Guantánamo Bay

[Bill Douglas]

If Mr. Obama is still thinking about selling Guantánamo Bay maybe we should all get together and buy the place.

First of all we need a good business plan and marketing plan. This is where we can all contribute. I’m thinking of it being setup as a resort, along the lines of...

Come to beautiful Guantánamo Bay in the sunny Caribbean.

We have luxury accommodation with the following activities; playing with dogs, getting naked with our very own fun patrol. Not quite surfing, but waterboarding – very popular with our guests.

We enjoy the latest fashions. Right now in Guantanamo Bay orange is very popular.

Enjoying multiculturalism is the key to having a good time in Guantánamo Bay, many languages are spoken and a particuarly popular one is Aribic.

Some of our guests have ben here for years, and some feel they will never leave.

Your contributions please...

[71 3.0 911]

I can see this being moved to the political board. They stopped waterboarding, terrorists are terrorists, and the liberals will keep crying. 2 years ago NObama decided to close that place and signed an "executive order" to make it happen. Guess what? Still open.

Doubt you can tell (judging from your post) but issues are rarely as simple as people make them out to be. Most terrorists released from Gitmo end up going right back to what got them locked up to begin with.....

[azasadny]

My former CO from Desert Storm was the senior medical officer at Gitmo for a time. He told me the facility was far better than any of the places we stayed when I was in his command and that the reports of mistreatment and torture/inhumane conditions were completely false. I trust this man and his word is gold to me. so who am I going to believe him or the media? He told me the guys incarcerated at Gitmo were some of the most evil folks he had ever dealt with...

[maxnine11]

"Taxi to the Dark Side" is an academy award winning documentary worth watching.

[Racerbvd]

Originally Posted by azasadny

My former CO from Desert Storm was the senior medical officer at Gitmo for a time. He told me the facility was far better than any of the places we stayed when I was in his command and that the reports of mistreatment and torture/inhumane conditions were completely false. I trust this man and his word is gold to me. so who am I going to believe him or the media? He told me the guys incarcerated at Gitmo were some of the most evil folks he had ever dealt with...

That is what a friend who was one of the Doctors at Gitmo told me, and like you, I trust his word over any liberal being fed his info from soros & company..

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by azasadny

My former CO from Desert Storm was the senior medical officer at Gitmo for a time. He told me the facility was far better than any of the places we stayed when I was in his command and that the reports of mistreatment and torture/inhumane conditions were completely false. I trust this man and his word is gold to me. so who am I going to believe him or the media? He told me the guys incarcerated at Gitmo were some of the most evil folks he had ever dealt with...

From talking with people who have been based there, this is also what I keep hearing.

My guess is that NoBama found out some very accurate intel after taking office that makes him wake up as to what these terrorists are really like, and that the place is not going to be closed. Thank God!

[sammyg2]

I believe the US has a lease agreement for gitmo with certain stipulations.
The cuban gubmint would love for us to break the terms of that lease so they could legally (international law) force us to get the heck out. For some reason they don't like us there ....???

Iffn we're serious about taking it over (and we're not) we hafta be really careful not to piss off the landlord.

[red-beard]

Remember, Obama only wants to close Camp Delta, not the entire base.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by red-beard

Remember, Obama only wants to close Camp Delta, not the entire base.

Hey may want to close camp Delta but... Were would the prisoners go?

Mainland USA??? I doubt it. The fact is those people are there for a reason.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Hey may want to close camp Delta but... Were would the prisoners go?

Mainland USA??? I doubt it. The fact is those people are there for a reason.

What's the reason again?
They're suspected of being bad guys, but we don't have enough on them to put them on trial, convict them, and punish them.
I wonder what the American public's response would be if someone rounded up a few hundred Christian Americans and put them in prison indefinitely. Probably anger, hatred, resentment, and a determination to get back at the perpetrators of such medieval behavior. And we wonder why so many Muslims hate us.
What ever happened to our good ol' American values?

