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Sooo.. how do I cram....
...approximately 300 square feet of working space down to about 120 square feet without gettign in each other's way?
We signed a lease on a house yesterday..the big brown one I posted about... The workshop area is 12x12 feet.:(:rolleyes: Our current footage is a little over 300 square feet in the 600 square foot garage I occupy till the end of the month. Bandsaw. Drill press. Thread tapping machine. Belt Sander, bench grinder, Hotplate and wax vat. Coil winding table. Assembly table. Staging bench for stuff to be assembled. Staging table for stuff that's completed. Then there are - racks of wire spools, racks of parts, bins of magnets, drawers of parts, packing supplies, filing cabinets... and more! I don't see it happening :( And... where do I put the car stuff in a 14x10 foot garage? Lady is about to get a serious lesson in how important WORK SPACE IS.:mad::mad::mad: When I get complaints about long lead times due to inefficient working conditions brought on by her dislike of places that would have worked, she's outta-here. |
Sorry man, even with my 3000 square feet of shop within 30 steps of my house, I feel your pain.
Never enough room. Mine's full, Ask Higgins........... http://i710.photobucket.com/albums/w...1228423311.jpg I don't know how HE can do it with 2 boys, 3 porsches, and umpteen VW bugs and Subarus and Cycles to wrench on.......... you need more space, I can't imagine working in a College Dorm Studio Apartment sized room you're describing. 12 x12 feet? Heck I need more room than that to just pisss and make a helicopter pattern.......... |
I'd divide the stuff between dust making and clean. Take the coil winding table into the main house along with the assembly table.
Filing cabinets and all office gear go into a corner of a room inside for book work and a quiet place to talk on the phone. Lastly, I'd get some overhead cabinets for storage of materials out in the shop as well as overhead open racks. If you can't look across, look up. If you do finishing, I'd look into getting a metal shed for just finishing and drying. A small heater will get you by in the cold months. |
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Should have seen the carpet in my old apartment. And we didn't even work in there...we worked in the garage. |
can you build a loft for the lightweight stuff? oh its a rental...never mind
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I also can't be trucking all over the house to the workshop every time I need to use a tool...like the drill press. Or tapper. Which is VERY frequent.
No door connects the two. |
ask the LL about adding a loft - tell the LL you will do all work to code & sign a paper for him that he can at his option choose to retain it or have you remove it
check out some things that woodworkers have done in their shops re vertical storage and moving bench tops around |
Go buy a nice shed. Then take it with you when you leave.
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Well, I can see you've been inconvenienced to the point of being majorly pissed off. You really didn't come here for advice, you just wanted to vent.
It's your dog, walk it. |
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My assembly guy and I discussed the metal shed earlier today and using it for the dirty work, putting it on the concrete pad in the rear just outside the workshop door. I was looking up information about them, but wasn't able to find any size/price info. Insulated would be best. |
wahhhhhhhh.
buy a rubbermaid storage shed. vent all you want. she doesn't understand...............so? life is short, build it, buy it, work in it......... what's your point? Walmart has shelving, hang milk crates from your ceiling.............. I know a wood worker who set up his lathes and band saws in his living room making a living. So does the girl or the needed business shop space go? that seems to be your question? |
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For seven years, I worked in a one car garage. It was so small and cramped, that we were in each other's way. I had to move tools to use tools frequently, then move them back to use other tools. We had three, four month, or sometime longer lead times. We worked 16 hours a day to catch up. We had pissed off customers because lead times were long. With the space I've worked in for the last two years, we've been able to cut that 16 hours a day down to about four. And almost zero lead times. Parts and supplies - must be stored inside. They cannot be exposed to weather, moisture, extreme tempuratures without causing damage. A $500 spool of wire leeching up moisture? Bad for coils. Metal parts becoming corroded and tarnished? Goobye $1000's of dollars worth of parts. Does your woodworker friend operate a production facility in his living room? Does he operate efficiently, and is he expected to produce a certain number of products to meet customer demands? Do delays cause order cancellations when builders can't get his product in time to get thier product to thier customers? Ever heard of LEAN manufacturing? Efficiency is important. Rebuild an entire car in your bathroom. In a week. Then tell me "waaaah" I want to rent your shop :D |
Ditch the woman, rent a place that works for you....
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Your work sounds kinda cool! What is it that you manufacture?
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Aren't there any garages/sheds/whatever in your area you could rent cheaply just for your shop?
