Home Insulation Questions

Superman · 12-07-2009, 01:44 PM

The heating bill thread reminds me of some questions I have. I have a brick home, and I'm not sure the walls are insulated. I need to look/figure out how the wood framing is attached to the roman brick exterior, and whether there is insulation between them (I assume this is where insulation goes).

If this area (between the exterior and interior walls) is not insulated, then I wonder how to get insulation in there. Blow it in? Can the blower machines be rented?

Then there is the matter of attic insulation. There is some up there, but not a lot.

Superman · 12-07-2009, 01:45 PM

The house was built in 1953.

Rick V · 12-07-2009, 01:47 PM

Around here you can't buy the insulation cheaper than you can have it installed. I did my own house then found out that it would have cost me $100 less to have a company come in and do it.

Dave L · 12-07-2009, 02:16 PM

I had a 50's brick bungalow, it was plaster on lathe and had no insulation in the walls. We had an energy audit and they had recommended that I add more insulation in the attic as thats where the majority of the heat loss would take place. I would get quotes to do the walls but only after being sure that you have more than enough in the attic.

RWebb · RWebb's Garage

check with your utility - most PNW utilities have a deal with BPA to insulate customer homes - they will inspect; make some educated guesses & give you a loan for various "best things" to do

this last summer, I pulled down the interior wall panels & ceiling in my lower floor - put in radiant heating & pink board insulation on the est. walls. it wuz hell... but. but.

spray in foam is great, but you cannot have any existing insulation in there - also I haven't seen them go inside for walls - I see them going in thru holes they cut in ext. walls

javadog · 12-07-2009, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Superman

The heating bill thread reminds me of some questions I have. I have a brick home, and I'm not sure the walls are insulated. I need to look/figure out how the wood framing is attached to the roman brick exterior, and whether there is insulation between them (I assume this is where insulation goes).....Then there is the matter of attic insulation. There is some up there, but not a lot.

A typical brick veneer wall is constructed like this, from inside to outside:

Interior finish (sheetrock, plaster, etc.)
Wood stud
Exterior sheathing
Air Space
Brick

The insulation is in the cavities of the wood stud wall. In the old days, there was typically a vapor barrier placed on the inside face of the wood framing.

You don't want to put insulation in the space between the wood framing and the brick, it needs to be open in that area.

I'd look into insulating the attic first, then see what your utility usage looks like. Insulating the walls would not be cheap.

JR

dipso · 12-07-2009, 06:02 PM

I had our house blown with insulation. It's less expensive than buying rolls or batts and trying it yourself.
An insulation company will come out and blow your attic and walls in about 1/2 a day.

In our situation we had stucco walls and siding in the front. A team works the gun, the first guy drills 2" holes in each wall cavity. One above the fireblock and one below. The second guy fills the wall with insulation and the third throws a 2" plug in it. There's a guy in the truck pouring insulation in the hopper.
We had ours done from the exterior.
It is up to you to finish the plug and paint.

Since you have a brick exterior they can blow the walls from the inside. Same theory just through the drywall instead.
I have seen it done this way too.

The breakdown for insulation is 60,30,10. You lose 60% of your heat or cooling through the roof. You lose 30% of your heat or cooling through the walls and 10% through the floor.

Our attic and walls made a noticeable difference. Then when I changed to dual pane windows that was it.
You really need it all to work properly.

david914 · 12-07-2009, 06:57 PM

Not trying to hijack, but our house is circa 1956 and it may apply to Sup's question as well...

What do you do when your construction is:

Plaster on plaster board (sheetrock)
Wood furring strips
Cinder block
Brick

No insulation in the walls and the cavity between the sheetrock and the cinder block is open to crawl space below and attic above. Can't be good. House has fairly new heat pump but is very difficult to heat in Winter. Do you seal wall cavity to prevent cold drafts from crawl space to attic?

dipso · 12-07-2009, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david914

Not trying to hijack, but our house is circa 1956 and it may apply to Sup's question as well...

What do you do when your construction is:

Plaster on plaster board (sheetrock)
Wood furring strips
Cinder block
Brick

No insulation in the walls and the cavity between the sheetrock and the cinder block is open to crawl space below and attic above. Can't be good. House has fairly new heat pump but is very difficult to heat in Winter. Do you seal wall cavity to prevent cold drafts from crawl space to attic?

Check what your neighbors have done. I am sure somebody has insulated.

williecoyote · 12-07-2009, 07:22 PM

As DaveL has stated the majority of your heat loss is out the top. The simple thing that will make the most difference as already mentioned is to blow insulation into your attic. The local building code will dictate how much.
The next part as also mentioned is to have insulation blown into the stud cavities in the walls.

Gordo2 · Gordo2's Garage

Take a good look into it before you get started, I'm fairly confident you can get a significant tax credit for improving your home's efficiency (green for green).

Gordo

williecoyote · 12-07-2009, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david914

Not trying to hijack, but our house is circa 1956 and it may apply to Sup's question as well...

What do you do when your construction is:

Plaster on plaster board (sheetrock)
Wood furring strips
Cinder block
Brick

No insulation in the walls and the cavity between the sheetrock and the cinder block is open to crawl space below and attic above. Can't be good. House has fairly new heat pump but is very difficult to heat in Winter. Do you seal wall cavity to prevent cold drafts from crawl space to attic?

In your case, you would have to cut access holes through the plaster, and then use a core drill to drill into the cinder block, in order to fill the cavities with insulation. There is an insulation which is used with cinder block construction which looks like pellets. (This is assuming that there is no way to access the block from the attic.) You may want to plug the wall cavity at the top, and bottom with fiberglass, to prevent drafts. (I'll have to check on this one.)

island911 · 12-07-2009, 08:23 PM

Yeah, it's freaking cold out ... low of 13° F !?

Supe, first attack any air leaks. Then windows, then ceiling, then walls. (assuming that you are looking for bang for the buck.)

RWebb · RWebb's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by williecoyote

... use a core drill to drill into the cinder block, in order to fill the cavities with insulation. ...

just tear the roof of the house off and pour those insulation pellets down the channels in the cinder blocks. then drop the roof back on & YUR DONE!

williecoyote · 12-08-2009, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWebb

just tear the roof of the house off and pour those insulation pellets down the channels in the cinder blocks. then drop the roof back on & YUR DONE!

Probably wouldn't spill as much this way.

javadog · 12-08-2009, 04:47 AM

Back in the old days, block walls were typically filled with vermiculite. That may be the case with your situation, in which case you can probably do nothing further to the concrete block portion of the wall. If you can see down into the cells of the block from up in the attic, see if they have something in them. There may be a piece of wood acroos the top of the block, in which case you'll have to drill a hole.

JR

turbo6bar · 12-08-2009, 05:50 AM

Agree that air sealing should be first priority. I don't think you should necessarily upgrade windows if you have no insulation in your walls. Then, your windows would have higher a r-value than walls. If the windows are leaky, by all means replace.

Any area where you can put insulation where none existed before should be your priority (after addressing air infiltration). Taking insulation from zero to R-2 cuts heat loss/gain by 50%.

Blown cellulose in the attic presents great value and is supposedly is better than fiberglass for convective heat transfer. Blowing cellulose in the walls works. I suspect trouble getting the cellulose placed without voids. The rental insulation blowers are terrible. They don't break down the insulation. The blower is weak. I tried to find a rental when I was building my house. I couldn't find anything commercial and ended up buying a Krendl machine. That's what you need. You're a long hike from TN, though. jurgen