Going to install baseboards and crown molding - what tools will I need?

[intakexhaust]

cantdrv55-
I did finish carpentry and built custom cabinets many years for high-end homes, etc. Always a labor of love. Being a gearhead and Porsche guy I enjoy lurking on this forum and won't go into too much here, but this topic could really go on forever and will TRY to keep it brief.

First- I have no way to evaluate your skill level or capabilities but none the less, email me and I'll send you a PDF guide that any novice and pro can appreciate. Fast reading and lots of great photo's. Review your room(s) and expect nothing to be square... including uneven floors ; ) Determine whats behind the walls before nailing away (electrical. plumbing, etc.)!

Second- If you've had a chance to observe journeymen and how they can fly thru the project, its because there is a lot LESS calculating and measuring than you would think. Ex. Terms like 'spring angle' may not exactly mean as in a degree to some. After looking over a room, there is a start strategy and oddly not all corners are angle or bevel cut. Don't over think but do think logical... not sure if that exactly makes sense.

Third- What material are you planning to use and is it stain-grade level or painted? Regardless - finish the material first, then install. If painting, you can have some forgiveness and caulk is always used. It's a different story with stain-grade and precise joints by proper coping and other tricks make the quality. I know a few old timers who are real fast without a miter saw and yet hand cope inside corners. Take in consideration the climate and your home. Wood is a constant breathing material and joints move, contract and expand. All this applies to installing base trim.

Four- Tools. This is as bad as my addiction to Porsche's. I have know idea what you have or budget but I'll toss this out to you.
Coping saw... depends if you plan to go that route.

Miter saw- lots of choices depending on your needs and stock. I've used some top-end Hitachi's, Bosch but my tried and true Dewalt 12" double bevel, slider is simple and rarely goes out of adjustment. See if you can find a desperate un-employed seller on craigslist or hit the pawn shops. I find top-end Dewalts in Chicago for $125 - $150. Get a new finish blade (another topic and depends on many factors) tip- don't burn the stock or the blade. Larger thin kerf finish blades can warp DURING the cut and returns to normal as soon as you stop! When done with the project, keep or simply resell it and have a zero investment.

Compressor and brad nailers- YES to having them. Portable comp. is cheap anywhere. Package deals for new are cheap or do the pawn shop / craigslist thing. Get an 18 ga and maybe for little detail trim 23 ga. pin nailers. Get a small nail set too.

There are some other things but I'll catagorize it for now as misc. and avoid the gimmick tools, lasers are not needed. Your good eyes are better.

Enough from me for now - cheers, Scott

[juanbenae]

get a caulking truck and pump for patching the crown molding you install prior to paint...... crown molding is hard to do if not polished at it. you will need a compound miter saw and some practice to get it. thing is practice eats up material that can be $$$ per foot.

i would suggest you build an inside & outside corner piece to better visualize what you will be cutting after you've taken your measurement. ive installed crown during my carpenter days and this truely does help. also, when you do have your two pieces hung dont nail all the way into the corners until you have both pieces up. this allows you to adjust the corners by rolling the two ends to close any gaps before nailing.

i would also as cliff suggested hire a finish carpenter that will allow you to work as his helper. if you insist on doing it yourself start with the base to get a feel for the tools and like ann frank mistakes in baseboard can be hidden. crown on the otherhand, by the time you got it figured out the job is done, poorly. if it was easy gurlscouts would be doning it....

[intakexhaust]

Originally Posted by look 171

How do you want to cut the crown? Up on edge or flat on a compound miter saw? If ther are to be cut flat, then you need to determine the angle of the crown mounding. i would suggest cutting it flat and because holding a long piece up against the fence of the saw is a pain the the rear. You would need some help for sure. Unless you use the string trick. I have done enough of it in college with the string. So help is always available when ever crown mounding are to be install. I still do much of the finish carpentry because its fun until the damn phone rings with you up on the ladder with one hand on the crown and the other with a nail gun in hand. If you can't fine the angles to set up the miter saw, I can give them you once you have the degree on the crown.

Jeff

One man job period. If on the clock and Mr. and Mrs. Howel are moving into the mansion the next day and you only have the walnut library and smoking room half finished, yea, get some help.

If using a miter saw, cut the crown STANDING up against the fence AND table.

[JavaBrewer]

Can't add much other than a couple stands for materials and the saw so you won't have to work on the ground.

[madmmac]

24 responses, where's the ..................................beer.

Measure 2x, cut 1x. Molding makes great kindling.

