Questions for home builders/custom ..Please advice...
 

Looking into building a house but have few questions ?
1)- What's the average cost/sq ft for a custom build ? Good builders around here where we live are costing about $150+/sq ft,is that too much?
2)-I know a local good commercial builder that wants to build our house for $120/sq ft which i think is pretty reasonable. Now the question is,why so much difference ?
3)-What questions do i need to ask them especially the 2nd one to make sure he is building a nice house ?
4)- Our requirements are, a nice brick out side with nice floor tiles/granite tops and good kitchen cabinets.
Please advice.
Thanks

Not a builder but you'll never get apples to apples.

In this housing market your dollars will probably go MUCH farther buying a forced sale.

My tip would be to pick a design then get quotes for the major options directly from subs. Things like real hardwood floors, granite counters, custom cabinets, etc. Get it as far as you can so that you end up comparing pricing for a shell with particular specs (ie 2x6 walls, engineered floor joists, 40yr shingles, xxxxx windows, xxx size HVAC).

A good builder will be on site fixing things that go wrong. A poor builder (National guys) will send a bunch of mexicans out and say 'good luck'.

Reputation is key. That's where the research should start. It goes beyond the build, what's their rep for dealing with post build/warranty issues. A lot of them forget you exist after the sale.

The diff in cost per sq ft will be in grade and amount of materials like granite, tile etc...

If you simply give him your requirements, "a nice brick out side with nice floor tiles/granite tops and good kitchen cabinets." without them being specifically spelled out then don't be surprised if his interpretation of nice and good are different than yours.

Research builders, get one with a good rep, look at the plans for models that they've built, ask to go see one either currently under construction or already sold. Many times they will pay a customer to show their house. Our builder paid us to show our house 4-5 times after we moved in.

There are a lot of variables, square ft. cost is just a broad base, it can include the living area (air cond. area) or it can include the garage, porch, etc. Does the cost include building permit, impact fees, septic tank or water/sewer hookup.

You should first develop a plan, either from an existing set or modify a floor plan to what you want different. If the plans do not have specifications built-in, on the plans, then someone needs to specify these details, i.e. size of footers, steel, concrete strength, lumber dimensions, - it is a long and detailed process to arrive at a comprehensive cost and bid. One contractor may provide allowances, $6./sf labor & material for tile, $30/sy carpet, - eitherspecify model numbers of applilances or use allowance. I think you get the picture.
A good and competent contractor will sit with you and go thru all the details. Get references, check licenses - it can be a great experience or a nightmare - someone once said building a home is one of the most stressful situations on a marriage that can happen.
PM me if you need more specifics, retired now but 30 plus yrs. as contractor.

My advice as a consultant to the industry and a former contractor would be to get as detailed a set of plans and specifications you can prior to starting the bidding process. The less detailed you are with respect to the materials, quality of construction, etc. the more likely the bidders will provide lowest cost alternatives to lessen the price of their bids. No bidder will assume you want gold-plated toilet seats unless you specifically tell them so.

After you have as detailed a set of plans as you can reasonably create, go out to bid. Use only licensed, insured and fully bonded pre-qualified contractors. Let the bidders know in advance that you will be accepting 3 to 4 bids from equally qualified, quality contractors. After the bids are in, then meet with the lowest 2 bidders to review the missing details. What did you assume here for carpet, tile, windows, etc? Take notes.

Draw up a contract that details everything, if you have the manufacturer of the exact item you want installed in your home, name it in the contract. This is often included as an attachment to the contract we sometimes call the "scope of work."

Further in the contract get an agreement on the length of time for the construction, agreed hourly rates for changed work, insurance coverage, required lien releases from the general contractor and all material suppliers, subcontractors on the project. Who will pull and pay for permits (I would recommend you have the contractor do this as a part of the contract). Specify how monthly/bi-weekly progress payments will be made and hold retention (typically 10%) until the entire project passes final inspection.

Just a start, but at least doing this much you can to be sure you are getting an accurate bid and protecting yourself from major pitfalls as the work progresses.

If you have any other questions, just ask.

