Wind power energy generation

[widgeon13]

I happened to be driving through an area of upstate NY (Lowville) populated by many large windmills that I assume are supposed to be generating power, most of them were not moving. (Plenty of wind at the time) Why would someone put up these costly towers if they are not going to be running 24/7. Can't the power generated be sold back to the grid. Who owns these things and how are they managed.

I haven't a clue but would be interested in some education on how this all works.

[ben parrish]

Used to live in Boulder, CO and noticed the same thing from time to time. I was told that at times, the wind is too strong. Other times, maintance was being done.

[widgeon13]

That's certainly logical but there were just too many of these things not moving, wind was probably 5 to 10 MPH, no gusts. I've driven through here many times and most of the time they are moving pretty good, plus they keep installing more of these things.

This was taken this winter as I was driving by, good size towers.

[Hugh R]

Tax credits. Also unreliable for sustained power generation. In Los Angeles, when we need them are days like today and this coming weekend when its going to be 107. When its that hot, no wind. We get plenty of wind in the Winter when its cool and we don't need AC.

They can make a lot of sense in some areas of the country. Also the biggest migratory bird killers on the planet.

[porwolf]

Originally Posted by Hugh R

Tax credits. Also unreliable for sustained power generation. In Los Angeles, when we need them are days like today and this coming weekend when its going to be 107.........

How about Palm Springs, right outside Los Angeles?

[RWebb]

in the winter the wind power is ent north where it is cold (Orygun); in summer our hydro power goes south to keep LA cool

the grid is used to balance o ut the loads, hugh

and in NO way is it true that wind power turbines are the biggest migratory bird killers on the planet

where do you dig up this BS?

[mjohnson]

Originally Posted by ben parrish

Used to live in Boulder, CO and noticed the same thing from time to time. I was told that at times, the wind is too strong. Other times, maintance was being done.

Unless you mean the windmills south of town along CO 93. That's NREL's test site for windmill science - just for research.

[allaircooled]

Sometimes the power companies will only allow them to produce so much power, so the wind farm is ordered to cut production.

Being shut down for too high of wind, well it will have to be some serious wind. I think the cut off for GE 2.5 MW turbines is around 24-28 m/s. Don't remember the exact number off the top of my head right now.
As far as killing birds, every sight I have ever worked, more birds were killed on my way to work then I have ever seen on the ground near any wind turbine. The sight I am working now in Arlington, OR, they had a crew of "bird people" who did a kind of FOD walk down at every tower looking for dead birds. I wish I would have got the total numbers but rumor has it, they didn't find too many. I have seen one dead bird from a wind turbine after 3 years in the industry. Most dead birds on sight are stuck in the grille of my work truck or dead on the road on the way to work.

[masraum]

Granted, it's summer time which is peak power generation time in most places, especially during the day when things heat up and more folks have AC, fans, lights, computers, TVs, etc... running. But, power companies do turn the power generation up and down CONSTANTLY. And by constantly, I mean that they may adjust power every 15 minutes, 24 hours a day. I worked for a power company for a few years. It's pretty amazing how they monitor the weather, news, etc... and turn the knob up and down on the plants all day long. There are even plants called "peaker" plants which sit idle, not running until days when the load on the grid goes way up (and consequently the price of electricity) and then they turn them on and kick everything into high gear. So it's possible to have plants (wind, gas, whatever) sitting and not doing anything at times.

[GH85Carrera]

[QUOTE=Hugh R;7519821

They can make a lot of sense in some areas of the country. Also the biggest migratory bird killers on the planet.[/QUOTE]

I bet the cat is number one bird killer by a wide margin.

[Hugh R]

Originally Posted by RWebb

and in NO way is it true that wind power turbines are the biggest migratory bird killers on the planet

OK, but a major killer.

where do you dig up this BS?

How Do Wind Turbines Kill Birds | Wind Farms Eagles | LiveScience

USATODAY.com - Wind turbines taking toll on birds of prey

OK, but a major killer.

[TheMentat]

Originally Posted by Hugh R

How Do Wind Turbines Kill Birds | Wind Farms Eagles | LiveScience

USATODAY.com - Wind turbines taking toll on birds of prey

sorry... but neither of those articles confirm that they are the BIGGEST migratory bird killers.

Of course, birds die from other causes, too: Structures like glass-walled office buildings and utility towers, vehicular collisions and carnivorous animals (including domestic cats) kill far more birds each year than wind turbines do.

[Hugh R]

I still contend they are they a large HUMAN migratory bird killer.

Don't get me wrong I'm totally OK with wind power. Just don't get to believe that its totally benign.

[john70t]

[s]
of course, GMOs and herbicides and pesticides destoying the entire food source has nothing to do with it.
[/s]

[Hugh R]

They had everything to do with it.

[RWebb]

nothing is totally benign - for energy sources, I'd rank PV solar as nearly benign with wind next in line

habitat loss is the #1 problem for all birds and most other animals also - that new shopping mall the wife likes so much

cats are the #1 predator on birds in suburbia, exurbia and rural area (i.e. everywhere outside of Wilderness) - that is a human caused loss, of course

wind turbines can be a major killer of birds if they are improperly sited (some old installations were in the middle of migration routes)

the big effect we are seeing in some areas is bats - they have some studies going to test ultrasonic emitters on the blades to warn or scare away bats from the immediate area

[john70t]

Haven't seen any yellow canarys, tufted timouses, or nuthatches yet this year. Only a few chickadees and robins.
There used to be 2-5 in the backyard at all times.

Haven't seen any honey bees yet this year. They especially liked the oregeno and mint.
There used to be 5-50 which would show in the backyard.
Even huge solid blankets of red clover in public parks were practically empty.

My serviceberry tree is loaded down with uneaten berries.
Same with the Montmorancy cherry, strawberrys, etc.

Where is the nature?
What happened?