Great read with some strong opinions and bantering.

I enjoyed Embraer's comments and responses as a passionate owner.

I own a variety of German and Japanese cars and also can say WTH were they thinking when they designed these cars, so this is a universal statement across the board, as hobbyists and DIY guys we tend to "reverse engineer" everything.

I would love to have a Ferrari in the garage specifically a 6 speed 550 or a 512 TR.

Yasin

I will never be able to afford the maintenance on any Ferrari, ever.

That said, the only Ferrari I'd ever consider owning, based on looks alone, is the F430.

I'd love to own one.

They are hideously expensive to maintain, but that's because the hands-on guys haven't gotten into 'em. At one time or another we all thought Porsches would be silly expensive to own, until we got our hands on one. Then another, and another.

It's just a car. I'm waiting for a few guys to really get into them, and figure out the tricks and then maybe, someday. Obtaining one isn't much a problem but if the info to keep it running stays classified then, no.

Hurry up with the tricks Ferrari people.

there are about 3-4 guys on Ferrarichat who are an authority when it comes to these cars. they do the major service at home, etc. ...and are GOOD at it.

like randy said, it's just a car. in fact, it's rather crude.

while monkeying with my car, ive developed a method to get the rear bumper off in 20 minutes, to change exhaust, whatever.

in the grand scheme of things...it's just as complex as any other 80's car. I would MUCH rather work on this thing, say, a mid 90's/early 2000's Audi.

I met you that day...I was there with my dad. he brought his SC cabrio. I cant remember if I took my 911, 912, or 951.

Mike, I have enjoyed reading your responses.

I have considered a Ferrari but with two younger children at this point it's not practical. I will be back in another 911 sooner than practical i am sure though, so who knows..

Have owned a 911 turbo, I'm curious as too how much the 355 is to insure.

Bill

I thought it would be a lot. it's not. I get the multi-line/good driver/yadda yadda yadda discount from state farm. I have the comprehensive, big insurance policies. i pay about $600 every 6 months for the Ferrari. it's the same as my Fiat 500.

I have collector insurance on the 911 and TR4. each of those is about $76 every 6 months.

That's really not as bad as I would have thought... Thanks

We had a 1966 TR4a IRS when I was a young child while my dad was stationed in Hawaii. The navy would only ship one car back and for practicality purposes the '70 Dodge Coronet made the trip. I'd love to find a nice driver 4 for him someday...

Bill

my TR4 is the first car i restored...worked on it every night during high school. had it ready for the spring of my senior year of HS. i did everything on it...including painting it three times to get it right!

before:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387777527.jpg


after:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387777542.jpg


i did things 3,4, sometimes 5 times..because i was learning as i was going. also learned about sweat equity.

i needed paint and body supplies...so i got a got part time job at a paint and body supply store. he paid me in paint and materials, etc.

fun car!

Great looking car! My dad's was white with a red interior and black top.

I did the same with my Mustang. Like you I still have it...

when my car came from the factory...it was Spa White with Red Leather. In my impetuous youth, i thought yellow with black would be a good combo. i'll probably just keep it that way, since i have a lot of memories of working on it. i'll never sell it

That's not the problem. People have been working on their own cars for a long time. Well, some people, anyway. When I quit the Ferrari club, I was about the only guy in my chapter that ever got his hands dirty. Most of the other memebers were completely clueless about anything mechanical and probably half of them had no idea how to drive the cars. And I left the heavy work to shops. It just wasn't fun. People think Ferrarichat invented the DIY-er but they existed long before that. Some of you that have been into Ferraris for a while might remember Clyde, from the Ferrari list days.

The problem is that they are more complex than a similar era Porsche (or whatever), the prices are higher, and they need more frequent work. For example:

Need to do the valve guides on a 355? There's 40 of the ****ing things, as compared to 12 on a 911.

Want to put your 328 on a battery charger? Open the trunk, remove the spare, remove a cover, bend WAY over to get to the battery at the bottom of the car. A 911? Pop the trunk and there it is.