One more thing, as a custom remodeling contractor, I advice my clients and written in my contracts that I do not except final payment after final inspection, but the both party must agree to the punch list. final inspection will pass if a faucet is not on straight and the granite top is not align property and the paint in the hall way is a different shade of white. Contractor should take care of all that before he get his share of money. That's the way I have always done it. Good luck.

Look for the contractor who is actually building the homes the other contractors are selling.

We used subcontractors as the builders back in Texas in the late '90s. 2800 sqft, marble countertops, custom cabinets (locally built), custom design home from my plan (but a rather simple custom plan), 5.5" slab with 24" beams under it, antique wood floors, ceramic and porcelain tile, 3 bed/3 bath, 800 sqft garage, metal home with steel i-beams, and more than 6" of insulation all around for about $33.00 sqft. We did the painting, hanging of doors, installation of all flooring, I did all the location clean-up (no clean-up crew).

If you can do parts of the work you will save tonnes of money! Painting saved us $7,000.00. We put the floors in for about $2.75/sqft. Doing the floors saved us more than $15,000.00. That is alot of money!

I do not know what current prices are. At the time the local custom builders were quoting around $120.00/sqft on my plans. And IF I had gone the that route, the same subcontractors who built my home would have built my home for the custom builders.

All these guys are all offering absolutely excellent advise.
I recently completed my house as an owner/builder in SoCal. I'm retired and really stuck with the project from start to end, did about 95% of selecting the subs, gofering for materials, dealing with suppliers, tracking costs, getting permits & struggling with the County, scheduling, and everything else. I've never done it before, but I had the time and worked with contracts and managed people when I was working, and I've done a few things in construction when I was younger (45+ years ago - & not that that's too important).
The going rate around my area was around $150/s.f. several years ago for a fairly normal house. I ended up doing mine for around $135/s.f. for a totally custom house. It doesn't have super expensive stuff inside & out, but it is nice enough that people in the area talk about it and stop by to see & take pictures of it once in a while - not that that's particularly important to me but nice that they like it that much.
One thing I did was get a local carpenter/builder/etc. to act as a consultant for me when I had questions, and I paid him at an hourly rate for that. He was also the framer and did a lot of the finish stuff for me. Another thing I did at the beginning was get an attorney that did contract & civil law. I did end up having him call one guy and write a letter to another to straighten things up and get things going. He was well worth it. Plus the subs I had learned about that through the grape vine and kept it in mind. The more you are involved, the better it will be for you. It's a lot of work and effort, but by no means impossible.

Marv, that's really cheap for custom around here. You are on the hill side also aren't you? I saw the photo of your office with a cup of coffee on that chair. It has to be up there 160 bucks or more for the higher end finish details.

Yasir,

One more thing, if you are going the route of acting construction manager or contractor, check out your subs and ask for not only references, but visit their current and previous jobs to see their work or talk to the home owner. And ask about their crew.

I take clients to see and visit current projects all the time. It is had done wonders for all three parties. It makes me look good, current clients loves to show off their proj, and new clients get to interact with current clients which usually love us (mostly my crew). I do not have to say a word and they sell it for me.

Good subs or tradesmen should be able to give you sound advice on both pro and con about specific construction methods and cost.

Jeff

Yasir;

Are you in N. Kentucky by chance? Cincinnati is my hometown...

Two years ago, my wife and I built a 5046 sq foot home in SoCal. We also have a 22' x 40' attached garage. (we have no basement)

We read three or four books about subcontracting your own home, acquired financing and then built. We owned the lot for about 10 years prior to building. (CC&R's specify nothing smaller than 3000 sq feet and about 100 other things that are prohibited)

For kicks, we got bids from general contractors and EVERY SINGLE CONTRACTOR quoted the same thing. $150 per square foot. and they said don't expect high end finishes... F'ing Thieves...

So we did it ourselves. It was time consuming as heck, but very very simple. The toughest part was dealing with "The City." Plan check took a year. We paid $54,000 for "permits". (to be granted the privilege of building a stupid house on the stupid dirt that you already own.)

We did it for about $90 a sq foot, not including permit fees or of course the price of the lot.

