipe, what's the make and model of that one and are you talking about co-witnessing the reticle with the front sight?
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I'm talking about using the tritium iron sights as a backup in case the scope becomes inoperable.
The scope in my last post is a NCStar i think. Cost is about $120.00 (plus shipping) There are several similar units on the market if you want a "designer" name brand. This one has all the features i'm looking for in one unit, and is nice and compact. I'll mount it on my carrying handle on a sight through mount (first i'll do some googling on that specific model to check out some user reviews on it). They make this same scope in various mags including fixed 4x, 3-9x, and with a 42mm objective lens. I like a low minimum magnification though. A 2x settting is quite good for use as an OEG. Here's a link to the model i am most favorably considering: http://focuscamera.com/product.asp?id=964772156 The same site has the magnificed Trijicon ACOG for $1300.00..... |
My build is a flat top upper. I assume that unit will work on a flat top, no?
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Yep. It comes with a quick detatch mount already built in.
I wish to maintain a carrying handle on mine though, so i'll have to buy one of the sight through carry handle mounts. I think they're like $30.00 I qualified expert on Iron sighted M-16s every time i tried (4 times total- 3x on an A2, 1x on an A1. I achieved a grand total of 156 hits out of 160 possible on pop up targets from 25-300 meters. 3 of the 4 misses occured with my A1). Anyway, i have a tremendous amount of confidence in M16A2 Iron sights. I also like the rugged reliability and 15 year power source of trijicon iron sights as backups. Odds are that tritium iron sights are the only thing that will survive any kind of hand to hand combat if you need to use your rifle as a club/pike. While we're on that topic, i prefer the older M7 bayonet to the newer M9 for actual HTH combat. The M9 is a much more rugged and useful survival tool, but the older M7 "pig sticker" is a better bayonet for actual fighting IMO. They were known for breaking in half inside the enemy soldier, thereby causing extremely grevious wounds. The odds of having to use your rifle in HTH are very small, but it is a possibility. So best to be prepared. http://www.quarterbore.com/images/ba...chwithbayo.jpg M7 bayonet http://www.m9bayonet.com/images/rra-mid-m9bayonet.jpg M9 bayonet |
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Don't be tempted by other sub-par optics either (Barska, Leapers, UTG, BSA, BEC, etc.), even for plinking. At that price point, you would be better off with something like Bushnell's ACOG red-dot knock-off: http://swfa.com/Bushnell-1x32-Trophy-Red-Dot-Sight-P6913.aspx Here's a decent 3x option for under $300 from Burris: http://swfa.com/Burris-3x32-AR-Tactical-Sight-P12619.aspx For other fairly decent optics under $200, check out the Mueller, Vortex, UltraDot, etc. |
As i said, there are plenty of other manufacturers around that make the same basic scope configuration, if you want to pay more money and get more quality.
I've never used or seen an NCStar, and as i said, it's just representative of what i want, i'd check out reviews before i ever bought one. (as i stated in my last post). I do think that people often fool themselves with the "more money = better product" mindset though. Like these chicks that pay $300.00 for a $90.00 perm, or $1000.00 for a $100.00 purse. Seriously though....if you're buying an ACOG or a Doctor, you're paying at least a 100% markup just for the name alone. The 1x magnification scopes are utterly pointless IMO. Your iron sights already do that job, and if they're tritiums they do it round the clock...without batteries, for a fraction of the cost. When i was in the Army we used M-3A Leopold scopes on our M-21s. There are plenty of scopes around that are double the price or more, but the M3A does the job extremely well. We also used simple fixed 4x32 Bushnell scopes on our M-16s, and yes, they were cheap...but they also worked. I do understand your point though. If someone bought the -type- of scope i'm recommending with the name Redfield or Leopold on the side, i'd certainly not think they wasted their money. But Trijicon ACOGs and Doctors are blatant rip offs, that's my opinion. |
I looked at a bunch of NCStar reviews....no one had anything nice to say...at all.
This one looks pretty nice though...especially for the money. It's a Millet too, so the name brand gods are appeased. ;) The online reviews i was able to find seem pretty solid. Anyway, it's $220.00. http://www.bigrivertactical.com/i//dms_2008_2.jpg Millett DMS-1 Tactical 1-4x24 http://www.bigrivertactical.com/catalog/item/4193480/4454996.htm It is a bit on the long side for my taste though, so my search continues. |
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