Orthodontist Price Check

[MT930]

My Fourteen year old Daughter needs braces she has some gaps and alignment issues nothing serious. No extractions needed.

Zero cavities I think she takes good care of her teeth. My Wife and I met the orthodontist, very friendly and popular guy comes highly recommended with a stellar reputation with 15+ Years of practice, I really would hate to shop for an orthodontist.

He is quoting us $5100.00 / 12-18 months (all inclusive) to do the job. Is this in the tolerance of the market for braces for kids now? I have no idea, anyone have any recent experience with this.

He will give a 10% discount for upfront payment.

I hear stories of costs from $1,500- $15,000 for kids I guess it depends on the amount of work.

When I was a kid I had a bad case, I looked like I could eat an apple through a tennis racquet. I should have thanked my parents more thoroughly.

Orthodontists or anyone having been down this road chime in.
Pic below of the Job

[porsche4life]

My teeth were worse than that, and I had to have my regular dentist pull 4 teeth before I could start. It took a little over 3 years to get mine straightened out and I think was between 4500 and 5k. i wish i had kept track of how many new wires and how many differnt parts he took in and out of my mouth. It was a lot though. My ortho took monthly payments and didn't charge interest.
Mine came off about 4 years ago, so I'd say 5100 isn't out of line. More importantly, how does your daughter get along with the ortho, and do you trust him to do it right? If the answer is yes, it's definitely worth it. I had friends in HS that went to cheaper guys, and ende up having to go through two rounds, and trust me that isn't worth it....


And yes, it'll hurt like hell at first, but it's worth it!

[DonDavis]

I'm in braces now. Mine were $4800 with the clear brackets on top, metal below, all inclusive. I received %5 discount for cash.

Mine were needed due to an injury to my chicklets. I was quoted 14-18 months in treatment then long term retainers. It's been a year now and he says I'm right on track. I'm pretty sure he'd say that no matter what.

[Nickshu]

I'm a periodontist, not an orthodontist but the fees sound reasonable relative to what I see in my area.

In the end you don't want the cheapest, you want the best. While you may see some plus or minus price variations by a few hundred dollars in the end it's your own daughter. If you pay a few hundred or a thousand more to go to a guy you are comfortable with the reality is that in 5 years you won't miss that extra money. But you'll sure be sorry if she gets a less than ideal outcome because the orthodontist was selected on price over quality of care.

[speeder]

I agree with Nick, (and the others). Number one, it doesn't sound unreasonable and two, that's not the place to save $$ in the budget.

[aigel]

Sounds at least 20% too high, unless you are in a very high cost area. I am in the South SF Bay Area which is $$$ and the pricing for a similar job was over 20% less. You need to shop around and also negotiate. These guys are having huge margins and will negotiate on the spot for at least another 10% discount if you sign up that day with a check. Yes, these are your kids teeth, but orthodontists aren't rocket scientists, any one of them with a decent reputation can do the job. I would negotiate just as hard as on a car, house or other purchase.

HTH.

G

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by aigel

, but orthodontists aren't rocket scientists, any one of them with a decent reputation can do the job. I would negotiate just as hard as on a car, house or other purchase.

HTH.

G

You're right they aren't... They are more like artists or craftsmen. I was always amazed to watch my ortho when he was sculpting the wires to get my teeth straight. He would be looking at the way it all was, and making little marks on the wires and then start bending them this way and that way to get them just like they needed to be to get my teeth straight. He was very meticulous about how he did it, and if he wasn't 100% happy he would scrap it and start over. You live with the results of what he does for the rest of your life. Find the guy who does the best, who you trust, and who is passionate about his work! I was the type of kid who would never smile before, and now I am not afraid, because I have gotten compliments on how nice my teeth look. In my line of work (sales) first impressions do matter, and not being haggle toothed is a pretty big deal.

[aigel]

I am not saying to hire the cheapest guy on the block with no reputation, but that price is too much judging from what I got quoted for similar work. The margins are pretty good, so if you don't want to shop around, at least ask for a larger discount and pay with a check or cash up front (no CC fees).

I always negotiate dental work. If you don't it is like walking into the car dealership paying sticker price. Is there a moral problem with negotiating with a guy that has a medical degree?

G

[Rickysa]

I agree with the short time frame (usually 18-24 months).

Price really is all about location and the local usual customary fees...fwiw, in my office the charge would be less, but that is for a little town in NC...you really can't compare.

[Nickshu]

Her case looks pretty straightforward except for the lower arch. Is she congenitally missing her lower second premolars? I see some retained primary (baby) second molars in there. This does make it more challenging to achieve a class 1 molar occlusion (ideal/desired). What I usually see is those retained primary second molars last until about the mid-30's then usually are lost due to root resorption, then they land in my chair for implants. I would leave them in place for now but future care to address these areas is likely. The reason this is challenging is the primary molars are about 20-30% longer than the permanent teeth that are supposed to be there.

As far as negotiating, in my practice I offer a 10-20% discount for anyone who pays cash up front (cash or check, not credit card). Maybe an angle to try. What I observe is the willingness for Dr's to negotiate depends on how saturated their market is. Guys in SF or LA where there's an orthodontist struggling on every corner are much more willing to negotiate fees, where you are at in Montana you are less likely to see people willing to do this. From a business perspective when I give a patient a 20% discount I cannot turn around and pay my staff 20% less, or pay the electric company or dental supplier 20% less.

