Tough decision to make P car is worth a fortune..

[fastfredracing]

I just sold off one of my early turbo cars. It brought about 30% more than I expected.
So , now I am faced with the realization that I could sell my other turbo car and pay off the note on my commercial building . My home is almost paid off, and this would really set me up good way sooner than I ever could have hoped for.
However, this is pretty much the car I have been dreaming about for 30 years or more of my young life. Planned on passing it down to my son. But..... I have always known that the key to me checking out of the workforce early, was paying off my loans, and getting my rental houses up to snuff.
With one swift move, I could put myself in a position to be on easy strreet 15 years sooner.
I'm sure a few guys with longhoods went through this when they bubbled.
Suddenly , your 15k little toy is worth 150k, and driving it no longer becomes fun, constantly worried about wrecking it, getting stolen, etc..
What do you guys think? I would also have a busload of equity if I wanted to branch out and maybe make some bigger moves in the real estate world. Mustang Paul's words are starting to make a little more sense to me now.
Thoughts?

[Porsche-O-Phile]

If you have to ask...

As you point out (correctly) all it takes is one idiot yammering on a cell phone to turn your "investment" into worthless scrap metal. And don't think you'll get an ins. co. to make you whole. We both know they won't - you'll be fighting with them forever about the value, they'll stonewall you, etc. I'm with you. I like good driver's cars. I almost hate taking the 911 out because after all the work and expense I've got in it, I'm paranoid about having it run into, having a pothole rip off the bottom of the engine case, whatever. It's almost (almost) unenjoyable to drive as a result. Almost. I'd be a wreck if I had a $250k F-car or something truly collectable.

My take is do the smart thing. Sell the car, pay off the building, get something you can enjoy and thrash around in a bit. Enjoy life. It's too short to be constantly worrying about money and bills needing to get paid. Life free, liberate yourself and be happy. My $0.02. That's my goal. If I have a few less toys IMHO it's worth it to be rid of the associated stress.

[cockerpunk]

its money, you make more of it.

a car, a car that is a part of you, isn't worth money anymore.

[john walker's workshop]

you'll get taxed on the profit, too. you'll never be able to afford another.

[fastfredracing]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

its money, you make more of it.

a car, a car that is a part of you, isn't worth money anymore.

The problem is that I am a 44 year old self employed auto mechanic. I have beat the bloody hell out of myself, and I am just now starting to feel it. I thought I would never get old, but there is no way I can see myself going at this pace in 10 more years, 20 more years......
And JW, I know , it kills me to think about them taxing the hell out of me, but it is what it is. I still have my first 911, and a few other p car projects to play with . I do agree. I will probably never own another turbo car if I sell this one . They are already out of my reach, and seems like they are heading into longhood territory.
But...... 44 years old, house paid off, commercial property near busy highway in growing area paid off, rental houses paid off, and zero debt has a real nice ring to it does it not?

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by fastfredracing

The problem is that I am a 44 year old self employed auto mechanic. I have beat the bloody hell out of myself, and I am just now starting to feel it. I thought I would never get old, but there is no way I can see myself going at this pace in 10 more years, 20 more years......
And JW, I know , it kills me to think about them taxing the hell out of me , but I still have my first 911, and a few other p car projects to play with . I do agree. I will probably never own another turbo car if I sell this one . They are already out of my reach, and seems like they are heading into longhood territory.
But...... 44 years old, house paid off, commercial property near busy highway in growing area paid off, rental houses paid off, and zero debt has a real nice ring to it does it not?

if we all lived smart financial lives, we wouldnt be on a forum for classic and aging porsches.

i mean its obvious thats the smart financial move, and if thats what you want to do, don't let me argue you out of it. but dreams and passions are worth investing in too. how much money will that moment be when you give that pristine turbo to your son? can you even put a price tag on that? how much money is it worth when you drive it? how much money is it worth to you the life experiences you have, and will have with that car? how would you feel when you sold it to someone who didn't appreciate it and treated it like ****?

idk, money is money. but dreams and experiences are priceless.

i for example can afford a much nicer porsche than the one i own. but i keep the one i have, because i have spent so much time and life experience with this car. i could never sell it. i might buy another, but i could never sell this one. i am nearing 40 of the 50 states driven through with this car, and i plan to do all 48 at some point. i can't sell that car to someone else. that would be ridiculous.

