how does one transition from hard core casual drinking to alchoholic?
 

i have some coworkers. friends too. they drink easy 4 drinks a day. some of my good friends..hunting and fishing, they carry a 12 pack. (i just realized none of my california hunter buddies drink at all). some of my family members drink a bottle of wine nightly. none of them are addicted that i know of.

is it something different with people with addictive traits? i have addictive traits..i've been hooked on nose spray three times.

how does it transition? i've only known one alcoholic. a girlfriend's dad. he was unbelievable. like in the movies.

I've wondered about this as well. I played in a rock band and drank enough alcohol for a lifetime but I never HAD to have a drink to function.

I would think it must be in a person's nature.

We don't have alcohol in our house. Not that we don't have a drink now and again but it's more of a splurge for us, like a special occasion. "ooh, let's be dangerous and drink a wine cooler(wife) and 2 whole beers in 1 evening".

I'm curious to hear what others have to say.

Alcoholics want to have a drink in their hand from the moment they wake up until they go to bed at night. They might not be able to afford it, but they want it. My uncle from NYC is an alcoholic. He's the life of the party, but he wants to have a drink in his hand all day long, every day.

_

I worked with an old guy one time that came into work shaking so bad I thought he'd seen a ghost. Concerned I asked what was wrong. He said "I just quit drinking". I didn't know he drank. Certainly didn't affect his job that I could tell. (He was an aircraft mechanic) He told me he drank a half pint of Vodka as soon as he got up in the AM. Sneaked drinks all day long. He smoked to mask the Vodka I guess. Told me he couldn't get drunk like regular people. He went to AA and cleaned up. I love a drink. Kicking back on a Becks now. I go off on a job, I may go a month without one. I can't get a handle on the alcoholic thing either.

In my opinion an alcoholic is one who needs a drink. A hardcore casual drinker who can take it or leave it is not an alcoholic.

Addicts don't drink/take drugs/do whatever (call it "X") to get a buzz. They do X to feel normal and suffer if they stop or try stopping. Withdrawl from some addictions (i.e. chemical addictions) can result in death if not done with intent, time and care. Withdrawl from other addictions are, in my opinion, nearly pure BS drama.

With respect to chemicals, best to not dance with devils. I have the "best" stuff out there available to me each minute of each work day. I've seen several folks flush everything by losing out to temptation. Some die as a result. Crazy.

Just had my four year mark without a drink. When I went to rehab I was drinking all day every day. On the way to work, at work, after work. Wake up, do it again. I knew I had a problem and couldn't stop. I needed it. For years I couldn't stop at just one or two drinks. That turned in to 6,7, 10, 12 a day. Every day. I'm lucky I'm not dead, and I'm lucky that I didn't kill anyone, and I'm lucky that my wife stayed with me and I'm lucky that my two oldest children who saw me hit rock bottom still love me and are able to move on from the hell I put them through. I knew what was happening the entire time. Couldn't stop. It was a slow transition and I'm sure I was an alcoholic for many years before I admitted it to myself. I guess you know you're an alcoholic when you're willing to take the chance that everything you've worked for, everyone you love, and literally everything in the world is not as important as a glass of whiskey.

Four years here as well, same story almost word for word. My "rock bottom" was when I quit, had a seizure then started again trying to avoid another seizure.

My roommate in rehab was a "well known" gay porn star, however he was "straight" I'll never forget that guy. :)

well speaking as a recovering alcoholic myself...28 years sober..I would say you get there "one drink at a time".
I drank for effect. never once did I ever go out and expect to drink one drink. Nooooo it was 6 glasses of mescal please..or yes I'll have 8 rusty nails or sure I'll have some more Jameson.. I don't think I ever "needed" a drink, but then I pretty much always had one so I really can't say. I do know that quitting was the single most life changing decision I have ever made. Had I not, I would be dead, pure and simple.

One never really knows when they "step over the line"...they just find themselves there.

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Damn,

2 beers a night is norn for me. some nights none.

How does one become like that? Does it build up over time drinking from college days? I have a beer once every two months, sometimes no drink at all for 6 months. A beer is a must with Mexican food for me. I grew up with this kid up the street from me. We did miles of bike racing together, one day he started with a bottle in his hand (at around 17 or 18 ). Next thing I knew, about a year or two later, he was drinking all day long.

That is definitely a functional / low dose alcoholism. If you down 4+ drinks a night, every night, you have an alcohol problem and should definitely stop the pattern, i.e. quit drinking during the week. If you can't do that, you should look for help. Alcohol at that level is not healthy, it is a lot of carbs, hard on your liver and stresses your body (increase cancer risk) even if you don't drift further.

