Mountain bikes - input needed
 

Have the opportunity to buy an entry-level mountain bike. Main use will likely be around town biking (to and from the tennis courts), and some light moutain trails (dirt and rock) as well as some paved trails.

So the questions:

1. Hardtail vs. dual shock - pros and cons of both

2. Brands: Kent vs. Cycle Force Group. I believe both are pretty low-end brands, but which has better quality? Specifically, I'm looking at the following bikes:
Kent Shogun Rock - dual shock, 26" 21 speed (Shimano gears)
Kent Shogun Trail Blaster - hardtail, 26" 18 speed (Shimano gears)
Kent Shogun Shockwave -
Cycle Force Group Mantis Eagle -- hardtail, 26" 18 speed

3. Accessories: helmet, gloves, water bottle, pump. anything else I should consider?

These are pretty much my only choices. I know there are better brands out there, but this is what I have to work with.

Thoughts?

Z.

I am researching entry level mountain bikes myself to replace my $150 bycicle so I can share with you my ideas so far.

Dual shocks are for aggresive downhill riding. If you only ride around town and light trails a dual shock will only add weight and cost (you will get less bike for your money).

All bikes use Shimano components (well, not all but most). You need to know the hierarchy between Shimano components, which for mountain bikes is Tourney < Altus < Acera < Alivio < Deore < ... (there are more levels upwards but they are not relevant to your needs). Tourney is basically what I have in my $150 bike and hope to get around Alivio for the $600 new bike.

Most bikes mix the components so you can have an Acera levers and an Alivio derailleur or vice-versa. So you will want to check the full component list and compare them.

If you link the specific bikes you are looking at it will be easier to recommend you one.

Z-man,

Please do not take any big box store bike off road. Real bicycles come in sizes to fit you. A 6'0 person needs one size and a 5'6" person will need another.

Cheap bikes are fine for street use 3-4 miles at a time. If you want to see dirt with out seeing a dr. please go to a BICYCLE shop.

Craiglist can also be your friend. Something a little older, but in good shape will set you back a similar amount to a department store bike...maybe like this:

MID 90-S GARY FISHER AQUILA MOUNTAIN BICYCLE EXCELLENT CONDITION

Understood. At this point, I can see only doing street stuff, and smooth dirt trails with the bike. If I progress, I would upgrade. I used to ride my 12 speed bike all over the towns in my area years ago -- but that was only on pavement.

The bike choices are limited because I was awarded 'recognition points' at work, and instead of getting some electronics that I don't need, I'd rather cash in on something that can help me loose my gut. I play tennis on Tuesdays, and the courts are about 2 miles from home. I figure I could warm up by biking there instead of driving.

That's all they are really for? So a hardtail is more efficient due to less absorbtion of the bumps? What about uphill? Is a hardtail easier when pedaling uphill?

Thanks for the input so far...
-Z-man.

Yes, a hardtail is more efficient uphill, particularly in low end bikes.

IMO - If those are your only choices, get the Kent "Shogun Trail Blaster".

The complete lack of suspension would be a feature in that there will be less to 'break' on the bike.

Enjoy!

-B

Buy the most expensive mountain bike you can find, preferably over $3500.

Ride it once, then hang it on the wall in the garage and tell everyone that comes over how much it cost.

That's what the guys I know who live in south Orange County do ......... ;)

Z, I just bought a used Specialized Rockhopper from Craigslist for $225, the same thing I would have spent on a POS Walmart bike. It was about $850 new. The biggest and most obvious difference to me (fat out of shape riding in town) is the frame, it is dramatically lighter than the cheap big box store bikes. I also went to a bike store and "tried on" frame sizes, then was able to Craigslist shop for the right size for me. Assuming I get into shape and want to get more serious with trail stuff (I hope), I already have a good frame and components to start with and would probably upgrade to a better front shock.

Btw - the Kent Shogun Rock (the dual suspension bike) goes for $295 on Amazon. The two hard tail bikes (cycle force and kent trail blaster) are $144 - $182 for what I've seen on the interwebs.

Don't know why the Rock is twice as much - but they are all in the same rewards points range.

I'm kinda thinking either of those two Kents - leaning towards the Shogun Rock

Get the free bike

sell it

buy a decent mb used
specialize trek cannondale

no box store bikes

Everyone thinks they need a mountain bike, but then they get tired of riding a big heavy fat tire bike around town...

Consider a decent used road bike, you can ride it on trails just fine, and it will be way better in the 90% of riding you'll do most of the time: roads and paths...

If need good offroad capability, look into a cyclocross bike. Basically a road bike with more offroad geometry and tires.

If you're 100% convinced you need a mountain bike, for the love of god, don't get a full suspension bike.

cyclocross?