We have a high end kitchen (48" thermador double oven stove, 48" thermador island hood, Viking "built in cabinet faced" fridge, thermador dishwasher, thermador trash compactor,) and I think 2 complete slabs of granite in the kitchen alone.

The master bath also has the same matching granite as the kitchen does, and even the laundry room has the same granite.

the entire ground floor 2,400 sq feet is travertine. the stairway and upstairs is carpet, except for the kids suite which is engineered hardwood. ( i laid the wood myself during construction).

the house has huge crown molding in every room. (it took the finish carpenters 2 months to do the baseboards and crown. that's why i had time to lay the hardwood floors myself)

We have a whole house fan, two AC units, and the entire house was hardwired with CAT6. (total waste of money. we use a wireless router. be critical of the "smart house geeks" ). We also have a central vacuum.


We bought 24, 8' tall, solid core interior doors. All bedrooms have walk in closets, there are no sliders in the house.

The front entry double doors are 8' x 42" mahogany. The rear doors are 8' x 36" french doors, also mahogany. (if i had it to do over, i would have bought iron front entry doors. hanging, staining and finishing the doors cost a fortune. another stupid mistake. people say that they are beautiful though...)

We have 118 feet of wrought iron railing up the steps and across an unsupported bridge that spans the living room. another stupid feature that cost alot of money that could have been avoided. the steel in the bridge alone cost over 8k. the installers said that it was ridiculous the thickness/strength that the engineer called for in the plans. The railings were another 15k. again, a stupid unnecessary expense that could have been avoided if the engineer had "been looking out" for me. If you draw your own plans, make sure that you tell them to point out any design features that are going to cost unusual amounts of money.

The living room/dining room has 21' ceilings. The room is 40' x 27'. Because of earthquake issues, this required shear walls on both interior walls as well as 8" thick exterior walls on the house. While this was nice for added insulation, had I known then what I know now, maybe I would have changed the design a bit to save in lumber costs. the flip side is that the house stays very warm in the winter and very cool in the summer so maybe it was worth the extra cost.

We put Hunter ceiling fans in every room except the living/dining room. They are awesome and very cheap to operate.

If you build a good sized house, you will need an intercom system. When you yell at your kids, it will echo and you won't know which direction you should be yelling. PREWIRE every place that you even think you might want to add an intercom later. We didnt wire the guest suite and wish now that we had. It would be nice to be able to inform guests via intercom that breakfast will be ready in 5 minutes etc... We prewired the garage and that is very convenient for the wife when she wants to make me come in...

Do all of your underground work (utilities) a few weeks BEFORE you pour the slab/dig the basement. We waited till after, and "The City" was a royal pain in the a$$ as far as the depth/placement of the underground vault and inspections of the depths of the gas line, electric panels etc.

Again, "The City" was the worst. They were liars and thieves. I will never build in California again.

Sq. Ft. Cost
 

Look 171
You got me to go back & take a look at my figures, and the cost came out to $151/s.f. The $138 figure was one the came to mind from a little before the final costs were paid. The house is 3.3K s.f. witihout the garage. Could be the lower construction cost was because of the simplicity of the building. My wife & I like the southwestern/pueblo (?) style. Here are a couple of overhead & patio pics.



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Also - Most contractors figure garage space at 1/2 the going rate. So &75/ft instead of $150/ft. When I was budgeting for my recent build, that really threw the figures off.

I got the cost down to $102/ft with high end cabinets, counters, floors this way:

Did myself:

Install siding
Install cabinets
Finish electrical - (all outlets, switches, lights, etc)
Finish Plumbing - (sinks, toilets, showers, facuets, dishwasher, etc)
All interior doors and trim - Finished the trim myself
Deck
Parking pad in front of garage - 35 X 22
1.5 acre lawn
Built pad/surround for wood stove

Found cheap subs for cash to:

Drywall
Paint - Interior and exterior
install hardwood floor

Silver whale shows why a competent builder may help, I.E. order of items to complete, dealing with the city, etc. My Workmans Comp rate and insurance rate ( which both protect the homeowner) are of the scale. But since we are all f in thieves....

Cover your ass.

