Serious crime commited advise sought

adrian jaye · 10-28-2009, 03:47 AM

Hi Guy’s,

This is a serious question for my Canadian Porschephilles, I would appreciate the following:

1> Known Legal Advice (no guessing pls)
2> General advice

I was made aware of a serious crime last night that has happened to my wife’s best friend (at the moment I can only give you information as I know it).

Her friend for some months now has been systematically raped by her Brother in law. While she has been living in there house and being used as an unpaid maid/babysitter.

He has taken time of work and pre-meditated this as well on several occasions, also threatening her to silence. He is married and has a young daughter.

This only came to light that over the past month or so, she has been having very bad pain and her MD sent her to a hospital, where tests showed that she has an infected uterus and womb, the guy has a sexual issue/problem in the fact that he uses Viagra with his wife ( and possibly the assaults) she has said that he had used a lubricant (KY) on himself during the attacks, (question: could this cause a side effect and infection?)

Her familly confronted the guy and he admitted this, however this is where it all gets very cloudy

1> The hospital wont give her blood work test results as it’s a police case, only her MD, am concerned that she doesn’t know what she has.
2> Hospital (I think) advised her as these attackes where done over 48hours ago the guy cant be charged
3> She/her family keep referring to this as sexual molestation and not rape.
4> There is apparently a restraining order (she is now in a safe house)

So questions:
My wife has been made aware of this so, could she be in any trouble for not coming forward or reporting this crime?

Does anyone know any contact info on any rape counselling services in the Toronto area.

Can she report these attacks to the police as rape, I’m hoping as she has an infection, he also will have, so this may be a tie in.

I am worried that this guy will continue to abuse other people and must be stopped.

ANY advice you guys can offer will be much appreciated.

Excuse the ignorance on my part, am UK based so don’t know Canadian law/procedures. I get the feeling her family are absolute idiots.

If I was there, I’d certainly be taking charge and helping her, unfort. I cant

Thanks all

Adrian

imcarthur · imcarthur's Garage

Toronto Rape Crisis Centre

Ministry of Community and Social Services - How to Section

I don't know the answers to the legal questions but if I can help, let me know.

Ian

adrian jaye · 10-28-2009, 04:08 AM

thankxs for the links Ian will check

(if I can at work, they may have blocked that)

imcarthur · imcarthur's Garage

For legal advice: Ontario Women's Justice Network

Ian

1990C4S · 04:27 AM

she has said that he had used a lubricant (KY) on himself during the attacks, (question: could this cause a side effect and infection?)

No, not on it's own

Her familly confronted the guy and he admitted this, however this is where it all gets very cloudy

Do you have witnesses to his confession? Those that know need to come forward to the police also.

2> Hospital (I think) advised her as these attackes where done over 48hours ago the guy cant be charged

I think this comment relates to forensic evidence, not the laying of charges.

3> She/her family keep referring to this as sexual molestation and not rape.

Canadian criminal code charge would be rape (intercourse) or sexual assault.

My wife has been made aware of this so, could she be in any trouble for not coming forward or reporting this crime?

From 1. and 4. below it appears to be a moot point, the police are now involved.

1> The hospital wont give her blood work test results as it’s a police case, only her MD, am concerned that she doesn’t know what she has.

4> There is apparently a restraining order (she is now in a safe house)

Can she report these attacks to the police as rape, I’m hoping as she has an infection, he also will have, so this may be a tie in.

Yes, this is rape.

ANY advice you guys can offer will be much appreciated.

Do not trust the police entirely. Hire a criminal lawyer, or go to legal aid.

jeffgrant · 10-28-2009, 04:24 AM

Call the cops, tell them, and they will handle everything.

One of my best friends was abducted and sexually assaulted by 2 guys in Toronto a couple of months ago, and the police and hospital did an excellent job helping her.

Most of your thoughts are completely off base, by the way.

The police will most definitely treat this as rape, if that's what it was, and there's no "48 hour" rule from a criminal perspective. Maybe from a medical treatment standpoint, but that's another issue.