[look 171]

Measure once, cut once. Measuring twice is taking too much time IMO. One can't measure a long wall by himself without spending a whole bunch of time playing fetch with the tape measure. I use a stick cut to exactly 10". I butt it up against the wall and mark the end of the stick on the wall with a pencil. I then pull my tape from the opposite end of the wall where the crown will sit up to the pencil mark then add 10" to that measurement. It is a real PITA to measure the inside corner with a tape to get it accurate. There is no guessing this way. I back it off a 1/16" or a little less on the actual cut. it fits every time. Stain grade material must almost be cope. I cope with a grinder or a jig saw after it get cut on the chop saw. I always cut my crown flat. Some of the ones we do are build ups. Many are up 8" - 10" wide sometimes. One more trick, don't try to shoot it into the studs the first time around. shoot the center or 3 feet away from the end of the joint. This way, you give yourself a way out if you need to twist or shim the crown to fit due to an uneven wall. A little hump will screw up your day if you have not done crown. Go back and shoot it into the stud once the piece fits in place.

[NY65912]

Cut crown...upside down and backwards, then cope the profile of the crown so it sits into the negative profile of the adjacent molding usind a coping saw. It really is not that bad after you have envisioned the joints.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by NY65912

Cut crown...upside down and backwards, then cope the profile of the crown so it sits into the negative profile of the adjacent molding usind a coping saw. It really is not that bad after you have envisioned the joints.

create the profile by cutting the bevel on the chop saw, then cope away to the finish line. You just created it with the chop saw. No upside down or backward cutting. Instead, grind away with a angle grinder with 60 grit disc. YOu can get really accurate with the angle grinder or a special foot jig saw.

[intakexhaust]

Weird - Just logged into Pelican tonight, started to read the PM's and all of a sudden they were gone??? I've never had any voodoo like this or have seen this on Pelican. All my messages from prior are good but from those today...ZZZZZZ (my guess Wayne's hanging more of those life size posters in the new location and drove a nail into a data line!)

Sorry as I don't have the two emails that requested the PDF.
My email is carrera_lemans247@yahoo.com and just contact me direct. The file is approx. 150mb. and if that doesn't work I sometimes use sendspace. Whatever works for you, glad to help. Scott

______________________________________
I should have been a bit more humble in my reply about doing the job without a helper. Here's the cheat:
http://www.harborfreight.com/2-in-1-support-cargo-bar-66172.html

These excellent pick-up truck cargo bars are they same things as sold in woodshop stores and used as supports, cripples, etc. First go to google and get your 20% off discount for HF before ordering. Get 2 of them.

[intakexhaust]

Quick tips for starters:

Do the base first as a warm-up and get comfy with your endeavor.

For the crown / cornice... again I'm just thinking your going basic (no multi piece build, etc.)
Pre plan the start point strategy to work around and make sure you lightly mark the upper wall studs, and joist to where you will use the fastener (brad nail, etc.).

Big crown might be easier for you to make nailers (little triangle type wood backers) and attach first.

I'll skip the angles and other talk right now, but you can move quickly and have the sweetest tightest joints that maintain by the following method. Lets assume we have four wall all inside corners for simple explanation. Visual here: wherever you start, that first piece can be a simple straight butt cut and it fits square to the end wall... got it? The same piece and the other end is the same type of butt cut! Now, the next piece will be a miter bevel and you cope it to the profile to fit the first one (already up). The other end is a simple butt cut! Piece three is a miter bevel and cope to fit piece two (already up). Piece four and the last is miter bevel with coping on both ends.

With this method, hopefully you might see the reasonings, beauty of it and why the joints always look tight and precise even during climate changes.

[J P Stein]

Back in the day my painter buddy would rag on me if I left any gaps in
to-be-painted mouldings. I would rag on me if I left any gaps in the pre-finished stain/varnished mouldings.....the latter was the worst.

Hire a pro.....the good ones work fast and are rea$onable. They're most all looking for work.

[trekkor]

I have all of the tools and experience to do this job.

Call me!


KT

[dad911]

Paint grade or stain? One room or 10? simple square room, or are there cathedral ceilings, etc?

Lot's of tricks, like cutting the base a little long, so it snaps into place and won't open up if it shrinks..... and what to do when you are nailing crown along the ceiling parallel to the floor joists, there probably won't be any beams to nail into....

Like others have said, if you have a friend with experience that can get you started, that would be a big help.

As far as the original question, all you need is a miter saw, coping saw, tape measure, some sandpaper, a caulk gun, hammer, nail set and nails. A finishing nail gun and snap line might make life easier.

[javadog]

Don't forget to buy your moldings a month or so in advance and let them get used to the moisture levels in your house...

JR

[Burnin' oil]

It's not rocket surgery - just do it.

