I'd hope you feel your life is worth more than 3k....

heres another few notes of interest post crashes(multiple) here,that we have surmised...............

1) if ya dont have an on-board fire suppression system....................YER SCREWED!

2) if ya cant get out upon crash.......................YER SCREWED unless people around, and in the event of fire..........theres not much anybody can do.

3) if ya think crash/rescue is gonna help.................YER STOOPID at a private/rural airport as there are NONE and THERE NEVER WILL BE!

4) in the event of a crash at a private airport............about all ya can expect is someone like me showing up with a 5# fire ext and a knife to hopefully cut ya out.

5) even the airport mgr ONLY has a 5# fire ext and hes only there from 7-330pm

6) there is not (1) fire hydrant anywhere close to this runway let alone any hoses.


so thats why :

1) helmets are good.

2) on board fire suppression IS REALLY SMART!

3) EPIRB

4) 1st aid

5) food

6) water

7) fuselage/seat belt escape tool

so honestly about the only thing anybody can hope for, is something bad happening at a public(vs private/rural) airport with a crash/rescue foam truck on hand to lay foam down once aircraft finally stops.

working at an airport, you learn to watch the sky for approaches and stay the hell clear of the possible debris field in the event of a crash. for takeoffs, its the same, stay the hell out of their path.


yeah a nice surplus CRASH FOAM TRUCK would be damn nice here, but the powers that be are too cheap to buy one.


thats reality.

My airplane has shoulder harnesses and noise-cancelling headsets.

The noise-cancelling headsets make it easier to hear any engine anomolies. There is so much ambient noise in a small piston-powered airplane, that getting rid of 80-90% of it makes what is truly important to hear very audible.

Noise-cancelling does not mean "silence" by a long shot. The engine is still heard very clearly.

Here is a link about the pilots. Kathryn's Report: Piper PA-28R-180 Cherokee Arrow, N4567J: Accident occurred September 22, 2012 in Roanoke, Texas

I have the same experience with the N-C headsets. Mine make odd and random noises more noticeable. Maybe Joes are better than ours?

The point is that the headsets cancel noise, perhaps pertinent noise...they are a filter.

On more than one occasion I stuck my finger under the ear cup of my flight helmet and pushed it outward to help glean what a noise was. I also didn't wear earplugs like a lot of folks.

To the OP: Well done. A lot of folks would ride the other way.

It's not realistic to do so. Restraining yourself in a full 6-point harness would restrict your movement to the point of not being able to reach required cockpit buttons, circuit breakers, instruments, etc. Take a look at most cockpits, everything isn't within arm's reach like an F1 car.

Similar deal with a HANS device. Losing the ability to turn your head to look to the sides and rear would be more dangerous than flying without one.

The issue here is similar to daily driving a classic car, aircraft crash safety has dramatically progressed but you only get the benefit in a new airplane. If you drop $300k+ on a new aircraft you can get shoulder harnesses, aircraft recovery parachutes, airbags mounted in the harness, electronic engine control and monitoring, 16 g seats, stability augmentation, etc. In an older $30k used airplane you get none of it, unless you elect to add the simple stuff like shoulder harnesses.

Very sad, both knew what they were doing experience wise, the CFI with out a doubt.

Loosing an engine at pattern altitude and having a substantial power reduction at 100 feet after departure over timber are very different things, all you can do is hit the trees as slow as you dare just above stall speed. Better harnesses may not have helped.

Altitude is time, life and speed, a true luxury.

Low slow and no where to go. I have been too close to this relationship wise with friends fatalities a couple times, the best to their families.