The hospital has, for lack of a better term, a "post-rape" series of treatments that are administered when the health status of the attacker(s) is unknown. They may or may not apply this in this case, seeing as the attacker is known, and is available for testing, and it's been ongoing for quite a while.

The police have specialists that are assigned to the case to help the victim, both during and after the event.

My friend is still going through counselling, and is being assisted financially while she gets her "stuff" sorted out.

And I find it curious why you're worried about whether or not your wife is going to get in trouble, when really you should forget about that and just tell someone in authority, like the police. Do not rely on the family's decisions in this matter, as they are too involved and biased.

And a child is not a reason to NOT tell, it's the best reason TO tell... who knows what that sicko could be, or will be doing to her.

I'm sure 911 isn't blocked from your work, I'd really suggest you use it.

$0.02

PS: Don't mean to be a dick or anything, but I've had 3 women in my life that have been raped, and I see the life-long scarring that results. I have never been as enraged or helpless as when it's happened to them, and it really touches a nerve when I hear about it.

adrian jaye · 10-28-2009, 04:29 AM

Thanks guys'
all great advice much appreciated.

PS the websites were not blocked,

jeffgrant · 10-28-2009, 04:29 AM

Maybe I misunderstood... I thought the police hadn't been informed. I guess the restraining order was a result of this incident?

As to getting her help, start with Victim's Services (the police will provide her with the contact number).

They may not be able to help with everything, but they will be able to provide a WHOLE bunch of information on who you/she can contact for assistance.

adrian jaye · 04:46 AM

Thanks Jeff,

No, I've specfically said to her the first thing is to report to the police (I like told her at least 50 times)

On the wife thing, I am concerned in that I am not sure that if you are party to information on a crime and you DONT report it (in this case) wether you can be in trouble. As far as I feel this is a relevant question.

Again there's a lot of cloudy water and I DONT know what has or hasnt been done, my wife is going to be talking to her today to find out.

I am just really trying to find out facts as i said from a Canadian POV, and no your not a dick, I absolutly appreciate your feedback and response mate.

FWIW, a previous ex of mine was similalry in a situation where
her husband (she was Asian) took her to dubai on work and contunally abused/raped and battered her, she could not leave the country as he had her passport, she managed to escape , divorced him and never looked back

This is also a subject which is close to my wife's heart as well, for different reasons.

So believe me I've been there myself

cheers

Adrian

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffgrant

Call the cops, tell them, and they will handle everything.

One of my best friends was abducted and sexually assaulted by 2 guys in Toronto a couple of months ago, and the police and hospital did an excellent job helping her.

Most of your thoughts are completely off base, by the way.

The police will most definitely treat this as rape, if that's what it was, and there's no "48 hour" rule from a criminal perspective. Maybe from a medical treatment standpoint, but that's another issue.

The hospital has, for lack of a better term, a "post-rape" series of treatments that are administered when the health status of the attacker(s) is unknown. They may or may not apply this in this case, seeing as the attacker is known, and is available for testing, and it's been ongoing for quite a while.

The police have specialists that are assigned to the case to help the victim, both during and after the event.

My friend is still going through counselling, and is being assisted financially while she gets her "stuff" sorted out.

And I find it curious why you're worried about whether or not your wife is going to get in trouble, when really you should forget about that and just tell someone in authority, like the police. Do not rely on the family's decisions in this matter, as they are too involved and biased.

And a child is not a reason to NOT tell, it's the best reason TO tell... who knows what that sicko could be, or will be doing to her.

I'm sure 911 isn't blocked from your work, I'd really suggest you use it.