An 80's 911 would go an easy 100k miles on the original suspension bushings. An 80's Ferrari is a little sloppy after 20k. Their springs sag, too. I had a pair of front springs on one of my cars that dropped the nose 3/4" after 10K miles. Had to change them, as with good springs there was still not enough ground clearance in the front to keep from bottoming the car on dips in the road. Not speed bumps, mind you. I'm talking about undulations on the highway at speed, that a 911 wouldn't even notice.

Ever break a trunk latch on a 911? Me neither. Buy a Testarossa and be prepared to replace both of the ****ing things, as they will break. The funny part of that is everybody closes a TR trunklid so carefully, because if you don't, you'll dent the aluminum hood. It ain't owner abuse that breaks these things.

Speaking of a TR, I had to replace 1st gear in mine before 20K miles because the gear was bad. Started making noise about 12k, or so. Bad heat treat? Bad design? Who knows. Let's just say its a pain in the ass. Not A DIY job. Any idiot can be taught to pull the gearbox out of a 911 in his garage. You're not going to do that with a TR. You have to pull the entire powertrain out (and it's big, and heavy, compare to a 911) then split the engine from the gearbox. This of you that know how those two things are put together will understand why it's way more difficult than a 911. The gearbox is under the motor, which makes it a little hard to hold the motor on a stand.

Better a gear than a differential, though. Blow one of those and you'll probably split the cases. Then you'll be looking for a used gearbox. I can find a 911 gearbox any day for a grand or two. This repair on a TR will set the average guy back $15K-20K.

I can change the entire fusebox in a 911 in an hour. Parts are available and they are cheap. The same job in a TR is $2k and a nightmare to complete.

Window regulators are a mickey-mouse wire and pulley arrangement. You'll be changing those, too. On a 911, they are a lifetime part.

Etc. Etc.

JR

What about the parts? How easy is it to get parts for the models that are no longer in production?

Not easy. That's why I sold my last one, an '86 328GTB. Things I could no longer buy from a Ferrari dealer:

shocks
brake rotors
brake pads
limited slip clutch plates

I could go on, but those are pretty basic items, so why bother looking for the hard parts...

Some parts were available through the aftermarket. I found some parts in one place, others somewhere else, etc. Some of what I needed was sourced from the US, the rest came from the UK.

Yes, I know I could have rebuilt the Konis, so I don't need to hear about that. And, I could have used aftermarket brake pads, had I wanted to experiment with that. Brake rotors were hit and miss. For a while, Brembo had some. Then those were all gone. Then somebody found a stash of them somewhere and people started buying them up to squirrel away. Those are probebly gone by now, I haven't looked.

The point was that Ferrari basically told the world a few years ago that it wasn't interested in keeping parts for the older cars and companies like Maranello/Rutlands were considered the new source, for whatever was available.

I can't foresee the point in time that a company like Porsche would not be able to supply something as basic as a brake rotor.

JR

That's what I have heard from a couple of the local guys. Basically no support and extremely limited parts availability almost as soon as the model is out of production. I know nothing about owning one of these cars, but I was pretty shocked to hear them factor in the cost of a parts car along with the driver just to be able to keep it on the road.

so, ridiculously under-engineered then- and they make fun of Domestic cars....

Durability is one of the Porsche's greatest traits..

I have heard that bane before, that Ferrari seems to only cater to those with the means to afford the latest and greatest.

Need a part for your 348?
That car is over, you should be spending your money on our new 458 instead!
Can't afford a new Ferrari?
You're clearly not good enough to be driving one anyways then. Have fun with your broken 348 and your going-nowhere life in middle-management.

I recently had a look at a friend's latest 458. He's on his 3rd 458, I think. The dealer ordered the first one the wrong color, then something else was wrong with the next one. The current car has the wrong color stitching on the headrests.

Neat car, but you won't get much change out of $300k, if you order a few options on one of these. The optional steering wheel is something like $17k or $18K. Other options are similarly ridiculous.

It's a different game now.

JR

Me too. Better from some angles than others...


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387846324.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1387846358.jpg

Agreed. I think the shrub and tree look make all the difference for this car.