Carfax

[Embraer]

It appears that carfax doesn't let you have a monthly subscription anymore....so, why is it in poor form to ask for a report any more? All of them have to be paid for, so it would really be gifting a report (already paid for) to a pelican buddy, not stealing it. gone are the days of unlimited reports, which could lead to abuse.

it's a tool for buying a car. just as much as borrowing a specialty tool for working on a car.

i understand the rules....but.......

[McLovin]

That's an excellent point.

In fact, it doesn't seem that under Carfax's new setup, giving away what ever is left of your paid for searches is prohibited.

They still are concerned about not using the "consumer" carfax ($45 for 5 searches) for "commercial" purposes. It needs to be non-commercial use, i.e., "personal" use. But giving away your remaining searches to someone (as long as they aren't a dealer) is not commercial and does not appear to be against their current rules/agreement.

They are still concerned about "commercial" v. "non-commercial/personal" use because, contrary to what most people think, they charge even MORE to dealerships and other commercial accounts! Regular consumers just looking for a car actually get a price break. That's why Carfax's biggest concern was dealerships using multiple credit cards to buy "personal" accounts and using them in their commercial business.

That was particularly true under the old structure, with $40 per month and "unlimited" searches, a dealership could get 40-50 searches before they got cut off. That would lower their cost to $1 per search, compared to the roughly $15/search for a commercial account. Added up, it could make a big difference on a small dealerships expenses.

That old system was difficult for Carfax to monitor. They monitored usage very closely, and if you did sometimes as few as 25 searches on their supposed "unlimited" program, they'd cut you off. You'd then have to contact them and "prove" you weren't a dealer. Pissed a lot of people off, and was an administrative nightmare for Carfax.

They'd also monitor websites like Pelican and other big car boards, and send warnings to the operators to not provide a forum for the sharing of "unlimited" Carfax accounts.

This new system is a lot easier for Carfax, for the most part it eliminates the problem by putting rough parity between the commercial and personal prices.

I have to hand it to Carfax. They did an excellent job creating a market out of thin air. They built it up to have huge market value, initially by keeping prices low. Now that they are the market leader, they are really sticking it to people/businesses with their pricing. The market could use more competition. AutoCheck is being used by more and more dealerships because their pricing is more aggressive.

Anyways, it doesn't seem like "sharing" your paid for $45/5 search account is a violation of the agreement. And, even if it technically is, I doubt Carfax cares anymore, since the account is limited to 5 searches and they have in effect been all paid for.

[kaisen]

Carfax (and Autocheck, etc) is garbage in / garbage out
They market to fears
Generally a waste of money

If you know what state(s) it has been titled in, you can usually get accident reports and title 'branding' info directly from the DMV. Most have a VIN look up on their websites. And it's free.

Otherwise, look over the car very well and develop your own opinion. If you're concerned about previous accident history, ask a bodyshop to give it a PPI just like you'd have a mechanical shop.

[porsche4life]

Carfax means pretty much nothing to me... I've seen several cars with clean reports that have OBVIOUS wreck repairs....

[Embraer]

There are some pertinent details that can be acquired through Carfax, and the like.

I managed a high-end European only body shop, and of course lots of stuff never made it into a Carfax history (even totaling cars....adjusters, tow companies, and body shops can all be less than honest.)

That being said, I would hardly say it's worthless. ...Especially from the dealer/wholesaler point of view.

Using it in concert with your own inspection (if you're qualified to do so) is a great way to increase your fact finding.

[Noah930]

CarFax isn't totally useless. If the report comes back clean, the vehicle may still have problems. But if something on CarFax comes back fishy, even if the car looks clean you know you'll be asking a lot more detailed questions.

[kaisen]

Again, GIGO..... if the data is good, the report is worthwhile, if not...
So, if the report is only as good as the data, and the data is known to be spotty, how do you trust any one report? Esp when you have to pay $45??

Example: My 2007 Ford F250 Harley
I was backing a large car trailer up a hill at the lake. Narrow tree-lined drive. Short story, my open door caught a tree and bent the door backwards. Oops.

$5500 later, I had a new Ford door, the A-pillar was trued on a frame rack, and the entire LH side was repainted except the bed to match the color and factory painted flames. I did turn it in to insurance (American Family).

Sold the truck the following year. Told the guy about the paintwork. He pulled a CarFax. No record. He was pretty upset with CarFax.

[widebody911]

I don't see what the problem was either. For $45, I get to run 5 reports. To me, it's no different than buying a 6 pack of beer and giving away the 4 I don't want to drink.

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by kaisen

Again, GIGO..... if the data is good, the report is worthwhile, if not...

I looked at an E46 M3 a while back; the CarFax was clean, but once it was on the lift it was obvious that the front and rear suspension had been replaced on the right side, and there was ample evidence of a repaint.

[McLovin]

Carfax is and isn't useless.

If you are relying on it to ensure the car has never been in an accident, it is likely useless. Clean Carfax of course doesn't guarantee no accidents.

But, the problem is it doesn't matter what you or I think of Carfax, it matters what the market thinks. And the market, for the most part, thinks it's good.

So, it's IMO foolish to not get a Carfax on a car you are considering buying.

First, if there is something negative on it, you should know before you buy. Even if you still want the car, you can use it to negotiate the price down.

Second, if you ever go to sell the car, that negative Carfax is going to hurt you. You will have potential buyers lost because of the negative Carfax, and of the ones that aren't lost, you'll have a lot grinding you down. Yeah, ultimately you'll sell the car, but the negative Carfax won't make that job any easier.

That may or may not be ok with you, but you should at least know before you buy the car so you can take it into consideration.

Kinda sucks, esp. given the increased prices, but that's just the reality.