Need Input: Vehicle Damaged by shop, they may not pay? (interesting event)

[Cdnone1]

I'm kind of torn here. I understand that they didn't break your sunroof, but unless it was part of the test or work they where preforming they didn't need to be opening it.
It's like a valet changing stations or volume on your radio, sure it makes them more comfortable but it's not their job. Did you check the milage?
Steve

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by masraum

call a lawyer...

not yet

but you do need to create a paper trail - do nothing by telephone - use Email or fax or paper

- contact the Penn. or city consumer protection bureau - usually it is part of the state Attorney General's Office

a lot cheaper than an atty & they will often not act if your atty. is about to file suit

a large state like Penn. may have a separate govt. agency just for auto repair problems

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by KevinP73

The fact that they opened the sunroof and had no legitimate reason to do so would make me very hesitant to ever take a car back to them but I still don't think it makes them responsible for the repairs on the roof.

- an interesting question, both legally and morally

you can address what % of the repair they should pay later; in your complaint to the cons. prot. agency just say you feel they should pay some portion of the repair

bottom line - they had no business effing with the sunroof

[phoenix_iii]

cdnone,

Between driving it to class and home, no, I didn't really look at anything but the hundreds place, so it was driven less than 100 miles during that window.

Rwebb,

Good idea, I've been using telephone and writing down the results, but fax/email might be better. I'm thinking Fax, because they probably do not do a lot of email

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by jyl

... You brought them an accident waiting to happen, and didn't warn them about it. ...

maybe - maybe not

we don't know if they jammed it or attempted some kludge repair when it would not close

we don't know if it could have been cranked closed before they had the car - it was closed that way at least 1x before they had the car

[phoenix_iii]

Originally Posted by RWebb

maybe - maybe not

we don't know if they jammed it or attempted some kludge repair when it would not close

we don't know if it could have been cranked closed before they had the car - it was closed that way at least 1x before they had the car

You know, this didn't even cross my mind.

I had opened it once before, and used the provided crank to close it (with a little finagling, but it did work, took me about 30 minutes). I just didn't want to have to drop the dome light again and go through the trouble, so I told them where the tool was, etc...

I should ask MB what THEY observed in the parts that were replaced.... (broken track, etc. I do recall the service advisor saying one of the tracks was broken... so the question becomes do they 'break on their own' or was it forced, in their experience). Midas could/should have taken it to MB on their own and maybe just paid one hour of labor to get it closed by those most familiar with it. Interesting. Thanks Rwebb.

[Tobra]

Probably the best you will get is them paying half, even though they are really responsible for all of the repair expense. You need to document everything well, in writing, and plan for the worst.

They had no business opening the sunroof, it does not matter that there was an issue with it when you brought it in. If they had not messed with the sunroof, the repairs would not have been done. When they could not get it closed, they almost certainly tried to, and may have damaged it enough so it would not close manually. They were the proximate cause of your $3000 trip to the MB stealership and had already agreed to pay for the repairs. The manager was aware it could be north of two grand.

When I was in Texas, they did vehicle safety inspections. I would not let my car out of my sight during these checks. I never valet park anything, ever.

[fastfredracing]

As a shop owner, let me tell you that schit like this happens sometimes. Who knows, the guy inspecting it may not have been familiar with mercedes benz, and when he was looking for the 4 way flasher switch, may have hit the sunroof button. Just a thought. I know that I have rolled down drivers side windows ( I do this on every car that comes in the shop to avoid locking keys in) , and had the damn window, fall off the track, or go down, but not come back up.
Best policy is to leave real precise instructions with any shop if you have any issues that they should know about. We really appreciate this..
I am sure that you never would have thought about them opening your sunrroof, but best to cover all bases.
I have had people pissed at me cause I checked their parking brake for inspection, and it is now stuck on. (frozen cable).
I may be biased, but I do not really feel that the shop was negligent, but I also see your point of view.

[look 171]

They should do whatever it take to get it to close so that its water tight. They had no business to be near the sun roof. My plumber had to pay for the cleaning of a rug. It was in the family room but the job to be performed was in the bath. What the heck was mud from their work boot doing in the family room. It wasn't cheap. something like 550 bucks to for the cleaning at a specialist rug cleaning place. They haven't done work for me in more then 8 years now. Thank goodness.

[Jagshund]

If you were able to close (albeit with some difficulty) the sun roof before you dropped it off and were not able to do so at all when picking it up, then I'd say they were responsible for further damage. My local mechanic would take responsibility and fix the issue without question. I've seen him cover expenses up to $6k that were not his fault.

[phoenix_iii]

I wish I had taken a pic of the roof the way they gave it to me. It was flat on one side, and UP on the other. really flexing the glass...

[phoenix_iii]

Originally Posted by 1968Cayman

If you were able to close (albeit with some difficulty) the sun roof before you dropped it off and were not able to do so at all when picking it up, then I'd say they were responsible for further damage. My local mechanic would take responsibility and fix the issue without question. I've seen him cover expenses up to $6k that were not his fault.