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Welll....I'm one of a handful of people in the world who do what I do. Not counting a few large companies that mass-produce... I make electric guitar pickups for several guitar companies, several stores throughout the world, and anyone else who wants them. Welcome to my work. :D For our very own Slodave and his LP build. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825347.jpg Coil winder. You don't want to know how much it was. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825390.jpg Wire http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825436.jpg Waiting to be packed http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825485.jpg Rack-o-parts http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825564.jpg Drawers-o-parts and assembly suppliues. Solder, various tapes, pre-prepped work, magnets, etc. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825623.jpg Shop http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825696.jpg More Shop http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825725.jpg More Shop http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299825880.jpg Pardon the mess. I know it could be cleaner. On the back wall is a large bench that holds things in various stages, misc repairs, wax vat, etc. On the left wall bench holds drill press, tapping, parts bins, magnet cupboard, parts drawers, and amplifiers underneath, etc... And this doesn't show what's through the door. the Dirty Room. Cutting, gridning, chemical work.... |
And some things just need to be kept well and far away from this...
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1299826318.jpg |
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Imagine a trailer hitch receiver.
Several receivers moounted where you would need them, all tools needed would have a male insert that pins into the receiver. Build a rack or have the tools hang from the ceiling. Get a cuople of plastic buckets that seal to keep your wire clean and dry. |
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Other thing such as wire strippers, irons, etc on the bench or in drawers when not being used. The solder pot next to my winder gets frequent use. It's the large tools that are used frequently (when I saw frequently, I mean at least once every five minutes or so) the staging area for work in progress/work finished, etc. Shuffling around large tools (and each other)to make room for and use other large tools... is a waste, as is traveling to and from those tools if they're too far away. That was one of our major problems in the old shop 2+ years ago. |
Seems like lots of clutter and wasted space. Can you clean, streamline, compact the process and space needed? Have you drawn out a workflow of your manufacturing process ann noodled on it - I know you've been busy meeting orders.
A bunch of that space looks like storage and packing/shipping, can't that go in the house? Car stuff can sit outside or in a temporary shed, of course. |
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As I read this thread and see "16 hour days" and "three, four month, or sometime longer lead times," I see something wrong. This business is not producing enough profit. With that kind of demand, expansion into a viable workspace away from the home is the logical step. I'd look into the accounting side of this business and see why there is no provision for proper overhead to afford a modest workshop outside the home. In the meantime, Wolf is going to have to focus on organization in order to "cram" this operation into the too small space available while seeking ways to move out and into a proper shop. |
Exactly, the fat needs cut, or the prices have got to go up....
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Packign and shipping stuff could go in the house. The storage for parts and stuff neds to be immediately accessable to be used. That's part of the workflow. To the right of my assembly guy are drawers of parts and supplies that get used either during assembly, for staging jobs that are being started, or prep-work that he does such as making lead wires. Near my winder, the rack of wire. Near my tapping machine and drill press, the bobbins that most frequently need to be tapped or drilled, and magnets that need to be set into flatwork pieces. On the big rack of parts bins, mostly covers, fibre flatwork parts, and a few misc things..like the radio. Under the long table is where most of the packing stuff goes. Bubble wrap and shipping boxes. Once an order is completed, they go to the long table to get packed. During times of overload, the long table also serves as a pre-start staging when the short "completed" bench sitting on the drawers won't hold them all. The long wooden bench holds the wax vat and hot-plate, preferably far away from anything else. The tall white bins hold stuff that is generally needed in that area, some paperwork, magnets that are used withthe drill press, and the shop-cam. The small rouhnding bench is the corner is where I do paper cutting of retail box inserts and retail box assembly, with it's related parts underneath. It also hold misc stuff when not being directly used for that pupose. |
Sounds like the long table, all the packing stuff, the paper box cutting stuff, all the paperwork can go in the house.
The car lives outside, all the car stuff in a quik-build shed in the back yard. You build some racking to make your storage more vertical. Clean up the junk. Build a hood or partition that lets the wax stuff live closer to other operations. I think it will fit. And the small space will be cheaper to heat. If she complains about the spare bedroom, or dining room, being used for pack/ship, then she gets the boot. |
I just cleaned out my garage. 75% by volume went, just by organizing and condensing as I went.
