Good deal Frey, you can help the CEO earn his $55,000 a day salary.....

Educate me on the law. If I own a business, does the NLRA prevent me deciding to hire only non-union employees?

Sorry Vin,
Its none of my business how much he makes. His first priority is economic. If he keeps Verizon profitable and competitive, he can do and make whatever the market allows.

Fair enough. Then why is it anyone's business what the workers get,as long as the company is profitable?? (Last quarter was Verizon's most profitable in the companies history)

In the old days the CWA hired goons. I know, I testified and put a couple behind bars. Nowadays I think the harassment would be a factor even to the point of someone following you home. Maybe some vandalism so you might want to be prepared that going to work as a scab can bring some grief.

You won't be drinking at the same bar, let's put it that way. However, I don't think anything serious will happen. When the strike in '64 ended there was so much work that the newly hired scabs stayed on and worked side by side with the returning union guys.

Little by little the scabs moved on because they weren't really CWA types to begin with. I lasted 3 months after the strike ended. Just wasn't for me.

They did teach me how to play a mean game of Hearts, though. Every day at lunch.

It's somewhat complex of course but basically, if your workers decided to be represented by a union, then you have to deal with that union. Unfair Labor
Practice charges under the NLRA center around an employer's refusal to bargain. In a unionized environment, you cannot (or at least you're supposed to be unable to) make business decisions specifically for the purpose of eliminating your relationship with a union. You cannot simply fire all the union workers and replace them with non-union people, so as to avoid the existing workforce's decision to be represented. The decision to be represented belongs to workers, and you cannot usurp that. Workers have at least some rights. As opposed to none.

In reality, the NLRA has become so watered-down in terms of enforcement and judicial interpretation that employers can in fact get away with just about anything. Wal-Mart has many times abandoned a store to evade a relationship with a union, for example.

Interestingly, in my industry, construction, the labor/management relationship is almost never created by workers' votes. Believe it or not, it virtually always comes about because management wants it. Construction is (basically) the only industry in which unionization can be thrust upon the workers by management ("8(f)" exemption in the NLRA), and this is always how it happens. Later, sometimes, workers get to decide. Mostly, it is management's decision. Management does this because of the service they get from the unions. A hiring hall loaded with workers ready to work. Expensive and effective training programs. Benefits administration (write a single check to the benefit trust administrator, who takes care of all the administrative headaches). Et cetera.

People who think unions are a bunch of vampires intent on ruining America are......misinformed, to say the least.

Trade unions supply qualified workers that have joined an apprenticeship or earned a journeyman's card. That's a different story than the CWA. Teamsters, UWA and all the rest that train no one.

AFA the NLRA, Reagan didn't believe in it.

Lots of people don't believe in it. OTOH, lots of people do. My labor friends do, of course. What they don't believe in is laws that protect workers. Almost no sane person would suggest that workers should have no rights or protections. So.....would you prefer labor unions or government labor regulations? If you're a "free market" kinda guy, then you'd favor labor unions.

One thing is for sure. If gubmit regulations ceased to exist.......unionism would SOAR.

My niece's husband is a FIOS installer and two of his brothers also work for Verizon in data networking. The company is trying to break the union. The old head honcho of Verizon was a lineman who worked his way up. The new head is a straight up bean counter business person.

The fact is they used to brag about the benefits and sick time. As a business owner, former Teamster union member and now an employer of members of three unions I always thought that they, the Verizon workers got way too much in benefits, not health benefits but high pensions and way too many days off. There was abuse of overtime and a lot of BS between the workers and direct management, you know, trying to screw each other. The union should have been savvy enough to see the writing on the all and make concessions, but they do not want to make any, not good business today.

Now on the other hand, I think it is shameful for Verizon to try to break the union. They want to bring in private contractors to do installations and repairs. I have Optimum cable and they hire contractors, 99% of the time the contractors are under trained and generally are not knowledgeable. I am pro union, but I am also a believer that the unions must understand the costs involved. There is too much competition in the telecommunications field today and Verizon no longer has a monopoly on phone service. I have had recent experience with my office phones, fax and DSL. The service on 8 lines went out at once, no communications. As a service contractor to the City of NY we must have our lines up, we do emergency repairs to the public housing, NYCHA, and must respond within a certain time frame.

