V8 guys, Is this an AMC block?
 

Any of you guys know these motors? I've been tasked with getting this thing running decently again. Nearest I can tell, this is an AMC block swapped into a Jeep Gladiator.

Currently it guzzles fuel and barley stays running under load. Any help would be appreciated. Has a pretty nice HEI Mallory on it and an Edelbrock carb. I'm guessing
its overjetted and the timing's off.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382919782.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382919817.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382919878.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382919893.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382919934.jpg

Those trucks are very high on the cool scale.
You should be able to find numbers on the block and google them. If I had to guess I would say it is a 304, it's a very popular swap

Looks like a 304

Carbs a 750 (1406). No wonder it eats gas. :)

What would you reccomend for a work truck and get reasonable economy?

I think Edelbrock makes a 600 cfm which is factory tuned for better economy .(ie slightly leaner cruise ). I think Holley also makes a small 4 bbl like a 450 cfm.
I wouldn,t expect miracles with fuel mileage with any changes though.

I just spoke to the owner and he mentioned something about it being a 360. Is this possible?

Well if it's a 304 like the other guy have said they are not a huge HP engine. It could also be the original engine.

Per Wikipedia: The 304 had a displacement of 303.92 CID (4,980.3 cc) which produced 210 hp (157 kW; 213 PS) in 1970-71 and was built starting in 1970.[14] Later models produced less power from the factory, going down yearly. 1972-78 models were rated at 150 hp (112 kW; 152 PS). It was rated at 130.5 hp (97 kW; 132 PS) in 1979, the last year it was installed in passenger cars, and 125 hp (93 kW; 127 PS) in 1980-81, the last years it was used in Jeep vehicles.

Check the engine numbers and the serial number. They should help determine if it was a swap and which engine it is.

210 hp, 150 hp, 130 hp and 125 hp

The carb should be between 500 cfm and 600 cfm I would guess.

Yes....



The AMC 360 had a displacement of 359.80 CID (5,896.1 cc).[14] The 2-barrel produced 235 hp (175 kW; 238 PS) to 245 hp (183 kW; 248 PS) in 1970 to early 1971 while the 4-barrel produced 285 hp (213 kW; 289 PS) to 295 hp (220 kW; 299 PS), 175 hp (130 kW; 177 PS) to 220 hp (164 kW; 223 PS) from mid-1971 to 1975, 140 hp (104 kW; 142 PS) to 180 hp (134 kW; 182 PS) in 1976, 129 hp (96 kW; 131 PS) in 1977, and 160 hp (119 kW; 162 PS) from 1978 to 1991.

It was the last AMC V8 to be manufactured. It was used exclusively in Jeep J-series Trucks 1970-1987, Jeep Wagoneer models from 1972 to 1984, Cherokee from 1974 to 1983, and Grand Wagoneer from 1984 to 1991 - becoming the last carbureted engine used in an American-built vehicle. It was also installed in the Bricklin SV-1 sports car for 1974 model year.

Edelbrock's website lists the 1406 as a 600cfm. Im not sure whats up with the thing because it drinks fuel just at idle. Like half a gallon of gas in 90 seconds.

Edelbrock.com - Carburetors & Accessories - Performer Series Carburetors

It's a badass truck for sure.

Someone put what looks like a 50's Chevy hood ornament on it at some point. They also made diamond plate bumpers on the rear.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382924312.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1382924337.jpg

My bad I typed in Edelbrock 1407...... 06 is a 600 cfm which should be good on that engine

If it's sucking that much fuel at idle the needle and seat may be leaking causing flooding.
The AMC V8 was available in 290,304,343,360,390 and 401 displacement all within the same block. Hard to tell from the outside but V8s were used in much of the Jeep line even the old CJ wranglers had a V8 option. Unlike other companies with a small and different large block series.

Could be a 55 Chevy hood ornament.

I had an F250 / 460 that had carb issues. Did a rebuild (cheap) and tuned it a little lean. It ran great, had tons of power and got double digit mpg if I stayed off the gas. It just needs a little attention.

Good luck!
Larry

2 barrel......

Edelbrock carbs are very sensitive to fuel pressure. No more than about 5.5 psi. Once that is correct, the carb is very tunable, responsive, and economical.

****, I don't even know how that thing will survive in the summer with a carb.

Oxygenated fuel boils over so easily that thing will be a treat to restart in the summertime.

Those edelbrocks suck. I've never gotten one I've been happy with. Do a holley with vac 2nd (I'd go around 700 CFM) - just for the sake of convienence, and get it properly jetted with a pipe sniffer.

Ps that fuel usage is gotta be some sort of serious internal leak. Wouldn't surprise me a bit as oxy gas ****s up and rots out carbs.

All in for this. They are prolly the worst 'aftermarket' carb out there. Edelbrock bought the all the rights to manufacture from Carter years ago. Carter 4 bbl carbs were kinda OK.............in late 50's / early sixties. Really very crude. They do offer about 100 ways to set the mixture with jets, needles, etc. But the problem is you can never get one "right" from idle all the way through to top end.

Every time I see one today I say: "Makes a great paperweight.............Now do you want it run right?.............................then replace it"


My opinion. Holley electric choke 600 vacuum secondary if it is a 304 / 650 if it is a 360. You may have to do a little tuning but it is very simple. Trust me you'll be much happier

Asphaltgambler has quite a bit more experience than I in this area and I would tend to go with his judgement above mine. That said, my experience with the Edelbrock 1406 with the electric choke is quite good. I had one my SBC converted Jaguar XJ6 that was a daily driver for about 5 years (no longer have the car). Zero issues. I put one on the 330 horse 350 in my Dad's Monte Carlo SS about 3 or 4 years ago - zero issues (still have the car). With the 330 horse 350, this carb is pretty much tapped out - borderline needing the next size up. We have one on the 72 Blazer that is still in "project car" phase. That one had the car put on a couple of years ago and is only fired up every few months to move it - but again ZERO issues.

