Todays F1 Race No spoiler nneded

[yellowperil]

Good race, maybe not great, but interesting with a very tense podium. Would like to be in on a couple of team debriefs today. Betcha there will a change or two for
some of the top teams. Very tense and awkward on the podium, sure everyone could feel it.

On to China!

[widgeon13]

Anyone know if there will be a rebroadcast during normal viewing hours on NBC? What channel on DirectTV?

[ginot912]

Rebroadcast at 3pm eastern, ch 220

Good race overall, kind of feel bad for Button. Alonso.

[javadog]

Vettel can be such a dick. He's fast but he's tarnishing his reputation. He needs a better manager, anybody but that idiot Marko.

JR

[widgeon13]

Thanks

Rebroadcast at 3pm eastern, ch 220



Good race overall, kind of feel bad for Button. Alonso.

[TheMentat]

Originally Posted by javadog

Vettel can be such a dick.

I'm amazed that he would screw his teammate over like that... Webber "plays by the rules" and lets off, only to be robbed by an unscrupulous teammate!

[legion]

McLaren

It was interesting to see the problems that usually tended to hit Hamilton in past seasons hit Button this race. I've come to the conclusion that McLaren's problem is Martin Whitmarsh. The team hasn't been the same since Ron Dennis was running the show, and Whitmarsh while good, just isn't good enough for F1. He should be shown the door, about three seasons too late.

Ferrari

What a boneheaded move by Alonso. In order to come out on the right tires at the right time, he threw his whole race away. Massa may well end up being #1 this season.

Red Bull

Vettel is turning into a primadonna and may well drive his well-oiled team apart as a result. I expect to see him at Ferrari in a season or two. It is also interesting that Renault is back in F1 as a constructor...through a back door. Renault owns Nissan who own Infinity...

Mercedes

Apparently Mercedes has suddenly joined the front of the pack. I thought Hamilton made a dumb move to Mercedes, but apparently the thing that was keeping McLaren competitive the last few years was him. I hope things with Rossberg get smoothed over, as Ross Brawn was apparently tightly managing both car's fuel consumption, leading to a rather impatient Nico.

Lotus

What the heck happened to Kimi's race!?

Force India

You have three weeks to redesign your wheel hubs and spindles. Get to it!

[nostatic]

Have to disagree - great race. Absolutely fascinating. There is so much more to racing than just driving the car fast...

[nostatic]

"in the end Seb made his own decisions today and he'll have protection as usual"

Holy cow - this will be an interesting couple of weeks...

[Iciclehead]

What goes around, comes around. You can bet that the next time that Seb wants to get around Webber it will be a fight to the death.

They came perilously close to crashing each other out this time, next time they'll both be standing in the gravel doing a Nascar style disagreement...

I am actually thinking that Alonso is looking good on the relative scale, although I think I am pulling for Kimi. Did you hear his screaming and yelling trying to get around that Sauber?

Dennis

[yellowperil]

Yes a very interesting race, even had Hamilton driving through McLaren pit, must have been near tea time. He was a bit sheepish about getting 3rd place as a gift when Nico was faster, but Mercedes handled their team orders better than Red Bull. IMO

Team orders are still wrong and shouldn't really be allowed , as it spoils it for fans of drivers involved. But... team comes first I guess.

[legion]

Yes, Hamilton's mistake was funny, but understandable. I think Hobbs and Matchett each referred to his car as a McLaren once, each.

[VincentVega]

Yes, Hamilton's mistake was funny, but understandable. I think Hobbs and Matchett each referred to his car as a McLaren once, each.

No kidding, that was nuts.

Wow, any more drama and they'd call it nascar. I sure hope Webber doesnt get the shaft but it's hard to argue Seb isnt faster.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by VincentVega

No kidding, that was nuts.

Wow, any more drama and they'd call it nascar. I sure hope Webber doesnt get the shaft but it's hard to argue Seb isnt faster.

True, but Seb thought he was good enough to move to slicks earlier than everyone else. Webber stayed out and that was part of the difference. After that it is up to Seb to make the pass and he was having a tough time doing it. Once they went to fuel saving mode it was a douche move for Seb to ignore it and pass him. The scene in the green room before they went out for the anthem was high drama. Newey looked like he wanted to find a hole to crawl into.

[matt f]

Anyone know what Weber said to Vettel in the green room?
I couldn't hear it on TV and can't read Aussie lips.
It appears Vettel was smart enough not to reply at the time.

[Mothy]

"Multi 21 Seb"

Multi 21 is a team order code by Red Bull whereby the team wants a Multi win, with car number 2 (Webber) to stay ahead of car number 1 (Vettel). If Vettel was ahead then it would be Multi 12.

Bit like going for the 90 yard return with 30 meteres to go and no-one near you - you ease off only to find your own team mate strips the ball off you and runs on to score the touchdown.

Vettel has no idea what it means to be part of a team - it's all about him.

[chapo]

Funny how team orders at Ferrari in past years have lead them to be crucified here. Today we have not one but two teams telling there drivers what position to be in and no outcry. Team orders have always been a part of racing. Back in the day if one car broke, the remaining car was brought in and the driver ordered out for the star to get in.

[tevake]

Well, what I don't like is thinking that the front four places are just pacing out the last 10 laps and not pushing for the win. No telling what could have happened if they were all out racing and pushing to the end. Makes it kind of anticlimactic.

[Mothy]

To me team orders that make one guy move over to let the other team member pass is not acceptable - and FIA got their knickers in a knot on that front in the past.

However, where cars are running in adjacent slots, are not under threat from behind or threatening the next cars in front, I think the team owners are quite within their rights to ask their drivers to back of and not risk taking each other out or blowing up or otherwise damaging VERY expensive machinery.

The drivers might not like it but it's up to the guy who pays the bill. Rosberg didn't like it but Hamilton was under orders to preserve the car and Rosberg reluctantly accepted that. Webber was in the same position - under orders to preserve the car and ease off. Vettel ignored the orders and without letting his team know his intentions - no mistake, he knew exactly what he was doing. You don't get to be at his level by being substandard in the thinking department.

The real test now is if the Red Bull team management have the strength of character to to do something about it. They need to decide who is in charge and if they are running the team. If they roll over and show they have no spine, they might just lose a driver and then their whole year for the Manufacturers Championship is down the drain.

[Heel n Toe]

Originally Posted by tevake

Well, what I don't like is thinking that the front four places are just pacing out the last 10 laps and not pushing for the win. No telling what could have happened if they were all out racing and pushing to the end. Makes it kind of anticlimactic.

In this race, P3 and 4 wouldn't have been able to catch P1 and 2 by racing and pushing. Also, if they had raced each other, their tires would have probably gone away and they'd have lost positions. Possibly the same could have occurred with P1 and 2.

Then you add onto that the factor that telemetry was showing that some of them were in danger of not having that litre of fuel remaining that is required, and then it becomes obvious why they were under orders to finish at the reduced pace.