Diesel question, help?

[look 171]

I have this older 93 Cummins with 100k on it. This afternoon driving out in the middle of nowhere I ran it out of fuel because no one around carries diesel. AAA came and gave me a little fuel, then I cranked and cranked but the engine doesn't start. I drain the water / fuel separator, still nothing. Towed it back to this shop, and the wrench was messing around with it but could not get it started. What do you guys think? Fuel pump? I know it is out of fuel for sure. This is the first time I have run out of fuel. What a pisser. I am really worry that these guys have no clue what they are doing. I don't want them to sell me the wrong part and rape me if it only needs priming. I know nothing about diesels.

[Evans, Marv]

If you drained the water/fuel separator, that needs to refill with fuel and the pump needs to be primed for it to start. Could also be your fuel filter was on the verge of being clogged and in need of changing, although that is probably a long shot. You should be able to hear the fuel pump working when you turn the key on. I'm no diesel expert, but those are the notmal things I would look out for.

[EarlyPorsche]

I have your exact truck. I can get you fired back up easy. Do the below and write back if I confuse you. It only needs to be bled. Make sure tank has 4-5 gallons in it.

1. Remove fuel filter. It's a spin on filter on driver side of engine.
2. Fill filter with fuel. (I usually just fill it with ATF but that's up to you. Also a good time to install a new fuel filter)
3. Reinstall filter.
4. There is a small hand pump on the drivers side lower side of the engine. It has lines going to it. It's your lift pump. Pump that little handle a dozen times.
5. Now there are lines going from the filter to the injection pump. There's a line in the middle of the drivers side up high that has a banjo bolt. Loosen that banjo bolt and hand pump until you see fuel.
6. The truck should start now and run rough until the air is out. If not write back.

[EarlyPorsche]

The fuel pump won't come on with the key it is a mechanical diaphragm off the engine.

[ckelly78z]

On my Powerstroke when I ran it out of diesel, the fuel pump was up along the frame rail and couldn't pull fuel from the tank if there was air in the line, so I had to use a suction pump to pull the fuel up to the fuel pump, and then turn the ignition on to cycle it.

It fustrated me for two days until I figured that one out.

[look 171]

Thanks guys. The truck is about 45 miles from me now sitting in a shop. I am running out there first thing Monday and see if their wrench can get it going. If not, I will have to roll up my sleeves and give it a go like you suggested. How often do you change motor oil on yours? Is it normal to burn a qt every 3000 -4000 miles?

[EarlyPorsche]

Originally Posted by look 171

Thanks guys. The truck is about 45 miles from me now sitting in a shop. I am running out there first thing Monday and see if their wrench can get it going. If not, I will have to roll up my sleeves and give it a go like you suggested. How often do you change motor oil on yours? Is it normal to burn a qt every 3000 -4000 miles?

You're actually not burning that quart. These older engines vent into atmosphere. There is an open tube front lower driver side under the truck. Oil vapors leave that constantly. What you lose is perfectly normal.

Give the shop this manual. It's for an 89 but same fueling system 1989 Dodge Cummins Fuel System

[ckelly78z]

I just changed 14.5 qts and a filter tonight on my powerstroke.....used Rotella 15W40 non-synthetic, and will probably let it 6000-7000 miles. I had to change my drain plug gasket because it was leaking a quart every 2000 miles.

[EarlyPorsche]

Oh and I change the oil probably every 6000 miles. And I add a quart every 3000 or so as you indicate.

[dean]

You also have to bleed the injectors. Loosen the nuts on the injectors a little put a rag over the injectors (the fuel is a very high pressure and will pierce you skin). Crank the motor till fuel comes out. Tighten the injector nuts and start the truck.

[speeder]

If the shop that has it does not know how to bleed the fuel system, (or does not know that they need to), you've got a problem. Diesels with a mechanical lift pump, like your truck, are as simple as it gets and they definitely need to be bled if they're run dry.

You should try to learn a little more about your machine there. Just sayin'.

[EarlyPorsche]

Originally Posted by speeder

If the shop that has it does not know how to bleed the fuel system, (or does not know that they need to), you've got a problem. Diesels with a mechanical lift pump, like your truck, are as simple as it gets and they definitely need to be bled if they're run dry.

You should try to learn a little more about your machine there. Just sayin'.