I would recommend a fuel return line off the pump which is hopefully already in place, but may not be as that looks like a pretty early 70's truck. That along with a phenolic spacer pretty have cured any hot start issue I've had with this carb setup.

So would I buy another? You bet. Yours has a problem that is likely related to fuel/varnishing/stuck needle valve, etc. This vehicle will never get GOOD mileage, but it should get something fairly reasonable - certainly in the low teens.

angela

The Edelbrock carbs Do have one good thing going for them. You can take them out of the box and with no tuning, bolt it on top of almost anything and it will probably run ok. And for some people......that's enough.

The Holley is the same way, but way better if properly matched to the application. They are usually shipped a little on the 'fat' side on primary jetting the vacuum secondary spring is very heavy which causes delay in opening. But for this vehicle prolly about right you may have to step down 1 or 2 sizes in main jet for altitiude.

Some engine code info. Of course, if it's been swapped, all bets are off...

Jeep VIN Decoding, 1962-1992

Not for nothing, but my dad didn't like these trucks one little bit. A company he worked for in the late 60's used them and they broke down a lot. Cool looking though. I remember having a Tonka Gladiator. That one was pretty reliable. ha.

Go TBI!

You used the TBI pump + return line on the Monte...

That's why the vapor lock was minimized to only parked. With a mechanical pump siphoning the reduction of pressure will make life a hassle.

rjp

That is not correct. An 87 Monte Carlo SS is carbureted, not TBI, and the fuel pump on that factory 305 is in the standard location/configuration, lower passenger front. I've still got the carb in a box - believe it was a Rochester. There was some concern that the stock pump would not deliver enough fuel for 330 horsepower (this engine was 180 or so stock). So I removed it and installed a mechanical pump from an early 70's big block A/C equipped Chevy. I'd have to dig the receipt up, but I think it was from a Chevelle circa 73 or 74.

If it had a later TBI fuel pump, I would have definitely reused that.

Asphaltgambler? You're dead right about the idiot-proof-ness of the Edelbrock. I swear that a freakin' monkey can slap one of these on and the engine will run/drive with zero adjustments. It is startlingly easy.

In the carbureted hot-rod world, there are Holley guys and people who hate 'em. Me - I don't have a dog in the fight as far as Holley goes. I also have no experience with them. I've used Edelbrock on multiple cars and I have zero hot start, zero cold start, zero drivability issues with them. If this car isn't running right with the Edelbrock, the symptoms you describe are not inherent problems with the carb, they are a "problem" with the carb itself that requires a repair. Cheap way out of this problem is to fix the stuck/gunked up etc., part rather than replace anything.

angela

oops, you are right. Carbed and CPU q-jet....

I have an Edelbrock 500 on my highly tuned Rover V8 engined car and that is enough carb for 300 bhp on the dyno. The carb ran the engine straight from the box but it took way more than an hour on the rolling road to get it jetted suitably for mid range as well as WOT.

Everyone has an opinion- here's mine

Nothing wrong with the Edelbrock carb. First thing is to take the carb off and install it with a phenolic insulator between it and the intake manifold. That should solve any hard start/boiling fuel issues. Put a fuel filter in line to the carb and check fuel pressure, as others have said the carb is sensitive to what fuel pressure you have (check specs Edelbrock website). While you are in there visually inspecting the needle and seat do yourself a favor and write down what jets, air corrections, venturis are in it. This will help diagnose any issues later without guessing or taking the top off.

Obviously check timing and put a good ground strap/s from block to battery to frame as this almost always needs to be done to ensure a good hot spark.

Get AAA and drive it

Based on the driveway, yes I bet it is an AMC block ;-)

Sounds like a bad float.

I"m wondering if the fuel pump diaphragm is ruptured dumping fuel into the crankcase.

Dang - NOTHING worse than a leaking diaphragm... ;)

angela

Got a spacer and a new needle and seat for the carb. Gonna tear into it today and see what I find. Pulled the dipstick and dont smell gas.

Look at the side of the block down under the heads. Large numbers. Will say 304, 360, 401 etc. all amc engine share the same external dimensions.

I remember this girl. She could sing...from her diaphragm!

I mean, that would take years to learn, wouldn't it?

I had this 76 Cherokee Chief with an AMC 360 except in a desert tan. AMC owned them at the time and supplied the engines. It was a real horse and I loved everything about it except the crappy factory carb that was always ran like crap. Wish I had it back right now!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1383002726.jpg

You should read the Edelbrock carb owners manual .It,s available on line from Edel tech cen.
Before pulling the top to change the needle seat try the steps on pg 6 re flooding .Tap with a rawhide hammer and the pinch off the fuel hose run the carb dry and just before stalling release the line to try and flush any debris out first. If you do pull the carb apart , float level specs are also in the manual . detailed tuning info is also there as well as original jet sizes and needle specs. A very detailed booklet .

Don't listen to nay Sayers on Edelbrock. Know what this is?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...d/willies2.jpg

That's right, my 1941 Willys coupe. Look closely. That's a 502 Chevy engine with two of your carbs mounted on a Weiand tunnel ram. Talk about a tuning challenge! This bad boy put about 450HP to the rear wheels. Anything can be tuned as long as it ain't broke!

Im not putting a Holley on it.

The Edelbrock is a copy of the same Carter AFB which was standard on the famous 426 street hemi too.
I,ve had good results using them as well as a Holley.

I've never had a good experience with a Holley. My favorite 4 barrel carb is the Autolite 4100.

Got the carb off. Needles and seats were wasted. Carb full of gunk. Rebuild time.