That's all I can offer. I have no experience how people end up hardcore alcoholics / day time drinkers.

G

i dont get it either. i got addictied to nasal spray. my doctor laughed at me and told me i must have an additive personality. i cant use the stuff to this day.

drinking, i had to stop..and i simply stopped. i do have about 50 bottles of great wine that makes me sad i cant uncork. stupid underachieving liver.

I am thinking one of the reason some people don't drink is that alcohol really bothers them. Another friend around the old neighborhood can't handle one beer. One beer and he's buzzing to the point of throwing up. We tried as kids to get him drinking. No go. He will have one or two beers a year during our annual camping trip( My yearly intake of beer or alcohol is full fill the first two nights). We made him feel so bad that he had seek help from his doctor. His dumb azz doctor made a dumb comment about Asians having low tolerance or allergic to alcohol. Maybe its truth since I am no doc.

Research it. Asian flush, they can't handle alcohol well....

Alcohol flush reaction - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I grew up with an alcoholic father. His friends were alcoholics. I enjoy a drink now and then and have even gotten hammered a few times in my life. I never understood the "want" aspect to it. I have a good friend that drinks quite a bit and have tried talking to him about his addiction. He no longer calls me. I have other family members that I feel may over indulge in their drinking, but figure they are well educated and know of the dangers. I know from experience though that this addiction shows no mercy to its victims no matter what race, religion or economic class that they may be in...

As a teenager, I drank a lot partying on weekends. As a later teen I took up smoking. By the time I was in my late 20s, I had quit smoking an almost didn't drink. My big thing, especially with smoking was I didn't want anything I couldn't control. That goes for food, sugar, drugs, sun tanning, anything at all. If I feel I'm being excessive about something I moderate it or stop it altogether especially in the case of smoking, dope, drugs. When I was younger, I did the party scene with the usual things people did then, but lost interest in it because it didn't lead anywhere & was generally unhealthy. I've had friends and work mates who were alcoholics/druggies and I distanced myself from them over time. There are people who tend toward addiction/addictive personalities, and they are just part of the spectrum of people in the world and deserve help. Basically I accept that, but it's not part of my personal world & never will be.

Had a good day? Have a drink. Bad day? Have a drink. Friends over- have a drink. After work? have a drink.

the drink always seems to help the alcoholic cope.

BTDT with someone. it sucks.

I've always enjoyed wine with dinner. Grew up that way. Wouldn't miss it today. It's one of life's great pleasures IMO. Yeah sure, some evenings we probably drink a little more than we should, but so what? And late in the evening, a nice single malt rounds out the day very nicely.

When Aristotle was on his death bed some acolyte asked him what the most important thing in his life was, the Logic, the Ethics, the Metaphysics etc" (books he had written)...and Aristotle apparently replied "when I look back only life the most important time was the time I spent drinking wine in the company of good friends".

That anecdote really speaks to me. Those are also the moments I treasure most looking back.

Alcoholism is a terrible thing, and I've always felt sorry for people who can't seem to keep this in perspective.

I'm the first Douglas in six generations not to be an alcoholic - hell, I'm far to smart for that.

But I do have the gene for it. I'm very careful. I drink a glass with dinner and maybe two glasses if I'm livin' it up. Very careful.

I get addictions to other thngs. At the oment I've got a severe addiction to orange juice. I'm not trying to be funny here. I'm up between four a nd six times a night losing the orange juice but the craving and the euphoric feeling of drinking the orange juice make it all worth while LOL. I used to be addicted to candy bars, even worse ;)

My dad was a monster and I'd rather someone shot me at an early age than end up like him.

me and my siblings can booze it up with the best of them. and we are chinese. no red faces, nothing. my wife..hahhaha. glows!

i think i am blessed and cursed. i think that asian thing is pretty random. i know more that can drink than those that cant.

An Australian buddy of mine, a big guy that can really down the alcohol, went on a work trip to Singapore. When the Chinese guys took him out boozing, he said they drank him under the table, and they were about half his body weight.

This july will be eight years for me. I am not sure when the transition from social drinker to full blown alcoholic happened but once it did there was no stopping it. I was a functional drunk, worked every day blah blah blah.
My last day of drinking ended with half a dozen Albemarle county officers, some high powered weapons (most of which were mine) and my daughter being the one who made the phone call to the law.
I will never forget the look of disappointment on the face of that fourteen year old little girl.
That night was my last and the roller coaster that followed was insane. My license was suspended for a week, the Dr. drew enough blood to fill a trauma ward.
Sorry for the tangent off from the original question. For me it was a subtle transition from partying back in the day, to the social thing to just having it overtake me. I was lucky that I managed to get out alive and even luckier that I didn't kill anybody else.