Problem is many of today's auto techs can do better when there is a computer. This 12v Cummins is quite literally more of a big rig engine than it is an auto engine. Most diesel pickup engines are quite computer controlled. A dedicated truck shop would have seen more of these style injected engines than an auto shop. If they can't get it bled it would be best to DIY. As mentioned make sure that fuel filter is replaced if it hasn't been.

[Brian 162]

When mine ran out the mobile mechanic primed the system the best he could. He then had me crank the engine while he sprayed starter fluid in the intake. That caused the engine to barely run but enough so the fuel system got bled and would finally run.

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by EarlyPorsche

I have your exact truck. I can get you fired back up easy. Do the below and write back if I confuse you. It only needs to be bled. Make sure tank has 4-5 gallons in it.

1. Remove fuel filter. It's a spin on filter on driver side of engine.
2. Fill filter with fuel. (I usually just fill it with ATF but that's up to you. Also a good time to install a new fuel filter)
3. Reinstall filter.
4. There is a small hand pump on the drivers side lower side of the engine. It has lines going to it. It's your lift pump. Pump that little handle a dozen times.
5. Now there are lines going from the filter to the injection pump. There's a line in the middle of the drivers side up high that has a banjo bolt. Loosen that banjo bolt and hand pump until you see fuel.
6. The truck should start now and run rough until the air is out. If not write back.

This ^^^^^ is what you have to do. I also carry the "flare nut wrench" in my truck at ALL times to open the lines on a couple of injectors to bleed the system out.

[EarlyPorsche]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

This ^^^^^ is what you have to do. I also carry the "flare nut wrench" in my truck at ALL times to open the lines on a couple of injectors to bleed the system out.

That's not a bad idea. I'm good about keeping fuel so I never run out but I definitely wouldn't mind having an adjustable in the truck just in case. How's your VP44 held up by the way? We had to put one on a buddy's 02 and also lowered the lift pump to the frame rail. Blew our minds that the pump was originally mounted so much higher than the fuel tank instead of nice and low and flooded. I bet the vp44's wouldn't fail if they had better lift pump placement.

[VINMAN]

The VP44s have two issues. One is the lift pump failure which burns them out. The other common failure is the electronic control box on them.

Anytime you run out of fuel you will have to bleed the injectors.

[Drisump]

I don't know about your specific diesel but I've run diesel trucks for a long time now and have unfortunately run out of fuel a couple of times (non functioning fuel gauge and clogged fuel pick up in tank). Although I was prepared to bleed the entire system, neither time was is necessary to do so. The hand primer pumps on both of the trucks got enough fuel to the system to limp along until all of the air was out of the system, probably about 10 minutes . So before doing the "full monty", I'd do as EarlyPorsche recommends....bleeding is a big hassle. Good luck

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by EarlyPorsche

That's not a bad idea. I'm good about keeping fuel so I never run out but I definitely wouldn't mind having an adjustable in the truck just in case. How's your VP44 held up by the way? We had to put one on a buddy's 02 and also lowered the lift pump to the frame rail. Blew our minds that the pump was originally mounted so much higher than the fuel tank instead of nice and low and flooded. I bet the vp44's wouldn't fail if they had better lift pump placement.

VP-44 are good injection pumps as long as you keep a minimum of 10 psi fuel pressure to them. The new low lube fuel does not help but thats life. The bypass valve opens at 14 psi, so keeping about 18 psi fuel pressure makes sure that you will have a good supply of fuel going through the VP keeping it cool and happy.

I have run out one time... bad pickup.

[look 171]

You guys are right on the money. Ok, this kid, the very young diesel wrench got it running in no time. Cost me 55 bucks and 20 bucks worth of fuel. He bleed the injectors and it started it with the first crank. He took the time to explain things to me and actually showed me what to do. That actually made my day. They don't make them like that anymore. I slipped him 30 bucks for his nice gesture and his eyes lid up and a big old smile. I phone the owner later about his fine young man.

[Joeaksa]

Look,

Glad to hear it and thats the nice thing about diesels. There is no ignition system, so if you get clean fuel injected into the cylinders at the right time, its going to run. Very simple and usually lasts a long time.

Once the air is out of the system on 2-3 cylinders, she should fire and once stumbling the others will eventually clear up.

Go to a pawn shop and get a wrench needed to bleed the injectors. Put it in the truck and that way if this happens again you are set!