Not exactly similar to your situation, but it looks from the pics like a major cleaning/re-org w/ some new shelving, etc. to make it nice and make it work. Don't forget to use your vertical space. I'd get a piece of graph paper, figure out what size and what shape the work area around each needs to be and plot it out. Then plot out everything else to work around it. |
Wolfe,
I have a contractor who rents some type of mini storage or similar as shop space. I haven't seen it but it sounds like what you need. I think that the posts on organization may have as well. When I was in manufacturing, we tried to set up "work cells." Where each cell would perform isolated and integrated tasks. I agree that the level of challenge is pretty high for you. I have seen some home shops that perform amazing work in small places. Good luck. There are lots of very sharp people here. Larry PS - I have a serious jones to build a tele. I will call you when MY shop space is ready! |
Wolfe,
First...the lady isn't going anywhere...except with you to the new house so suck it up baby and work with what you've got :D... "Happy wife, happy life"...remember? ;)...you like that house; you'll make the whole work set-up happen with careful planning. Now I know that those pics have been taken after a busy period of work and that everything isn't in its correct place etc but I see a lot of wasted space. Remember you're paying for every inch in your work space so use every inch. You need much better storage and it should go from floor to ceiling. There is always a bunch of stuff that is not used every 5 minutes so you don't need it at your fingertips - it can go up high. Stack as much stuff as you can into proper adjustable shelving (spend the $$) and free up your floor space. Pull the money from wherever you can and set up your workspace properly before you move in there. It can be done...when we chose lifestyle over 18 hour days away from the kids and moved the business to the 'country' we didn't have a lot of choice on available factories...and went from 5000 sq ft of very lofty space with pallet racking storage and massive mezzanine (total space about 8000sq ft) down to about 1300 sq ft :eek:. This is workspace only (office and parts storage are elsewhere). The factory isn't lofty but we've used every bit of wall space for storage and can fit 5 cars in when we have to. Have hoist, drill bench, massive workbench, lathe, press, myriads of special tools, wheel aligner ramps, oil drums, rows of tools cabinets, jacks, stands, 2 tool box trolleys etc etc...fully equipped workshop. Compressor and waste oil storage are outside under a 'lean to'... As some of the guys have said; draw it up on paper first. Then go in with some chalk and chalk it out on the floor...not roughly; measure everything and mark it precisely on the floor. Spend some $$ and buy the most effective storage/shelving you can as it will never go astray. And clean up as you go..no excuses! And follow Milt's advice ;)...looks like you can grow this biz and the working arrangement is holding the biz back... You can sort this....no more b!tching; you don't have time :). Spend the time planning your workspace instead. Just my 0.02c worth... |
Take a look at the 5S principles and start making them habit. In your current shop, there is a ton of clutter and that is slowing you down/holding you back. In the new shop, I'd start by insulating and sheet rocking, or at a minimum hang white melamine sheets on the wall. This will drastically improve the lighting AND it will help keep dust down, meaning you have to spend less time on cleanup. Speaking of lighting, get some flourescent ceiling lights as they will help a ton too.
For your dirty work, drilling tapping, sanding, anything that makes dust or chips, I'd have a dedicated area. You can isolate it with shower curtains. Have a good shop vac, and you can install it outside, with some PVC plumbing and have ports by each of your machines. If you have your drill on, have the vacuum on. CLEAN AS YOU GO. Also, I heard you mention drilling and tapping machines, you can consolidate them with a turret drill press, a machine that allows for up to 6 drills reamers and taps to be used on one machine. For your tapping, invest in a "Tapmatic". Also, not sure how many different models you make or the variances in the machining, but consider making some drill fixtures with replaceable bushings to speed you up. Someone else mentioned having alot of finished product around. Where I work, the UPS guy only picks up once a day, and its about the same time every day. Figure out what time he comes (if you don't have UPS or FedEx picking up, get an account and start doing this), then figure out how long it takes you to pack a days worth of shipments. dedicate that time to pack and ship everything at once, in a clean, dedicated area. You might have to go in the house. Keep your poly bags, foam, boxes, tape, and shipping labels all together. As others have said, invest in some better storage. I swear by those baker's racks (looks like you've got one), and labeled bins. Everything should have its own place, and everything should be in its own place. Commonly used tools can live on a 'pegboard' type mount on the back of a workbench, and less used tools away in a toolbox. Inertia reel type tool holders work good for wire snips, scissors etc, so they don't wonder off. Also, its OK to have multiples of the same tool if their used in multiple areas, so you're not always looking for your favorite screw driver, get 2. And before you chalk the floor, do it on paper, with cutouts, its easier to move stuff around, then chalk it out. For workbenches, I like the taller benches that allow for storage above and below. Remember, clean as you go. good luck. |
I ran a manufacturing plant for several years. One thing I really got into was setting up production cells for efficiency. That being said, yours is ugly:) I'm not trying to be a jerk, heck I know full well how it happens. You need to grab a 12 pack and spend a few nights with a pad and a tape-measure just sitting on a stool in your workspace plotting layouts and making a list of the items you use at least twice a day...everything else goes elsewhere...blah blah blah.