Get GOOD contract documents (not just some "plans" you bought off of some dude on the Internet for 200 bucks). Do not skimp on things like document preparation, contracts, background research, etc. I strongly advocate getting a design professional on board - and keeping them on board to handle construction administration.

Best of luck. Cover your ass.

I built my last house (5K Heated SF) for about $130 PSF, including sticks, bricks, lot (one acre on the 5th hole). I guess it all depends on the market you build in as costs can be higher or lower for labor and matrials. Here in Charleston, it's higher than Charlotte, NC and Charotte was low lower than Atlanta, GA.


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I don't see this as possible, especially given how the house was described. Even if it's true, don't anyone else here think they can pull this off. You won't. It costs 60-70 sq ft to build tract houses when they are built by the 100's at a time.

The highest paid worker on this house couldn't have made over 15/hr. If it took 2 months to install crown and base, that's why.

Anyway, I'm happy that whaletail (or whaletale) got this done on his own because he saved some contractor somewhere from experiencing his worst nightmare.

Read my mind Milt. lol.

Is there a scumbag lawyer in the house? ;)

I was thinking the same but did not want to say anything. 2 months to do the crown in a 5000sq' home? How big can they be, even at 12" stain grade custom milled crown should not have thken that long. Maybe he hired the framers to hang crown.

5,046 sq feet x $150 sq ft = $756,900 (quoted by 3 general contractors)

Owner/Builder Cost:
Construction loan $395,000
permits/fees $ 54,000

=$449,000 ( $88.98 sq foot)

we probably spent another out of pocket, not budgeted $2,000 per month on "things that came up" during the 11 months that it took from groundbreaking to occupancy. $24,000 . ( Feb 2008 - Jan 2009 )

So $756,900
-$395,000
-$ 54,000
-$ 24,000

= $283,900 profit for a general contractor to "build" my house. (and that was with Kitchen Aid appliances, standard height hollow core interior doors and who knows what other kind of cheap interior finishes)

How many "jobs" does a typical custom home contractor "run" per year???
Two? $283 x 2 = $566,000 per year profit.
Three? $283 x 3= $849,000 per year profit.
Four? $283 x 4= $1,132,000 per year profit.

I just thought that it was highly suspect that all three GC's looked at the plans and then came back with "$150 sq foot", with no itemizations/specifications for materials and without mentioning the square footage of the garage (880 sq ft) in the bids.

The reality was, they had so much "money is no object" work in 2006 and 2007, they could have cared less whether they got my job or not.

subcontracting a single family residence is easy, but it is time consuming. If I built again, I would use the exact same contractors for every single trade, excluding electrical. Which would make building a second, third, fourth house per year, that much easier.

Sorry, but I just don't see the "need" for a general contractor. How can you possibly be sure of the quality of each individual Sub if you don't interview and check the work of each sub yourself???

Of course they come back at you with a specific amount per sq'. Why would they go through hell trying to get you specifics just to see if you might be interested in using their service (others have been very upset at me and want to slam doors at me face here on Off Topic because of this situtation). Have you ever itemization a job like that or even a 2500 sq' custom house? I am talking about really custom end not mid end off the self products. It can take you months calling various people. If you like their number, then you are expected to talk more with them about the job in detail. Most or all of those things should be in the plans and specs but often time, they are not, llike type of cabinets and plumbing and electrical fixtures. That's how they loose their a$$. I do not built, but I have done many custom whole house remodels. I often submit a bid for regular custom end cabinetw like maple and they except me to provide Teak or some exotic cabinetry because they have seen it at another client's home. Crazy.

You may not see the need for a general contractor. You apparently know enough to pull it off by yourself. I'm not sure what you paid yourself during the 11 months. Just kidding, you got nothing except for the savings which was a nice paycheck.

Now as to a GC building 4 houses within a year's time, he'd need a million for the business to run. So, I see that GC making the 132K for himself.

Numbers can mean anything you want them to. For every dollar I take in, I spend .48 on taxes and fixed overhead working out of the house. Then, I can have costs of sale.

You didn't pay a "profit" so no taxes were collected. No costs either. I can't blame anyone who builds on a regular basis for examining plans and "estimating" the job on a sq ft projection. You make more on some and less on others.

