Home electrical mystery

[Drdogface]

I'm not a wizard at home repair but I can usually handle most things.. We have a plug on our deck, protected from the rain (that we don't have) and suddenly it does not work. Only thing plugged into is is some Christmas lights that my wife has on a small tree to keep it warm at night.

She asked me to change the plug and I did but knew it was not the plug. Checked all the breakers and got nowhere. As far as I can tell it's not controlled by any switches but obviously something has cut power to it.

If anyone can think of something else to check, please comment... I'm lost right now

[1990C4S]

Is it a ground fault circuit or receptacle? Or connected to a ground fault receptacle upstream?

[HardDrive]

Originally Posted by 1990C4S

Or connected to a ground fault receptacle upstream?

This.

The first receptacle in the circuit may be GFI, and is popped.

[GWN7]

Or it could be a GFI in your panel. It may look like it's not popped but physically check the breakers.

[GH85Carrera]

We have a plug that is outside on our back porch. It was installed buy the builder when the house was built. It is controlled by a ground fault receptacle in the bathroom. It took me some time to find it the first time. Go look at every ground fault you have and see if one is tripped.

[masraum]

Another vote for GFCI somewhere.

Also, some breakers will flip, but not look flipped. But then you'd probably have other stuff that wasn't working if it was a breaker. So that really points back at a GFCI somewhere.

[Drdogface]

Not a GFI and I checked the other GFI's in the kitchen which is closest room off the deck...That was my first thought too. Checked all the breakers in all three boxes...yes we have three ! I will check all those again and GFI's too.

Thanks for the help...I'll get back once I test all these again...

[Drdogface]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

We have a plug that is outside on our back porch. It was installed buy the builder when the house was built. It is controlled by a ground fault receptacle in the bathroom. It took me some time to find it the first time. Go look at every ground fault you have and see if one is tripped.

Bingo...the GFI in the Master Bath all the way across the house is connected to the one on the deck off the kitchen... Wow...

Many thanks...now I can stop chasing my tail over this...

[stomachmonkey]

I've got some outside lights protected by a GFI in the garage.

Took me forever to find it because they are no where near each other.

Check everywhere.

[krichard]

The GFI on our backyard deck is connected to the GFI in my garage for some reason, which is the furthest away from it. Don't assume it will be one the closest GFI circuit.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by Drdogface

Bingo...the GFI in the Master Bath all the way across the house is connected to the one on the deck off the kitchen... Wow...

Many thanks...now I can stop chasing my tail over this...

Wow, we must have the same home builder

[dyount]

WOW! To find a GFI that runs to either a kitchen or bathroom is a way no way in the elec code. Bathrooms are 1 /20 am circuit that is GFI, Kitchens are 2/20 am circuits GFI and NEITHER can serve anything else. Think of the overload of hairdryer in the bath while someone is using a electric mower etc outside.
I'd call the builder with a "get your azz over here" tone and fix this free. Nothing stops a sparky from wiring and exterior set of GFI's off a basement (not laundry btw, that's separate). I prefer basement as one circuit/laundry as another/exterior as one circuit/garage as another. You've got a typical 200 amp panel you've got ton to spare in that you aren't running everything at one time.
When I do the rare single family home inspection I trip the exteriors first, then find where they go. Then kitchen, then bath, then arc fault the bedrooms etc. ALways making sure the required separate circuits are in fact separate.
Part of it is that a homeowner shouldn't need to run down the block and look under the deck to find a trip point on a GFI.

[Evans, Marv]

Also try to figure out what made it trip, especially if it does it again. Sometimes they also need to be replaced.

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Wow, we must have the same home builder

The house I'm in has all the bathrooms, two upstairs, one downstairs all tied to one GFI. Damn thing is like 14 years old and kept tripping. Replaced it and now all are good.

[Drdogface]

Originally Posted by dyount

WOW! To find a GFI that runs to either a kitchen or bathroom is a way no way in the elec code. Bathrooms are 1 /20 am circuit that is GFI, Kitchens are 2/20 am circuits GFI and NEITHER can serve anything else. Think of the overload of hairdryer in the bath while someone is using a electric mower etc outside.
I'd call the builder with a "get your azz over here" tone and fix this free. Nothing stops a sparky from wiring and exterior set of GFI's off a basement (not laundry btw, that's separate). I prefer basement as one circuit/laundry as another/exterior as one circuit/garage as another. You've got a typical 200 amp panel you've got ton to spare in that you aren't running everything at one time.
When I do the rare single family home inspection I trip the exteriors first, then find where they go. Then kitchen, then bath, then arc fault the bedrooms etc. ALways making sure the required separate circuits are in fact separate.
Part of it is that a homeowner shouldn't need to run down the block and look under the deck to find a trip point on a GFI.

Thanks for all that...really. In my case the builder is long gone.. What made the bath room GFI trip was that a hot wire came loose somehow...all I did was replace it. That was what caused the deck plug to go off. I never thought it could be the bath GFI so far away...but it was...

Stranger tales than mine have been told here...

[dad911]

Originally Posted by dyount

WOW! To find a GFI that runs to either a kitchen or bathroom is a way no way in the elec code. . . . . . .

I don't believe that is correct, depending on the year house was built.

[look 171]

You guys are not going to like what you are about to read. I am asking you to break the law. Change the GFI outlets and put in normal outlets in there. Remember how little protection the regular outlets were around the sinks or wet locations when we were little? How many of you were shocked when you had to plug an appliance into the outlets on the kitchen counter or use the hairdryer? They are overly sensitive and now need to be temper proof. An even bigger pain in the ass. I took them out at my folks place, so I don't have to go and replace them every ten years. All my exterior GFCI plugs have been pulled. Hell, they are covered from the rain so what do I care? I would never do that to my client's home. My own home, you bet your ass. Then, there's the insurance aspect you had to deal with. Common sense is again out the window. Is it safer? Of course. It is necessary? I am not entirely sure anymore?

[look 171]

Originally Posted by dad911

I don't believe that is correct, depending on the year house was built.

People tend to apply modern code to homes built 50 years ago. A young couple (old client's kids) were really concern after reading their inspection report on their new home, built in the 80s. The inspection report pointed out the illegal recess lighting in the kitchen. They were not bi-pin CFLs but halogens. They run hotter. Back then, they were absolutely legal and CA Title 24 did not exist. I question why they do stuff like that to scare off people?

[rusnak]

Bring the wife's hair dryer to her, tapping the end of it in your opposite palm and inform her that you have good news and bad news. The good news is that the little tree will live. The bad news is that she will have to do her hair in the kitchen.

[dyount]

Remove GFCI's ... seriously don't. The nuisance tripping that may have happened with devices made in the late 80's are no longer. Seriously they've become very reliable. The new Arc-fault breakers... are better but not perfect as of yet.
As far as when certain circuits became required if I were to guess would be probably mid 90's. No matter when it was built you should have at worst a bath combined with a lighting load and kitchen possibly on one circuit.
The reason for all of these multi circuits are: Kitchens now have how many portable appliances? tons. And why a separate for bathroom only? cause most builders extend that single circuit through all the baths in a house. When I was a kid it was one bath and we all stood in the hallway waiting our turn. Now? 2 or 3 baths running on 1 circuit with mom and daughter running curling things and dryers at the same time.
No idea of how to get that circuit off the bath circuit at this point but at least you do know where it comes from.