Nice to bring the subject up vash, is something I've wondered about.
Cathy and I have been a pretty steady 2-3 glasses of wine/night for a number of years (never before 5pm).
Unknown to each other we both decided to give it up for Lent this year (40 days). She said she would have broken a couple of times if I hadn't given it up (she has a bit of a competetive gene). For myself it wasn't too difficult, mostly I missed the routine (I like routine).
Jim

+1
I like to come home and chill the gin, make sure the glass is squeaky clean. Skewer two olives and make sure they have just the right amount of juice clinging to them. Drinking the martini is just a part of the experience.
I ended a marriage because my wife was a prescription drug addict. I cannot explain it. We would go on vacation and if we were in the same place two days she would have found a place to buy pills. I still have a couple of hundred pills that I've found stashed around the place. Never had any desire to take any of them, but I do love a martini at 6:00.

A big ol' "Hot dang you all I swear!" to all you guys who got control of problem addictions. I don't think people become addicts because a lack of character, but it takes a heck of a strong person to get control them. SmileWavy

To answer the topic question - easily. You get two eyes, two ears , two kidneys but unfortunately you only get one liver which synthesises alcohol. Unfortunately moderation is key here:eek::eek::eek:Not much fun but that's the way it is.

Slippery slope. You don't have to be born an alcoholic to become one, you just need to practice really hard, until one day the tail starts wagging the dog.

Sugar is very addictive. Alcohol is broken down into sugar by the body. An alcohol molecule is two sugars joined by a water molecule...

I'm a beer with dinner guy, but if I run out I'm not rushing to the store either. I find that it's a good way to mellow out after a long day or socialize with friends. There's also not much better than an ice cold beer after mowing the yard, or while wrenching in the garage. I agree with a previous post, I think addiction is defined as need vs want.

[QUOTE=Bill Douglas;6743213]I'm the first Douglas in six generations not to be an alcoholic - hell, I'm far to smart for that.


As an aside how the heck do you know that far back like 6 generations? Is it documented? I only know about 3 generations and my mother's father's behaviour is not worth repeating except for his short stint in WW1. Yes indeed it would be interesting to know about 6 gens. of history but in my case some editing might be in order or it might become a bestseller!

Lemme grab a beer and think about it.

My mom doesn't have the asian glow. My dad does. And I do. Never knew what caused it until I went to nursing school and read about it in one of my textbooks. We lack an enzyme to break down the alcohol so it builds up in our bloodstream. I get short of breath, my heart rate goes up to 120's, and I get flushed. Almost sunburnt. And I get hot. Like I have a fever. It's weird. Almost like an allergic reaction. Can be delayed by taking Pepcid AC before a night of drinking.

4.5 hours to happy hour or in nautical terms it won't be long before the sun is over the yardarm:)

I left my husband because he was an alcoholic. I think I agree with most when it becomes a need as opposed to a want. When you risk losing your family, your kids, your wife, because you would rather drink, well, you are an alcoholic. He was functional too. To this day, he doesn't think he has a problem. He was one of those types who came home from work and had a beer or two. Then it turned into six. He didn't get "drunk" to the point he was slurring or passed out. Just enough to be really mean to me and my boys. Don't know how to explain it. Lucky us. He would swear at me. Call me names. Didn't know what would set him off. I begged him to stop. Told him I would go to AA meetings with him. Told him if he didn't want to go to AA, we could go to private counseling. He ended up lying to the counselor. And when he told me he would do it by himself, I believed him. He "cut down" on his drinking where he drank none during the week and just a six pack on the weekends. I thought he was doing better but his weird behavior still continued. I thought I guess he was just a grouch and mean person. Then I found empty vodka bottles everywhere. In the backyard. Behind the couch. He told me it was because of me. Because I was a paranoid wife who was always nagging him. That I made him drink. That was it. I couldn't do it anymore. I even went to Al-Anon by myself, hoping to find an answer to help him. But then I realized you can't help them. They have to want to help themselves. So, I decided when he lied to me for years about drinking, he didn't want my help. And it wasn't just about me and him anymore. It was about our boys. It scares me to death to think my boys may walk the same path.