[intakexhaust]

Originally Posted by look 171

Measure once, cut once. Measuring twice is taking too much time IMO. One can't measure a long wall by himself without spending a whole bunch of time playing fetch with the tape measure. I use a stick cut to exactly 10". I butt it up against the wall and mark the end of the stick on the wall with a pencil. I then pull my tape from the opposite end of the wall where the crown will sit up to the pencil mark then add 10" to that measurement. It is a real PITA to measure the inside corner with a tape to get it accurate. There is no guessing this way. I back it off a 1/16" or a little less on the actual cut. it fits every time. Stain grade material must almost be cope. I cope with a grinder or a jig saw after it get cut on the chop saw. I always cut my crown flat. Some of the ones we do are build ups. Many are up 8" - 10" wide sometimes. One more trick, don't try to shoot it into the studs the first time around. shoot the center or 3 feet away from the end of the joint. This way, you give yourself a way out if you need to twist or shim the crown to fit due to an uneven wall. A little hump will screw up your day if you have not done crown. Go back and shoot it into the stud once the piece fits in place.

Keep it simple lessons. How to measure (is a one person job):

Use a decent tape with a good stand-out strength for length. The loose 1/8 wiggle on the tape end is normal for proper butt or pull measuring (sounds funny).

Assuming your on the ladder approx. 1/3 distance, whatever from a wall end. Extend the tape sideways and butt the tape end to the shortest wall distance, pick a round number (whatever you like... say 100 inches, etc.) and make a mark. Now take the tape and extend to butt the other side and measure to your mark. Add the two numbers. Done and you now have a perfect 'long' number.

For an outside corner, most of the time I don't waste time measuring.

Assume your standing on the ladder and at the outside corner.
Take your un-cut molding stock and butt it to the wall / or is coped to the mating piece. Make a mark on the backside of the molding stock where it meets the corner. Thats your perfect 'short' number.

Before you cut, transfer the mark to the front side. Make a mental note what it is- left or right, long or short, etc. and place it angled but standing up against the saw fence and table. Set your saw properly. The saw KERF should not cut that pencil mark.

For easy figuring of angles: MUST HAVE a sliding T-bevel tool.
Rarely do you even need to know angles or degrees! The sliding T-bevel is simply positioned and locked to whatever the wall or ceiling angle is and locked. Take the tool to the saw and replicate the angle. Done.

Yes, I admit to being a tool junkie and even have a Bosch digital miter angle finder that calculates everything. I use it for certain applications (including car suspension set-up) but you don't need it to confuse your job at hand. Scott

[drcoastline]

I was going to post my .02 but after reading intakexhaust's posts he is dead on and offering good advice. I don't recall if he offered the following but if not I would offer the following advice as well.

1. Buy your stock and bring it into your house for a few days before starting so the lumber can acclimate to your house before starting.

2. Glue the joints to help keep from opening.

You don't need the best chop box on the market with a laser. I have a 10" Chop Box and a 10" table saw made by Delta that I bought at Lowe's probably 10 years ago for $99.00 each that I still use. I also have a 3 pack set of nail guns from Harbor Freight I paid $50.00 for the set about 3 years ago and a Harbor Freight 3 gallon compressor I paid $59.00. You do need a sturdy 30' tape a good compound miter square, a sharp pencil, a sharp razor knife a sharp set of chisels a coping saw and a nail set.

[intakexhaust]

drcoastline - Right on and thanks but you have the right idea on those guns from HF. For years I've treasured my investment in Porter Cable, Paslode and a few Stanleys but when I had subs and provided tools, those package deal sets are terrific and get the job done just as good. Menards in the midwest run similar deals and ridiculous how it cost next to nothing. Plus you don't feel too bad when someone gets 'sticky fingers'.

Since I've semi-retired, I laughingly tell others I'm saving more because I don't buy as many tools and no longer get them lifted from me. Those awesome titanium hammers are addicting and just gotta have my 'fix'. Don't need but gotta have-em, Mark Martinez, pres. of Stilleto first sold me on them and I was hooked on that bad habit... lol.


Onto the PDF I promised and will get one started. Hopefully this link will work (150mb download).
Download Trim_&_Finish_Carpentry.pdf from Sendspace.com - send big files the easy way

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by vash

i remember when i was a kid watching a man install crown molding..some type of molding.

he would put a bunch of finishing nails in his mouth and spit it onto the end of his magnetic hammer. then one swift swing he would slam it home. FAST!!

if i wasnt a dense 14 year old at the time..i would have taken a closer look at his technique.

You were high.

[Zeke]

I've done both inside miters and copes. For paint grade I just do the inside miter. It's faster.

Tip: cut the bevel at 44* and the profile will be tight. Same with a lot of OS corners. At least one length will like 46*.

Cut it all an 1/8 long to try. You'll be surprised how many times the extra 1/8th gets used!