$0.02

PS: Don't mean to be a dick or anything, but I've had 3 women in my life that have been raped, and I see the life-long scarring that results. I have never been as enraged or helpless as when it's happened to them, and it really touches a nerve when I hear about it.

adrian jaye · 10-28-2009, 04:43 AM

see I asked this too

wondering why this guy's ass has not been hauled to jail.

its very cloudy and 3rd party info,

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffgrant

Maybe I misunderstood... I thought the police hadn't been informed. I guess the restraining order was a result of this incident?

jeffgrant · 10-28-2009, 12:48 PM

Unless they have solid evidence of the crime, it's just a case of he-said, she-said at this point.

If it goes like the others I've been involved with, they're probably going to investigate until they find enough evidence to recommend charges to the Crown, and then Crown Counsel will decide what will be done at that point.

1990C4S · 10-28-2009, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffgrant

Unless they have solid evidence of the crime, it's just a case of he-said, she-said at this point.

Which is reason to get legal help. She likely knows relevant and important facts that a lawyer can bring forward.

Not saying all police are lazy or uninterested. But a lawyer will over that issue if you end up there.

MRM · 01:59 PM

This is an excellent case by sexual assault standards and can easily be prosecuted. The rape is corroborated with physical evidence, time and location of the perpetrator, and a confession witnessed by family members. Regardless of the manner of the evidence and the lack of a recorded confession, this is all excellent evidence that will corroborate her story, and can in fact carry the day if she gets cold feet and tries to not cooperate.

The only thing to do is call the cops and then see if you can offfer the victim some help and support. What do you do when a CRIME was committed? You report it to the police. You do not weigh the evidence, you do not judge the likely credibility of the witnesses, you don't impose your own exclusionary rules or moral standards. You call the cops.

The police's job is to investigate cases like this. That's what they do. What they do with the case is up to them, but it is up to the witnesses to turn the bad guy in. Hell, give me the victem's name and contact information and I'll make the report. The cops don't care where the initial information comes from.

And no, the wife/other witness probably can't get in trouble for not reporting the crime unless she aided in some way.

Edit: There is no difference between sexual molestation and rape. There is no such thing as a 48 hour rule. She probably was told that DNA evidence can't be collected more than 48 hours after the assault. A restraining order does not mean the assaults were reported to the police. From the fact pattern it sounds like the assaults were not reported to the cops. I repeat my offer to make the report personally if she does not want to do it.

adrian jaye · 10-30-2009, 05:07 AM

thanks MRM (et -al)

all feedback appreciated

Quote:

Originally Posted by MRM

This is an excellent case by sexual assault standards and can easily be prosecuted. The rape is corroborated with physical evidence, time and location of the perpetrator, and a confession witnessed by family members. Regardless of the manner of the evidence and the lack of a recorded confession, this is all excellent evidence that will corroborate her story, and can in fact carry the day if she gets cold feet and tries to not cooperate.

The only thing to do is call the cops and then see if you can offfer the victim some help and support. What do you do when a CRIME was committed? You report it to the police. You do not weigh the evidence, you do not judge the likely credibility of the witnesses, you don't impose your own exclusionary rules or moral standards. You call the cops.

The police's job is to investigate cases like this. That's what they do. What they do with the case is up to them, but it is up to the witnesses to turn the bad guy in. Hell, give me the victem's name and contact information and I'll make the report. The cops don't care where the initial information comes from.

And no, the wife/other witness probably can't get in trouble for not reporting the crime unless she aided in some way.

Edit: There is no difference between sexual molestation and rape. There is no such thing as a 48 hour rule. She probably was told that DNA evidence can't be collected more than 48 hours after the assault. A restraining order does not mean the assaults were reported to the police. From the fact pattern it sounds like the assaults were not reported to the cops. I repeat my offer to make the report personally if she does not want to do it.

adrian jaye · 11-03-2009, 02:49 AM

just to let you know that, again this is a bit sketchy.

As I thought she'd had a restraining order, apparently she cant get a restraining order unless she presses charges.

Which she has done, she's been interviewed by the CIB and she was taped/video and apparently they believe her 110% , so things are going through...

again this is 3rd hand information so pls appreciate the info provided

anyway

thanks for all your advise on this

cheers

Adrian