Here's a nice Cyclocross bike, back when they were made in USA even:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cannondale-Optimo-Cyclocross-58cm-/321137711000?pt=US_Bicycles_Frames&hash=item4ac54c 9798

Cyclocross is the biking equivalent of rally racing...

Ask "K9Handler"-he's a mountain bike guru. He had some tricked-out rigs when we visited him in Germany.

What drawbacks do full suspension bikes have for simple road riding?

What about those bikes with have just a front suspension fork?

Thanks for the info folks!

-Z

Z-any suspension absorbs pedaling energy, the more money you spend the less it does this while still being compliant. Inexpensive full suspension bikes have busihings instead of bearings and no rear shock to speak of, just a spring. They're awful.

If you're just using this on roads , get a non suspended bike if they offer one, it'll be fine on smooth trails too. If all you can get is suspended, it'd be nice if the fork has a lockout, some do.

And for everyone suggesting Z buy elsewhere, he's doing this with reward points from work, so choices are limited. The bike will have little resale value, so flipping it is not really an option.

Tool bag for the saddle with patches and a tube and a few simple tools (Look on your bike and see what sort of fasteners are on it). I also throw in a couple pair of rubber gloves and a rag and a couple of dollar bills...

I was looking at purchasing a new mb a few years ago and I test rode a Fuji full suspension and hated it. It bounced up and down while peddling up hills and seemed to zap a lot of my forward momentum. It also weighed a lot more than a hard-tail. I don't do a lot of aggressive off-road downhills so any kind of suspension system just didn't seem like a good fit for me.

I looked at all the different bikes you have listed and they all seem to do what you need them to do. Like some have said, get the most expensive one you can (if you are using points and not cash) and ride it for a while. Then if you want something more aggressive, craigslist it and look for something more sturdy like a used Specialized.

First thing I would change on any bike are the grips and the seat (and pedals if you can.) That is where you contact the bike and will probably notice the most change. Definitely spend the coin on a good seat.

I agree with buying used off of CL. Lots of decent bikes to choose from for cheap. If you were in the LA area I'd sell you a 2000 Trek 8000, built in the USA, top of the line components (for that time), $1100 new for $250.

if you're doing mostly road with a bit of smooth dirt trail, why not get a 700c hybrid instead of a mountain bike. just the smoother tires will make road riding that much better.

definitely get a good fitting gel seat.

and if you're spending points, go to a bicycle shop and get measured and fitted. not just "you look about an 18" frame, here's one that'll fit ya"

tool bag: phillips head, flathead (or a multitool) and 6mm allen should be all u'll ever need. if you are riding far from home, a spare tube and patch kit would be good too.

Make sure you really want a gel saddle. You might hate that squishy feel, and a firm (not hard) saddle that fits well and is positioned properly could be the better answer. There are shops that will let you try before you buy!

As to grips, I have ergo grips on my commuter hybrid and I absolutely love them. I used to think they were a gimmick, but I am totally sold on the idea...

Z -

Get the Cycle Force Mantis Eagle. It is the only rigid bike on your list (neither front nor rear suspension). That means it will be lighter, more efficient, and more reliable. You do not need or want suspension for your usage, at this price point: your legs and arms absorb movement more effectively than the crap springs on a low-end bike, and won't fall apart after couple years (or months).

I don't see a choice of sizes. If I recall correctly, you are a fairly tall and big guy? If so, the Mantis fit should be okay, even if maybe not ideal.

Go over the bike carefully upon receipt. Inexpensive bikes are often incorrectly assembled. Everything should work crispy and effectively and pretty much silently. Squeeze adjacent pairs of spokes together, they should be tight and consistent tension (not much more than 1/4" deflection, using a really hearty handshake sort of grip force). If something doesn't seem right, ask here or check out the Park Tools maintenance guide online.

Accessories: helmet, U lock, spare tube, patch kit, tire levers (2), pump. Blinking red taillight and blinking white headlight (often sold in a set for $35) if you will be out after dusk.

Careful on the roads. You are even more invisible than a motorcycle and some drivers think you don't even have the right to use their roads. But don't ride on the sidewalk, at least not when there are pedestrians there.

If you decide you want a better bike later on, this one will make a good spare bike or errand bike or rain bike.

CL is a good way to buy used bikes, all you have to do is point us to your local CL and provide some basic info on size and desires. You'll get more suggestions than you have time to check out.

I agree with the no mountain bike idea, if choices are available.

For folks in their mid 40's and up, riding bent over on a mountain bike is not the best way to enjoy a ride.

The comfort line of bikes and cruisers are a much better idea. You ride on a nice spring loaded seat with sway back bars in a more vertical position. Much easier on the back.