It is easy to cross from the weekend drinker to the alcoholic. I think some people are more prone to it. And they have to be aware of that fact. It isn't fair but just like some people gain ten pounds looking at a cupcake and another can eat ten cupcakes and not gain a pound. To a certain extent, I hate alcohol. I hate what it did to my family. But it is all around. It is accepted. I have my good days and bad. Some days I loathe seeing my drunk friends and have to remind myself they aren't alcoholics. For about ten years, I didn't even sip any alcohol because I had to be the responsible one. Make sure I drove. Make sure he didn't hurt himself. Make sure he didn't yell at me in front of the kids. I like to have a drink once in a while but still find it hard to drink one without feeling guilty or scared.

Alcoholism. It affects everyone who is around the alcoholic. It's sad too because I still loved him. Until it got to the point where I had to stop loving him to just stop from hurting. Someone had to be strong and you can't do that if you are a blubbering idiot.

Just keep it in check, fellas...

From Recycled Sixtie: "To answer the topic question - easily. You get two eyes, two ears , two kidneys but unfortunately you only get one liver which synthesizes alcohol. Unfortunately moderation is key here Not much fun but that's the way it is."

You also only get one heart. Alcoholic cardiomyopathy results from a lifetime of drinking 3 or 4 or more every day. The heart muscle is damaged through prolonged abuse, some can recover with total abstinence, some cannot. It is a type of heart failure, and definitely will shorten life and make it less enjoyable. That's one reason why your Doc asks you about your drinking patterns.

I haven't had one drop since 1982. Back then, I'd drink half a bottle of gin on Friday night and finish the bottle on Saturday. I drank like a fish but held a 40 hour work week and paid all my bills. I did a great Carlton impersonation: "This is Carlton............................the doorman" (you older TV watchers know what I'm talking about). One of my favorite sayings was:
"I don't have a drinking problem. I drink. I get drunk. I fall down. No problem."

My definition of addiction is when you need it to cope: it was a rough day and I deserve a drink... or, if you drink on a schedule: its Friday night therefore I should go out and get drunk...

This is my wife and I, pretty much exactly. Well, not her so much with the single malt. We might have 3/4 to a full bottle of wine with dinner, works out to maybe 2 glasses each. I like to end my evening with a scotch and a top gear rerun. But days where schedules change I might not have a drop and not even notice it.

What a fine post, difficult to write I am sure.

I came very close to the transition and I remember the day it started. I am a wine guy, some beer in HS, college, etc. I grew up with wine in a Spanish household so it was natural. Never abused beer or wine...

After an afternoon flight in 1990, a few months before I was to leave for the Gulf for that little dust up, I got home and the cupboard was empty, alcohol-wise. No issue, but I was hungry and started looking through the refrigerator and freezer.

My roommate in those days, and we are still great friends, was not a big drinker either but had bought a bottle of Stoli months before for some party and it was stuck in the back of the freezer. I found it and thought, why not.

It was my first drink of anything other than wine or beer. Ice cubes, vodka and water. I can say without reservation it was the f'ing nectar of the god's, the perfect sensation. I was hooked.

My new habit stayed in check until I got back from the Gulf in 1991.

So. I fell in love with Vodka. For six months I drank. I am still in love but I can't return to the horror of that addiction. I looked into the chasm and it scared me to death, the road without direction but with a sure and swift end. I have always been fairly measured in life. Even when I dangled on the edge I knew what I was doing, or at least the calculus that got me there.

Vodka changed all that.

I drink wine with dinner.

There really is no standard for it. My definition is "does it get in the way of your life?" or do you change other aspects of your life/schedule to enable your addiction.

I could go into gory detail about the lost years, culminating on a 24dec83 that remains a signpost.

Sometimes I envy those that don't have the disease (and I firmly believe there is a genetic component). The only thing that I think saved me is that my body doesn't tolerate alcohol well - otherwise I'd have drunk myself to death long ago. But barely waking up on 25dec83 and being able to see where I was - I'd finally hit bottom. At some point the only lower level is a dirt nap. The good thing is that it is only up from that point.

I frankly think that there are far more alcoholics than admit it. I know guys who drink 4-6 beers a night. They hold down a job. Have a family. But you have to wonder what they might be able to do without the booze in their lives, and what exactly are they anesthetizing themselves from? That is a big part of recovery - or in fact anyone getting their act together. Figuring out what pain they are trying to kill and where it came from. That work in itself can be horrific. But ya gotta do the work.

I will have an occasional glass of wine or beer. But I never drink when I play. In part because making music is about getting in touch with feelings, and booze is about killing feelings. Kinda at odds there.

If you are prompted to wonder if someone is an alcoholic, they probably are. And there is no such thing as "hard core casual drinking" imho. They're trying to kill *something* inside...