Here's a scenario that makes the difference: if the contractor has the job and you see something you don't like, he fixes it at his cost. If you are the owner/builder and any adjustments are on your dime, I bet the swiftest and least costly solution is employed. Contractors rarely get that benefit as homeowners tend to snivel endlessly.

Lastly, the State of CA requires any new home builder to stand behind the construction for 10 years. You have absolutely no more protection than the 2 years a licensed contractor has to provide on his part. If you used "employees." you get nothing.

If I have to watch over your home for 10 years, I'm building that in. Of course, that's what makes me a thief.

FYI, one of the contractors who "experienced his worst nightmare" with me is a well regarded Pelican with 3,439 posts. He owns what I would consider a large concrete contracting company who's business is, I think 90% commercial hardly any residential. His company poured my foundation (code + another 3 inches, right to the top of the forms per my request) and did a fantastic job on the slab. (the tile/granite company commented on the superb flatness of the pour and finish while installing the 18"travertine)

I went back to the Pelican at the end of the project to bid the flatwork, but his company does not do stamped/colored concrete. Every square inch of our driveway, sidewalks and rear patio is stamped, except for the front steps from the street, so we went with a different company, who is actually right next door to him.)

Oh and one more thing. We completed the job with only one Lien placed against us. The company who did the automatic fire sprinklers messed up the drywall texture around one of the sprinklers in the kitchen and I withheld $250 of the final payment to compensate myself for the cost to re-texture/repaint. That was the only adversarial relationship that we had with any of the contractors, and that was finally resolved well after occupancy.

And Milt, since your a window man, go ahead and ridicule me for choosing Home Depot, Jeld-Wen Brand, aluminum clad, double hung, gridded, low E, WOOD windows. I neglected to mention that the guys who painted and hung the crown and base also painted all of the windows, and trimmed out and painted all of the windows.

Every single window has casing. Two months was a long time, especially at the end, when you are itching to move in, but there are alot of windows and doors in this house. A tractor trailer truck was needed to deliver all of the base, crown, casings and moldings.

You guys are brutal. I feel stupid for even posting about this now...

Rancho Framing • 6890 Doolittle Ave., Riverside, CA 92503
(909)688-1391 • info@ranchoframing.com

John Williams Owner

I highly recommend them.

Hey pal, you might think we're brutal, but you're the one that started this off calling contractors "F'ing thieves." What the f did you expect, an invitation to dinner?

Protection?????

Every GC is an LLC. If he gets sued, he closes the LLC on Friday and starts up business under a new LLC on Monday. Im not interested in warranties. I was Onsite EVERY SINGLE DAY, usually multiple times per day. I know how this house was built.

Because of the construction slowdown, EVERY SINGLE FRAMER on my job was a WHITE foreman with AT LEAST 20 years experience. The non-white guys showed up only on the day that they lifted the walls on the first floor and then on the day that they lifted the walls on the second floor. Other than those two days, EXPERIENCED WHITE GUYS shot every nail that went into this house.

the only non-licensed, non insured trade that we "took a chance on" was the exterior stucco guy. We were quoted $45,000 for "smooth stucco" by all of the licensed contractors. We used a guy from Santa Ana who is used by a high end homebuilder buddy of mine on all of the jobs that my friend spec builds for himself. he did it for less than half that. We got the look that we wanted ( 1930's Hancock Park, west of downtown Los Angeles) at a price that we were willing to pay.

I ensured quality by constant involvement. Maybe I'll be okay on that, maybe I won't. But There is no way that I was going to pay a million dollars for a half million dollar structure.

please re-read my original post.

I believe i was referring to General Contractors and city governments.

My bad. Sorry if I offended.

You saw the green right?? Is this contractor a fkin thief too?

I read your original post. You may know me as a window sales and installation person, but I have carried a GC license since 1981 and have done a wide variety of work. Two years ago I superintended a remodel and 250 sq ft addition in West LA (yes, I know where Hancock Park is) that was more than half of what you spent on a whole house.

Why do I bring this up? Well, for one, I know costs for high end work. Two, I know what can come up on any given day due to any number of reasons.