[red-beard]

They are prisoners of war. When the war is over, they can go home.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

What's the reason again?
They're suspected of being bad guys, but we don't have enough on them to put them on trial, convict them, and punish them.
I wonder what the American public's response would be if someone rounded up a few hundred Christian Americans and put them in prison indefinitely. Probably anger, hatred, resentment, and a determination to get back at the perpetrators of such medieval behavior. And we wonder why so many Muslims hate us.
What ever happened to our good ol' American values?

Nothing has happened to your good ol' American values. If anything they have been strengthened since 9/11

I understand your frustration but something like this had to be done. I really wish there was a way to deal with these people more effectively.

Do they deserve a fair trial and outcome according to American law? As individual humane beings they do however they forfeited that right when they participated in deadly acts of terror as a group.
Dealing with a single criminal is one thing but an organized group is something else again. So in my opinion they are prisoners of war.

Let me ask you... How would you solve the problem?

I know England and Spain have been attacked but have they completed a successful operation against the US since 911?

The hatred of the West by Muslims is something perpetrated by their older generation.
Their motivation for doing this is complicated but basically it's easier to control a country by a "dictatorship" if those people in that country have a common enemy.
It's the oldest trick in the book. That generation is now loosing control and dying out.

Their young people want to live in free democracies and guess what. That is exactly what their fighting for right now.

[Rick Lee]

Marc Thiessen's Courting Disaster is a must-read on the subject. MUST READ. Super book and tells you all the inside info on how/why AQ suspects were waterboarded. What never seems to make it into the news, but what we got from Abu Zubaida, is that AQ detainees are taught to only resist interrogation up to a point and, once they personally feel they can't take it anymore, they are free to sing like a canary with a clear conscience. There is no definition of how much they must endure. It's a personal thing. Once Zubaida told us this, it was pretty much a guarantee that all future AQ detainees would sing with minimal "enhanced" interrogation. And they did.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Do they deserve a fair trial and outcome according to American law? As individual humane beings they do however they forfeited that right when they participated in deadly acts of terror as a group.

The are accused of participating in deadly acts of terror. That's the problem here. We have a morally superior system of laws whose cornerstone is habeous corpus, but we hypocritically deny it to selected individuals.

[Tobra]

apparently you missed this fact

Originally Posted by red-beard

They are prisoners of war. When the war is over, they can go home.

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

The are accused of participating in deadly acts of terror. That's the problem here. We have a morally superior system of laws whose cornerstone is habeous corpus, but we hypocritically deny it to selected individuals.

do you understand the concept of "prisoner of war?"

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

The are accused of participating in deadly acts of terror. That's the problem here. We have a morally superior system of laws whose cornerstone is habeous corpus, but we hypocritically deny it to selected individuals.

Well that's were we have a problem.

It has been denied to these people because they were committing acts of terror as an organized group.
As you know this group is a terror organization that operates around the globe.
None of this is in dispute.

We use terms like "allegations" when reffering to these people but the reality is they do have evidence against the people still in custody.

Many people have been released from Camp Delta and returned to their country of origin.
One of these "misguided individuals" lives about 20 kms from my house!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hicks

[Rick Lee]

POW is way too generous a status for these terrorists. I understand we gave them that status, but they don't even come close under Geneva Convention rules and should have been executed as soon as we were done squeezing them for intel. Plenty of American soldiers were executed by Germans for not even wearing proper insignia on their uniforms when caught in covert acts during WWII.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

We use terms like "allegations" when reffering to these people but the reality is they do have evidence against the people still in custody.

How do you know this?
If there is real evidence, they should present it, but the government insists that we just trust it on this. Trust the government?

This whole thing started going downhill when they started calling what is in effect an on-going, never-ending global police action a "war." The "war on terror" is not a war in any traditional sense. They are making this up as they go.

[sc_rufctr]

Actually I do trust my Government.

You have to... What choice do you have?

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

Actually I do trust my Government.

You have to... What choice do you have?

I don't trust my gov't. in the least. But I doubt they'd have gone to the financial and political expense of locking these terrorists up for no good reason. They're bad, dangerous people and need to be kept off the battlefield. A sizeable number of those we've released have been recaptured on the battlefield. That alone is enough proof for me.