I see wasted space everywhere in your old place, hell that wire storage shelf alone takes up about 400% more space than the spools need. The bin-shelf is a type I hate, loads of wasted space and bins 600% bigger than they need to be. You have almost zero wall/vertical storage, etc... Proper benches with under storage would also work. Given the tiny space you've described it's still going to be a bastard..but you'll get there. |
These things are incredible and cost 63 cents ea.
http://i21.geccdn.net/site/images/la...234806_dim.gif They go up to 12" wide for still less than a buck This whole thing is cheap: http://www.randmh.com/product_images...C2049612AS.jpg I'd definitely get some and throw out all other non conforming storage unless it's long term and stored out of the "hot zone." |
Is this your primary source of income? If it is, you should be able to justify the expense of renting a dedicated business/shop space. If it isn't, then it's just a hobby, even if it provides you with some extra income.
Sorry if it sounds harsh, but it's true, and Milt nailed it with his earlier comments. BTW, I operate a small home based business (hobby) that makes niche products. When I thought about taking it full time a few years ago, I ran the numbers, and included such things as rent, health insurance, taxes, and general overhead. The numbers were not in my favor, so I kept it home based, and kept my day job. Good luck. (Do you make pickups for basses, as well? SmileWavy) |
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And yes, I can. P-bass and J-bass :D On the issues of wasted space and stacking.. the new shop has very low ceiling. I'd guess under 8 feet. No much "up" to go there at all. On wasted space, some tools must be kept well apart from each other. Bandsaws, belt sanders, and bench grinders need to be as far away as possible from wax vats, magnets, and magnet chargers...or else bad things happen. And the magnet charger nedds to be as far away from the coil winder as possible. I figure right now, it's at least 12 feet away. My monitor turns colors when I use it...It loves to attract metal parts that are too close...including metal dust and shavings. I'm really paranoid about it knocking out the winder's operating system... I'll head over to the new place in a bit and take some pictures to show you guys what I'll be dealing with.... |
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Ok, I went over and cleaned out as much as I could from the new shop space. Here's what I have to work with Looking at what will become the assembly desk, from the opposite corner. Parts drawers will have to live underneath http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1300054101.jpg Lookign at a furnace which I wish could go away. Winding desk will have to fit to the left. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1300054156.jpg Shelves where the wire and other parts will have to live. And a door to the worlds smallest garage. Completed orders will also have to go here. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1300054230.jpg Door to the right of the winding desk. It leads outside. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1300054515.jpg Sooo... no place to put: Bandsaw. Belt Sander. Bench Grinder. Drill press. Tapper. Hot Plate/Wax Vat. Metal rack for parts (could go in the garage) Hot-Box for laquoring fibre assemblies.... Unfortunately, the garage appears to be DEAD as far as power is concerned. We draw a *lot* of current and frequently blow the box in the shop I've been in. I counted three outlets. We need several more. 12x12. Ceiling is 8 feet. So I really need some ideas here that will work. Efficiently. |
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Detest UPS. Postal service only. Everything and every tool has it's own place. The clutter is not normal - some, but not nearly as much as you saw. Most tools we use are specialized and small. Not pegboardable. |
They are a little pricey but check these out
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Wolfe,
Is your landlord aware you will be conducting a business there? Over here we have ridiculously strict rules for rentals; not sure about your situation. If so, send them a letter informing them that all the shelving etc (fixtures other than the furnace) is not suitable and request that you can remove them so you can start with a clean slate and put in much more effective stuff. It could make you the much needed room you need by doing this. Also inform them that you will be installing more power points etc at your cost (you'd better check what the board will take and whether it needs upgrading etc). They may want you to use their electrician or most likely they will at least want you to supply details and documentation of your chosen electrician. You're starting behind the ball with all that stuff in there (not effective)...somehow it needs to go. Well it would be gone if it was me in your shoes...one way or another... |
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The setup there looks like it may allow for the tapping to be done at any angle and may not be straight every time? |
The Amish build bigger drop off sheds than that. With a floor. I think you need one in the drive to set up the big tools.
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