I'm happy you could build a 5000 sq ft house after reading some books. No freakin' way could you have done what I did in WLA. I had 6 engineering changes in the process that all went thru the city of LA. That's just remodeling when you are dealing with a 1929 classic Spanish home.

You diss contractors as thieves.You diss contractors as starting up as a new LLC each week if they get in trouble. You can expect some flak here with that attitude.

BTW, if you bought windows at the Home Depot, I can absolutely guarantee you did not get the best price. A good contractor would know that.

Hope you didn't buy your drywall or lumber there.

My bad. Sorry if I offended.
Hollow. Really hollow. You ought to use that expression a little more meaningful.

I'm done here. I'm so pissed off at you and your kind that I hope to never see or meet you at any Porsche event.

If GC's made the profit/money your talking about, they would be billionaires. I used to work for a very large privately owned builder for 18 years and we realized .07 on every dollar of revenue.

Been a licensed GC and residential home builder for 15 years.

Jeld Wen, jeez. Maybe a Loewen clad or Fleetwood aluminum minimum. I commend you on your home. I think the subs you used are probably calling GCs for work, not homeowners. After reading your bio listing your occupation as "dirty cop" and that you like to "shoot people" I think I'll wander away from this thread, kidding or not. I have plenty of work, plenty of satisfied customers, and even have letters from people who didn't use me wishing they had. Peace.

Damn, I'm sorry to see this thread go so far south. I have to say that in general I was really happy with the subs I worked with on my house, and had/have a great deal of trust and respect for them. Even though I was completely new at it, they did their best to provide me with quality work and went out of their way to fit in schedule wise. I've found out since that they gave me the best in the way of features and finish, though at the time I did't know much about the difference. I didn't snivel about extra costs. Whenever something could be done better with a little more money or time and work, I authorized it and paid for it happily. Likewise, if I built another house, I'd come close to using the same people again. I've also had a number of people ask me about the subs I used and gave them really good recommendations. I don't feel like I got cheated and was happy to save some money not because I begrudged a GC making it. I had the time and wanted to watch over the project and enjoy the experience - which I did and it was due in good part to the guys working in the trade.

That's really nice to hear from a general contractor's stand point and as a sub contractor as well (cabinet maker, finish carpenter). NIce to know that there are people who still appricate the good and honest tradesmen. We are still pretty busy even in today's slow economy. The good ones will stay. As for some of the home owners (More then you want to know) who think we are rip off artist, so be it and good luck to them too.

I was on when the thread unravelled, and had to laugh. It's not personal, of course. Every professional, in any field, understands the value of his trade. He or she wouldn't exist if they didn't add value. Any job. Any trade. Any business.

I said 85% because there are always going to be people who don't appreciate the work we all do. Either they don't fully understand what you do, the risks involved, the education/preparation involved, or the overhead and expense involved.

Some of the 15% choose to do the work themselves. Some get lucky and things work out. Some don't. Any time you do something yourself, you are giving up the opportunity to do something else with your time. In this case, if you'd rather spend your hours babysitting the homebuilding process than working at your own business or spending quality time with family and friends, understand that your time wasn't free. If you want to get involved in swinging hammers, painting, or nailing trim, there is more money to be 'saved' if you have more time to 'spend'.

Most of us are on Pelican because we don't mind tinkering on cars. The Do It Yourself experience is rewarding. Sometimes financially, but mostly self-satisfaction. But do most people work on their own cars? Nope, not 85% of the public. Could you do your own work on anything and everything? Sure, but again 85% of people do not. They hire it done.

I chuckled at Milt because he has seen me defend my own profession. Similarly, most here do not see the value add in what I do. It's okay to attack the auto industry and call us effin' thieves. Almost all of you take jabs. Lawyers, general contractors, doctors (if you pay with your own cash), car dealers, morticians..... they are all thieves to someone.

I take pride in what I do. My customers are very happy. Many return.
Same with contractors and tradesmen.

I'll say it once more.

I have no problem with tradesmen or single trade contractors.

My issue is with General Contractors who "build" custom homes and expect what I feel is obscene compensation for simply managing the project. I have not met any GC custom home builders whom actually have "employees." These GC custom home builders simply obtain bids from tradesmen with whom they have ongoing working relationships, and then "sub out" the jobs to these sub contractors.

