When does a Fine become a TAX?

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by island911

The bottom line is; Responsible people/entities plan smartly for future stability.

A State, that big, bringing in billions upon billions, should have some pretty serious reserves. --not living 'paycheck to paycheck.

To point to "revenue has declined 14% in the recession." as an excuse is just pathetic.

Californian, above all, has been spending like a spoiled drunk kids, with some other kid's parent's credit-card.

Just so

After prop 13 passed, the legislature could have VERY easily changed their spending habits, during the dot com boom, they could have spent on infrastructure, rather than giving away the farm to the state employee unions and for all appearances, acted as though the incredible growth in revenue would continue forever, they could spend the gasoline taxes only on roads, they could do their jobs, represent the people instead of themselves.

If I behaved with my personal finances the way this state does, I would be thrown in prison.

I will grant you that the initiative process is a bad way to make law or financial decisions.
In case you missed the other people who have said it over and over again, it is a spending problem, not a revenue problem.

[Noah930]

As a new homeowner in CA, I could argue that Prop 13 gives me the short end of the stick. But what would truly be the short end of the stick would be if, in 15-20 years after I've "paid my dues," the state were to wipe out Prop 13 and make me "pay my fair share." As if I hadn't already done so.

How do you repeal Prop 13?

[Noah930]

Also, if revenue collection is becoming a primary responsibility of our LEOs, why not have more CHPs camp out on highway onramps, catching the diamond (carpool) lane scofflaws? The occasions I sit at the end of the line at the bottom of the onramp in the non-carpool lane, invariably at least one or two vehicles will zoom by with only the driver. Unless I can't see some supershort passenger or someone's riding in the trunk. Why not catch those sociopaths at $400 a pop--it'll be like shooting fish in a barrel.

[A930Rocket]

I agree it's difficult, but there are those with a legit use of an ARM. Having been in construction for 20 years, the last three homes I built for myself were with a 5/1 ARM because I had sweat equity in the house. They always appraised for well more than I built them for and we never lived in them more than three years. I sold my last house after I got RIF'd two years ago and made 100k.

Of course, that's all come to an end, as NOBODY seems to be able to get a construction loan these days. It's all cash or a large percentage of your money and you own the lot. The pendulum has swung too far the other way, after all the douchbag flippers, wannabe builders, banks and the Gov screwed it up.

....The problem with this is it's SO murky and case-by-case as to who bought speculatively and who bought honestly - expecting to live there for a while. It's a difficult if not impossible thing to determine. If ANYONE gets aid, it should only be those who bought in good faith, not looking to do a "quick flip", but how do you determine that? I'd say you could probably exclude all the ARM loans (these were taken typically by speculators hoping to dump the property before the reset) but it's possible that some bought "in good faith" looking to live in the place with an ARM hoping to refi, which now they can't do because the banks won't lend. It would unfairly penalize them I suppose, but maybe it's still better than doing nothing if this segment of the economy really is "too big to fail".

[Hugh R]

One thought on Prop 13 is education of kids. Newer families into an area that is expanding create demand for more schools, should the people who lived there for 25 years and now have grown up kids be paying as much for those new schools as those younger families, with kids who bought the house in the new tract?

[Jim Richards]

Originally Posted by Noah930

Also, if revenue collection is becoming a primary responsibility of our LEOs, why not have more CHPs camp out on highway onramps, catching the diamond (carpool) lane scofflaws? The occasions I sit at the end of the line at the bottom of the onramp in the non-carpool lane, invariably at least one or two vehicles will zoom by with only the driver. Unless I can't see some supershort passenger or someone's riding in the trunk. Why not catch those sociopaths at $400 a pop--it'll be like shooting fish in a barrel.

In Northern VA the state troopers work this extensively. Lots of easy money.

[Buckterrier]

Haven't read the whole thread but part of the answer to speeding is if a certain % of drivers 'speed' the state doesn't get federal funds The Republic of Ma. could care less there is WAY to much traffic in the states. They changed the limit from 55 to 65mph not because it made sense in this hussle-bussle society but because they were loosing federal $ since the % of 'speeders' was over the national limit.

[Jim Richards]

Originally Posted by Hugh R

One thought on Prop 13 is education of kids. Newer families into an area that is expanding create demand for more schools, should the people who lived there for 25 years and now have grown up kids be paying as much for those new schools as those younger families, with kids who bought the house in the new tract?

It's a tax subsidy borne on other taxpayers backs. Property tax covers more services than schools. Besides, the schools contribute to your home's property value (at resale), whether your family is currently using the schools or not. Every homeowner in CA would, in theory, pay less taxes if this subsidy was abolished.

[Jim Bremner]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

It's a tax subsidy borne on other taxpayers backs. Property tax covers more services than schools. Besides, the schools contribute to your home's property value (at resale), whether your family is currently using the schools or not. Every homeowner in CA would, in theory, pay less taxes if this subsidy was abolished.

Far from the truth. There's a mandate on tax that it MUST be X percent. My City has a revenue problem. THEY CANNOT SPEND ALL OF THEIR REVENUE QUICK ENOUGH.Cerritos Millennium Library - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia They spent MILLIONS building the second building in the world that is covered in TITANIUM! They had to spend 1 million bucks to prevent the State from getting it so they landscaped 1 freeway off ramp.

The more Tax revenue they get they will spend it.

[Jim Richards]

That's why you have elections. Work on changing how you local and state gov't spend your money.