1) Correct, now you have to decide whether they are traitors or whistle blowers (sort of like freedom fighters/terrorists).

2) The Press has always protected their sources. For obvious reasons. Why should it be different for WL?

jackass

Yep. I often agree with a lot of what he says, yet I hate seeing him enter an otherwise good thread. I know I can count on a heaping helping of condescension, ridicule, and general sanctimonious arsehole-like behavior. It is something I struggle with in real life when my wife drives me non-linear...my otherwise 100% valid line of reasoning can be discredited by my (*****ty) attitude/demeanor.

WL is still there. U just have to type in the IP address. I wonder if whats on there has been altered? you know....

You are so erudite in your defense of your statements, I am impressed.

When you are incapable of expressing your opinions without any facts to back them up that can be verified, all we have is baseless opinion.

That is hardly a good way to go through life son.

Do you still have any facts to back your opinion up? Or are we just supposed to run on blind emotion?

Maybe it is not me or your wife?

Thank you for the common denominator innuendo. As I seldom engage in threads where you also participate, that is a non-starter. With my wifey (whose superlative qualities I wouldn't dream of impugning in public forum :eek:), I clearly stated that I hurt my own credibility with my attitude. With a bit of humility and introspection, my approach to differences of opinion with her has changed quite a bit over the last year or two.

The posters here, with few exceptions, seem to operate on the general assumption that we're all car guy pals - and at the end of a heated discussion, we'd laugh off any differences and knock back a few beers. I just don't ever get the impression that you enjoy the company of...anyone...here, and if that's the case (please do correct me if I'm wrong) then why do you invest your time posting on a board where you dislike/disdain everyone?

You are as welcome as was your insult to me, "I know I can count on a heaping helping of condescension, ridicule, and general sanctimonious arsehole-like behavior".

Why would you have such an opinion? Everyone on this forum states their opinion. If mine is different than the majority, I am attacked. Does this sound like a group who are "all car guy pals - and at the end of a heated discussion, we'd laugh off any differences and knock back a few beers"?

Are you just looking for a validation of your opinions? Or are you interested in discussing the ideas in a rational manner from all sides? Some concepts and or subjects may be disquieting and disturbing. Are you saying we should shy away from those subjects? Only the ignorant think the world is black and white. So why should we pretend it is on this forum?

An opinion are just like an anus. Everyone has one. So you are all unique just like every one of us. If one cannot back up their opinion with some kind of factual evidence, then all one has is a baseless opinion. It is not worth very much.

I hang out here for several reasons:

1) It connects me to America when I am not there.

2) It allows me access to subjects I am interested in.

3) It allows a me to have a voice in a increasing insular and isolated America.

All reasons which are for the good.

Do I hang with you guys outside of this portal? Well not very often. Are you comming to my part of France? Yes? Lets hang out then.

Was any of what was put on wl not really already known? I mean, I think most Americans know that our gubment and their gubment don't get along. Then there is the question of do you believe wl or not. I could see those papers being twisted around for whatever reason.

It's just a bunch of whiny, self-centered kids (and adults with the maturity of children) with an ill-formed sense of justice who think they're invincible protesting something they don't really understand in the most cowardly way possible. I hope the cold, hard, full metal jacket of reality bites them sooner rather than later.

Wikileaks is not the press - Mr. Assange (SP?) even says so doesn't he?

Done.

My only point, is the old nugget about catching more flies with honey than vinegar. Am I singling you out here? Well, yes, unfortunately, and for that I apologize - it is just that I rarely get the sense you enjoy the company of other posters here! Just like I don't post socially on other forums that I occasionally peruse for tech info - simply because the 'climate' doesn't suit me.

Enough piling on, just think it over - as far as WL, I would want to see some much more compelling arguments that they should be prosecuted/sanctioned/whatever. True, they take a more wholesale approach to publishing sensitive data than say, Fox or CNN - but I don't see a substantive difference between what they do and what WL does. No sale w/me. I had hoped to see some good discussion of this in PARF, but that was wishful thinking on my part (I am ever the optimist).

DOS attacks are the cyber-age equivalent of keying someone's car or any other sort of malicious antisocial passive-agressive idiocy and should be dealt with as such. Just like my assertion against Richard above - their methods detract from the credibility of their cause. Shame.

Agreed.

Well, about 90% of his statements are this way, so its nothing new.

Dave, you are spinning your wheels with Richard. He may contribute after a fashion, but you have to sift through too much chaff to get to the kernel. I don't pay any attention to him at all, even when I ask, "Why do you say "we"? It does not matter why he says we, there is no we. Just him, and everyone else, or more accurately, "those beneath him."

It is not for comraderie, he comes here because he likes to argue.

And done.

I do not let any of the insults bother me. But I do respond in kind, it is always fun to give people the same treatment they hand out. BTW, please show on this thread where I offered any "heaping helping of condescension, ridicule, and general sanctimonious arsehole-like behavior".

I agree, as I pointed out. They broke no American laws, they acted as other members of the 4th Estate do. They must protect their sources, as all other journalists do. All of which is quite legal by American laws.

I asked before who would be cheering them on if they had published Iranian military and diplomatic communications? Answer? Every public figure in our government as well as most people on this forum. That is pure hypocrisy



So the DOS attacks on WL should be condemned in the same way?Was it not "malicious antisocial passive-agressive idiocy" ? Where is the outcry about that? Not a peep on this forum.

No he does not. Why is it not like the press?

Really? You know this for a fact?
(Maybe Joey can answer that for you)

They were attacked. That is easily verified.

So what indicate that the American government, military, CIA, NSA, etc was not behind the attcks?

And what about my statements is unfair?

Have you read up on the stuxnet virus, and if so, care to comment - especially in consideration of your question above?

Isn't a DOS attack something of the 2nd grade level? That is to say it could come from any amateur?


At the end of the day, can anyone show what WL has released that is more than either (a) simply one side dissing the other side, (b) what the other side already knows, (c) is not much above Jerry Springer level gossip???? How is this any different from the crap spewed from the regular media channels?


So this Mr. Assange puts a "poison-pill" out there with the idea that if something should happen to him or WL the "password" will become available. Doesn't it seem odd that with such "poison-pill" available, someone will crack it for simple bragging rights, thus negating any insurance value?

It seems WL is all about hype and publicity and nothing about real value content.

Man this went sideways.....

I'm not going to get into the Wikileaks convo, but the DDOS are kind of interesting, took out Visa, Mastercard, Paypal, and a bunch of others. You'd think with the kind of money these companies make, they could setup a better front door to fend off the DDOS'.

The real interesting question is, maybe it's the US gov. that's doing to DDOS pretending to be Anonymous?....

It's all a game to the governments, the hackers and the organized crime, it's just a different stadium. If the US only paid more for weapons grade hacks, the Russians wouldn't be so rich right now.....

Just a view point