I am an idiot policeman with ZERO home construction experience, and yet, I was able to build a good sized custom home in 11 months, from groundbreaking to occupancy.

I worked my regular job (3 pm to 1 am, 4 days per week) and went to the job site on all of my days off and in the morning, before I went to work.

My wife is a stay at home mom, and she was also intricately involved on a daily basis.

I have been a policeman for a long time. I meet a lot of people, including contractors, through my job. I do my job in a manner that causes people to like me. When I contacted them and told them that I planned to build a house, they were eager to help me. They referred their tradesmen friends to me. Their tradesmen friends liked me and referred me to their tradesmen friends.

It was all very easy. Time consuming but easy.

We are not talking about esoteric skills/abilities/training here.

Two or three years ago, any idiot with good credit and a decent income could get a loan for any amount of money that he asked for. Many of these people ran to GC's who said, "$150 a sq ft." The people replied, "Where do I sign?" And now many of these people are losing their homes and lenders are losing their a$$es.

All I know is that we paid less than $500,000 for what I consider a $500,000 structure. MANY people that I know, including some of my neighbors, paid $700,000 - $800,000 for what I would consider a $300,000 or $400,000 structure. (I am leaving the purchase price of the dirt out of the equation.)

My house is not super high-end but it is very comfortable, roomy, well equipped, sturdy and we think nice.

To each his own.

Good luck in obtaining a product (your house, which is likely your biggest single investment that does not throw off passive income) that meets your expectations after "trusting" a GC to look after your interests instead of spending your own "hours babysitting the homebuilding process."

SWT,

My GC planned to make about 5% on our build. Our house was an experiment for both of us. He made closer to 10% as we found ways to cut costs in the build. Our house allowed him to know what he could bid and remain profitable on future constructions using good manufacturing techniques.

Costs can be decreased in home building! Take out fancy roof lines, remove as many corners in the home as possible. Our home was a rectangle with a large front porch. Nothing too sexy on the outside! Very plain as far as drafting was concerned, I was the draftsman/designer. Material costs were kept to a BAREST minimum! We went with measurements that could be supplied stock from vendors. Very little custom cutting on site!

I did ALOT of work on the home! We used reclaimed paper and fiberglass solid fill insulating material and sprayed it in over 6" thick in the walls and ceiling. Metal proved to be the cheapest material to use at the time for us! 6" tube steel, steel I-beams, and 8" C purlin all contributed to a solid outer frame. The maths showed a wind load resistance of ~140 MPH. I never felt anyting inside the house and could not hear the outside world if the windows were not fully opened.

We had custom cabinets made from wood harvested locally to cut costs. We used wood that was over 100 years old for the flooring. The tile was all closeouts bought at deep discounts. We used metal for the interior framing walls. Two guys took two days to frame out the entire house. Again, straight lines meant very little cutting and trimming of metal. The guys were mainly putting the studs in place and screwing in. Vaulted ceilings meant very little support work. All was attached to the I-Beams and C Purlin. It took a long time for the crew of five to put in the drywall and two days to tape and mud with a large crew.

I put in wood cross bars where the photos, TV, shelves, mirrors, and clothing rods would hang in closets. I used re-claimed lumber for my cross bars. I bought 2x4 and 2x6 by 8-14 foot for $1.00 per piece. They had been used as forms for foundations and I had to remove nails.

IF you are willing to invest alot of your own time and be constructive on building materials you can build for less money! We have re-done much of our fifty year old home in Indiana using locally sourced materials and one of a kinds. I redid the bathroom surround from ceiling to tub for less than $200.00. It has two 36" safety bars and porcelean tile. I paid less than $.25 per tile. The faucet was the most expensive item as it was new, first run stock.

What ever you do, make sure you have a GC! Whether the GC is just a consultant or they handle the majority of your work. A professional on your side is most helpful. We would NEVER have been able to do what we did in Texas without a good GC!

um, OK

maybe I need to be more careful when hiring people to work on my house. Last week my guy with an excavator was an EXPERIENCED BLACK GUY. If only I'd known!