We have been renting beach cruisers on vacation for years and finally picked up some cheap 6 speed comfort bikes for short rides with the kids. Very nice way to tool around the neighborhood. I also have a several thousand dollar full suspension rig in the garage that collects dust. I recently ditched all the super light go fast goodies for a tall stem, riser bars, gel seat and ergo grips trying to match the comfort of my Walmart special. It helped a little.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1370963770.jpg

These helped

What is that (I think I need one)?

Z, I am in the same boat... picked up a hard tail mountain bike for around town...

I like it a lot, the fat tires help absorb the bumps.. the nobbies help when you hit a little gravel/dirt on the road.

For an average Joe like you or me I think it works just fine.

Not sure why the hard core biker guys are obsessed with the weight of the bike...we are doing this for exercise... no? :p

That is logically true (heavier bike = more exercise) but there is just something distasteful about that sort of exercise. Better to burn calories riding a light bike fast than riding a heavy bike slow.

Go with the rigid bike. In this price range, front suspension and full suspension are really heavy and don't work particularly well. You'll probably knock 8 or 10 pounds off the bike weight between the full suspension and the rigid. Why does this matter? It makes the bike respond quickly, handle better, and just flat be more of a pleasure to zip around on. Ride it as-is, when the tires wear out, put on some slick or semi-slick tires. It will really liven up the bike. This will make a perfectly good "commuter" for you. Enjoy it - it's free.

Spend your money on a good seat. Gel seats "seem" like a good idea, but they are usually just squishy-ness over a crappy seat. A bike shop will carry good seats. Get one that fits your bones - a little padding is fine, but the base seat must fit YOU because no amount of gel/padding/pillows will ever make up for the poor fit.

As far as the comments regarding full suspension being a handicap on a climb - I don't necessarily agree. On an entry level bikes - agreed - the weight and efficiency are unacceptable. On high end equipment the weight difference is not so much, pedaling efficiency is very good, and most will have a "lock out" on the shock. Flip the lever and it's a hard tail for a climb.

This is my full suspension bike. This is NOT an entry level bike... I have finished 11 twenty-four hour mountain bike races on it. My back doesn't hurt and my hiney doesn't hurt after 24 hours in the saddle. This is very easy on my old body.

angela

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1370972241.jpg

At this price point, full rigid. Don't buy anything with suspension - it will be heavy and crap. I rode ridiculous trails back in the day with no shocks on the bike.

Understand the "points" thing but like others, I like to patronize my local bike shop. A bottom of the line bike from them will be better than the big box thing plus you'll get some level of service.

Curious why this comment? I'm by no means a hardcore biker but I won't ride on the roads. There are way too many morons and I've heard way too many horror stories, some on here. It is totally legal in KS to ride on sidewalks, but pedestrians still have the right of way. I normally ride at about 5:30 am, so that helps too.

Thanks for the input guys. Hardtail it is, which will more than satisfy my riding needs. So that narrows down my choices to:

Cycle Force Group Mantis Eagle:
http://www.cyclefg.com/shop/images/D...ensGreen_H.png
26", 18 speed
Cycle Force Group, LLC :: Bikes :: Mantis :: Mantis Eagle Mens'
About $144

Kent Shogun Trail Blaster:
http://www.kentbicycles.com/sites/de...%20Blaster.jpg
26", 18 speed
26" Mens Shogun Trail Blaster | kent
About $125

The only other bikes in my points range are basically beach cruisers.

I'm thinking the Cycle Force may be a slightly better bike.

Thoughts?

Any beach cruisers with gears?

the cycle force looks like it has 2-piece cranks, with a little beefier profile. The Kent has one piece cranks that depending on how much you weigh, and how much off-roading you might do, may not be as resistant to bending. (though you'd probably have to be doing some drop-offs or jumps to bend the crankarms). The Kent does have a quick-release seatpost collar though. Might be handy, might not be.

Otherwise probably mot much difference between the two. Have fun riding!

Funny, they look like nearly the same bike - the same frame, anyway. The Shogun has Shimano shifting, the Cycle Mantis has Falcon shifting, I'm not sure if that makes any difference. They are different colors, and honestly I might make my choice on that.

I think the Mantis has a slightly better crankset. The shogun appears to have an ashtabula one piece, while the Mantis has a 3 piece crank.

Oops. Just noticed that this is a repeat.

There are two - one without gears, and a Kent Shogun Safari Cruiser with a 7 speed and front shocks

Well, I am big-boned... ;)

Is it hilly at all where you live? If so, you'll probably want lots of gears . . .

Say you're riding on the sidewalk against the traffic. You come up to a crosswalk and you have the light. Car is at the red light but making a right. He's looking left for an opening and hits it as you are right in front of him in the crosswalk. Bam! This happened to me. Bikes move faster than pedestrian and can sneak up on the drivers. Also the judgment of speed when you're coming up to an intersection and the car is turning right and you're going straight.

And curbs suck.