So, after Verizon not being able to fix this problem, which was due to heavy rain and us being connected to the oldest "box" in Brooklyn, we have decided to jump ship and go to Time Warner cable. Time will tell if it will be better, but my neighbors assure me that they have never had an outage. Verizon is and will continue to lose customers everyday due to not being able to get a service person out to a job. I know of two families that were scheduled to have FIOS installed and they have cancelled it because they do not know when or if they'll get the FIOS service.

I am told that Verizon is not concerned as much with land lines anywhere near their FIOS and especially Verizon Wireless.

My niece will lose her families health insurance at the end of the month, nice, thanks Verizon. Bottom line is they are trying to clean house. I believe they will succeed in breaking the union.

Supe you call it bargaining, when the workers say you'll pay us or we won't let anyone else enter your door to work, and threaten to financially break you? An employer should be able to hire anyone that they want. The unions care about the dues (revenue stream they get).

Way too much benefits? Too much time off? High pension?? 5 weeks vacation after 25 yrs is a lot of time off?? Plus the normal national holidays? Under $2000 a month for top craft after 30 yrs is a high pension?

Despite what Verizon says, FIOS is still landline under a different name and much high price and profit.

Excellent comeback Vinman, had'ent thought that before. I'm not a big fan of unions and their demands, and they seem to be hanging on until hell freezes over, which may be soon.

The customer pays for both. Ever wonder things would cost without inflated salaries?

If you're good at what you do, why exactly does one need a union?

I have no use for them. None.

Businesses today are far more afraid of being outed for some indiscretion or misbehavior by someone with a cell phone video on YouTube or of being sued than virtually anything else.

If all states were simply "right to work" where a given employee could decide to opt in or not (instead of being forced) I'd be more open to the idea, but the forced membership in these organizations that exist solely to usurp business and destroy productivity and profitability make them very difficult to support in any way, shape or form.

With all the info out there, explain to me how the "unions" have hurt Verizon.

What woulds be fair wages/benefits/time off, blah blah blah...?

I am 100% completely anti union. I think they served a purpose when workers were dying in mills, and mines, etc.

Today, jobs are much safer, not due to unions, but do to a combination of safety laws, lawsuits, etc.

I also will mention that I think CEOs are a cancer as bad as unions. They do not deserve the rates they get, nor the golden parachutes.

Personally, every time I have dealt with a union product I found it to be less well assembled than a free workers. I was forced to be in a union during college and I used to tell everyone, union members included, that we were so overpaid it was a joke. The entitlement that union workers have is unreal.

When a person knows they have to perform well, or lose their job they will work much harder, and produce a etter product than those who are complacent and protected.

If there was an option when buying a car for a union built for x dollars and a non union built for x+5%, I would go for the more expensive, but better built option. Some may think thats crazy, but I would wager when I go to sell it I would recoup the difference, and when operating costs are tallied,the better assmebled, non union, product, it would be cheaper in the long run.

Unions need to go.

Ever wonder what things would cost, and what would be available to buy, if workers did not have jobs. Or if they had jobs, but could afford only housing, transporation and food but no luxuries like televisions or cable service?

Think of money flow in our economy as a circle rather than a line. Commercial interests would love to have you continue to think of it as a line, ending as cheap capital. And then they want you to believe this capital creates jobs. Think more carefully about that construct. Want a better economy? Ask any economist about that. They will tell you that an economy's strength is almost purely determined by how much money is in the hands of consumers. Want a better economy? Cheaper capital won't get you there. More money in the hands of consumers will get you there. Family-wage jobs are not the problem. They are the solution.

Supe, what is really ironic, is that most of my friends that are union bashers, sit on their butts behind a desk all day and make well into the six-figures, have more time off then i do, and will most likely recieve a much better pension. They are also the same ones always screaming about jobs being lost to outsourcing.

Dont get me wrong, I'm not a total union lackey. I have seen some unions destroy companies. Plus i dont not agree with alot of their tactics. But not all of them are blood sucking leeches that people make them out to be.

well one thing the Union is not good at..
improving their public perception/relations....
as Supe and Vin point out there is 'good'...
but after watching them in Wis. & other places
folks now understand..
those dogs are rabid..
cute pup when we brought him into our house..
we grew together...
now he growls at the the feeder...
time to put him down..

Rika

Very true Rika. The teachers union here in Jersey is doing more damage to their image than they can ever repair.