[Bugsinrugs]

My three kids and wife all did the braces thing.......5,000 each. I am the only one with funky teeth.

[Schrup]

I have a mouthful of metal for 18months, $4500.

[MT930]

Great advise, I thought it was reasonable and fair just wanted a conformation.

Nickshu - That is exactly what we were told.

Thanks All !

Originally Posted by Nickshu

Her case looks pretty straightforward except for the lower arch. Is she congenitally missing her lower second premolars? I see some retained primary (baby) second molars in there. This does make it more challenging to achieve a class 1 molar occlusion (ideal/desired). What I usually see is those retained primary second molars last until about the mid-30's then usually are lost due to root resorption, then they land in my chair for implants. I would leave them in place for now but future care to address these areas is likely. The reason this is challenging is the primary molars are about 20-30% longer than the permanent teeth that are supposed to be there.

As far as negotiating, in my practice I offer a 10-20% discount for anyone who pays cash up front (cash or check, not credit card). Maybe an angle to try. What I observe is the willingness for Dr's to negotiate depends on how saturated their market is. Guys in SF or LA where there's an orthodontist struggling on every corner are much more willing to negotiate fees, where you are at in Montana you are less likely to see people willing to do this. From a business perspective when I give a patient a 20% discount I cannot turn around and pay my staff 20% less, or pay the electric company or dental supplier 20% less.

[JAR0023]

My daughter was in braces for 18 mos. I paid $2500 cash up front. Negotiated. All inclusive, xrays/fitting/monthly visits/extra cleanings etc. Well known dental group with large practice. We've talked to several friends who have had there kids in braces at the same practice. With insurance the round numbers parents have thrown out have been in the $5k range.

Our dental coverage was through the state (TPA under BC/BS) it was awful and we looked into this the year before we did the braces. With the coverage provided through my wife's work the total annual premium was actually $400 higher than the maximum amount of benefit the coverage would provide. It pays to read the fine print. -J

[Nickshu]

Originally Posted by JAR0023

Our dental coverage was through the state (TPA under BC/BS) it was awful and we looked into this the year before we did the braces. With the coverage provided through my wife's work the total annual premium was actually $400 higher than the maximum amount of benefit the coverage would provide. It pays to read the fine print. -J

Dental "insurance" is pretty much a joke. It's not really insurance, so I put that term in "quotes" but basically a $1000-1500 per year discount plan. It's astounding how many of my patients have dental insurance but have no idea how it works, people generally assume it works like medical insurance where it covers what you need, but that could not be further from the truth.

I recommend most people don't bother with it unless you get it for free from your employer, but even then don't ever count on it to cover all the care you need. In most cases if you were to just put the premium cost into a savings account each month, then use it when need it, you would come out ahead compared to purchasing and paying into a dental plan.

[David]

Seems a little high to me at least compared to Texas. I paid $5,000 for Invisalign for myself a couple years ago and $4,000 for my son's braces about 6 years ago.

My other thought on this is does your daughter want them and will she wear the retainer after the braces are done?

I didn't when I was a teen and my son didn't wear his retainer either. Fortunately now they have permanent retainers so my son's teeth haven't moved a bunch but mine did. Hence the Invisalign as an adult even though I had braces as a kid.

[Aragorn]

Originally Posted by Bugsinrugs

My three kids and wife all did the braces thing.......5,000 each. I am the only one with funky teeth.

Saw this on the news a few weeks ago:

Braces for Adults - Cosmetic Braces for Teeth Straightening | Six Month Smiles

Cost seemed to be in the $2k to $3k range and mostly for adults. Bridges and caps etc seemed to be no problem.

[LeeH]

My wife was in braces until recently. Cost was $3950 all inclusive. They thought it would take a year. It took two.

[Nickshu]

Originally Posted by Aragorn

Saw this on the news a few weeks ago:

Braces for Adults - Cosmetic Braces for Teeth Straightening | Six Month Smiles

Cost seemed to be in the $2k to $3k range and mostly for adults. Bridges and caps etc seemed to be no problem.

Ugh. Great sounding marketing but a Bad idea. Basically they straighten your teeth quickly then stop before the most important (and longest) part of proper orthodontics which is setting your bite and root alignment for long term periodontal and TMJ health. The sad part is that the ravages of this malpractice don't become evident for several years so most lay people would never make the connection.

The biggest point everyone here needs to understand is that there is a lot more to proper orthodontics than just making teeth straight. That's why anyone considering invisalign or six month smiles should think twice. Yes it works for some simple cases but the majority of cases out there are not simple.

Every case is different and requires custom planning, treatment duration and cost.

[Evans, Marv]

My wife had braces about 12 years ago - two extractions, bad TMJ, required lots of realignment. Seems like she had them for two or three years. Cost at that time was around $3,700. Fast forward to this year. Her dentist tell her she has had some movement & is developing a space between the two top, front teeth. Asks her if she has been using her retainer. Of course my wife says no, and her dentist tells her she needs to go to an orthodontist. The results were she has braces again, but the situation is nowhere as bad as originally. The cost this time around was $5,500 with a 7% discount for cash up front. This is in SoCal.