It didn't even cross my mind that I had closed it in June (the one and only time I tested it) without too much difficulty (gear is hard to turn with the dinky allen key they give you, and I didn't have a better one on hand), so why couldn't they, and did they in fact do further damage... I should contact MB and ask if they can talk to the tech and get a statement as to what was observed!

[Head416]

Regarding comments about: they had no business opening the sunroof.

Is a drive test part of the inspection? If so, would you say somebody had no business rolling a window down while driving, or running the AC? Maybe the test driver has a sunroof too and is just used to opening it when driving.

Having said that, it does seem like they may have damaged it further while trying to close it. If that's the case, they're responsible. But I doubt you would be able to prove that. You'll never know.

[Tobra]

It was stated above they need to roll the driver's side window down as part of the test.

It does not matter if they had to drive the car to test it, they did not have to open the sunroof and had no reason to do so.

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by phoenix_iii

I wish I had taken a pic of the roof the way they gave it to me. It was flat on one side, and UP on the other. really flexing the glass...

- the plot thickens - not sure what this means - maybe they brute forced something??

fastfred raises an interesting question re switch confusion - not sure if that happened, they may have had that happen or may say it happened even if it did not

but I'm not sure the legal std. here is "negligent" - my view is they should not have effed with the sunroof - I agree with Tobra

Let's suppose you had a problem with your muffler and took the car in. While there, they opened your glove box and damaged the hinge. How would you feel then??

[RWebb]

ask MB to save all old parts they remove for you to look at

some pics taken of the area once opened up might be interesting too

bottom line - expect a partial pay back from the shop that further damaged the car - you said you are fine w/that, so the only question is how many $$ = partial & fair

[mikester]

I would not expect a full payoff on the repair required but they had no business messing with the sunroof. They should have called you as soon as there was a problem discovered. Letting you discover the problem was them hoping that you wouldn't discover it until you got home. My opinion is that this is their problem and their fault for not respecting your property and the expectation of what they were expected to do on your car.

Lets say they put a CD in the disc player to listen to while taking their test drive and then the CD would not come out.

Whose problem is that not? Did they have any business having the radio even on while working on your car? When I drop a car off I always turn the radio off - it's a bit of a test to see if they turn it on (I've had them even change the dial). I find it disrespectful to the customer to mess with anything outside of the statement of work and why the customer brought the car in.

When I was working my way through early college I worked in a shop for about 2 or 3 years. I was amazed at the common disregard for other people's property - especially on the more expensive cars.

[ZOO]

I don't think they owe you anything -- and I think the idea of "messing with the sunroof" is kind of lame. To me, that phrasing implies negligence; you can't prove that they were being negligent because the sunroof is open. You didn't tell them it was broken, so how would they have known there was an issue with opening it? I don't think one needs to have a "legitimate" reason to open a sunroof, or a door, or a window, in a car that is being serviced. Unfortunate situation to be sure, and a tough lesson for all involved.

I've owned three cars with power sunroofs. I've cranked the roof closed on all three -- none took anywhere near an hour to close with the tool. Perhaps you caused the damage the last time.

The only valid concern that you have is with the behavior of the shop after the fact -- not informing you of the problem, and giving you a bit of a run-around is not the way to win you back as a customer. Then again, maybe they thiink you are a crackpot looking to place an expensive bill on them for an issue that they don't feel responsible for.

I am sorry this has happened to you, but there is, in my opinion, no fault to assign to the shop with regards to the sunroof being openned. With their "service" afterwards, yes.

Rob

[MattKellett]

It is possible that the MB dealer won't close your roof even if they could. As then perhaps they could be held liable for something further down the line.

So maybe they will only fully repair the sun roof or not at all.

Did you instruct Midas how to lower the roof? or did you just say "lower it" and hope for the best?

If this was my car and I knew that the sunroof was broken, I certainly wouldn't expect the shop to pay for the repairs from opening a sunroof which they had no idea was broken, even if they shouldn't have opened it.

[phoenix_iii]

Originally Posted by MattKellett

It is possible that the MB dealer won't close your roof even if they could. As then perhaps they could be held liable for something further down the line.

So maybe they will only fully repair the sun roof or not at all.

Did you instruct Midas how to lower the roof? or did you just say "lower it" and hope for the best?

If this was my car and I knew that the sunroof was broken, I certainly wouldn't expect the shop to pay for the repairs from opening a sunroof which they had no idea was broken, even if they shouldn't have opened it.

I put the tool on the seat and explained that they lower the dome light and it's right there.

The reason it took me a while the last time was that it was 3am, (dark), and after 2.5 hour drive.

They said they would take care of it. MB was good, I spoke with the Service Advisor and explained what had happened and what we needed done, and he called me with the news of what needed to be done in order to get it closed. I balked and even questioned the accuracy of the statement, but he assured me, and put it in writing, that the minimum work to effect closure was what it was.

If the manager had not told me to do what needed to be done, and we hadn't postulated 2k+, I would have called him first to double check the value, but it was spot on with our 'worst case' scenario estimates.

Yes, this after the fact behavior is disappointing and fishy on their end... If they do not believe they did anything wrong, tell me and let's move forward, not this 'It's not looking good, I'm still waiting to hear from corporate, we'll pay for 1hr of labor from MB' kind of nonsense!