[ckelly78z]

It appears from the cars still listed in your sig, that even without the 930s, you have some interesting vehicles to drive. I would go for it and pay down everthing as much as possible to make life a bit easier. I am in the opposite position of you, I have no car payments, a paid off mortgage, a really nice balence in my 401K, and a 28 year pension when I retire, so there is no way i'm going to invest in an exotic car right now.

[Rot 911]

If it was me I'd sell and pay off the building. Being debt free brings a special satisfaction, and in your case, will also lower your stress level.

[Eric 951]

Fred,

I would vote sell and pay off the note.

With the increasing value of your P-car would you really enjoy driving it around here without worry (I'm looking at you Parkway, 51 and 28), plus the potholes, Penndot and the idiot drivers in general?

You mentioned you have other "fun" cars to use and enjoy if you do sell.

[gacook]

Sell it.

Unless you've got so much money that this car is simply a collectible that you never plan to drive, or driving it and having some douche wreck it wouldn't bother you, what's the point of hanging on to it? Even if you give it to your son at some point, is he going to drive it?

Sometimes, it's better to do the fiscally wise thing than the emotional thing.

[Arizona_928]

Do what you have to do. No one can make up your mind for you.

[greglepore]

Fred-once its value reaches the point that you need to worry about it, sell it. Take part of the profit and build/buy (preferably the latter) a very cool RS or turbo replica that is worth a fraction but provides all of the fun if you feel the need to have a wild aircooled car in the stable, or buy a 996 Turbo if you don't.

I doubt the car is at the top of its curve, but we all know how these things go, they're generational, so there is a window, and its opening now.

[Rusty914s]

Sell it, why is it even a question? 15 years sooner, I'd sale it in a heartbeat.

Buy a 2002 or an old Alfa and kick that around for a few years.

[biosurfer1]

according to the "smart" financial people, I shouldn't pay off my mortgage early since my interest rate is only 3.25% fixed. Fact is, having no mortgage is worth so much more to me than the possible extra bit I might get by investing the extra principal someplace else.

I cannot WAIT until the day that some service company doesn't take a dime out of my account the 1st of every month!

[fastfredracing]

Im going to tell you a guys a little story. I watched my dad make the wrong choice. He bought brand new in 1970 an ss 396 chevelle, drove it for two years then warehoused it. Collected another few cool cars along the way. He always made good money but later in life, around the mid to late 80's, work started to dry up, and he began to have financial problems. When the first big muscle car boom happened, I watched him turn down enough money for his chevelle, and gto, to pay off the family house, and get out of debt. My mom, my sister and I were all extremely pissed. We said " they are only cars that you never drive". What is more important. He landed another good job, and got back on his feet for a few years, then, had a heart attack, and lost everything. the house, the cars, all the money, gone...... My mom and Dad were living in my Grandmothers basement in their mid to late 50's , with no money, and zero credit. I never want to make that mistake.

[Hugh R]

Originally Posted by john walker's workshop

you'll get taxed on the profit, too. you'll never be able to afford another.

Talk to an accountant before you sell it, not after, there are ways to put it in a recovable trust where you won't pay capital gains.

I sold my DB4 for a boat load of money a few years ago, I miss it, but then again, it was getting where I had to have things like pistons and valves made for it. It it broke a crankshaft, it would have been $20K for a bent used one. The value was it was a matching numbers car. I drove it for years as a DD, then it sat and I only drove it because it needed to be driven.

[dave 911]

with that last story, I'd sell it also...you still have an SC to have fun in (based on your sig), correct?

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by fastfredracing

However, this is pretty much the car I have been dreaming about for 30 years or more

That's the problem. It is more valuable to you than it is to anyone else, but is it's value in the idea of owning it or in the fun of driving it?
I wanted a Speedster since I was old enough to distinguish between a VW bug and a Chevy station wagon. I got one 40 years ago, still have it, had a great time autocrossing it and driving the snot out of it. But now it is too valuable to relax and drive and enjoy. When I stand back and look at the situation, I have more fun driving my 911 because it's replaceable and I'm not all that attached to it.
It's a matter of visceral enjoyment vs emotional appeal. You could enjoy a heck of a fun car AND meet most of your economic goals, or you can go out to the garage and look at the car you've been dreaming about for 30 years.
I'm in the fortunate position of being able to afford both, but if I had to sell one, it may be the Speedster.

[varmint]

Originally Posted by fastfredracing

Im going to tell you a guys a little story. I watched my dad make the wrong choice. He bought brand new in 1970 an ss 396 chevelle, drove it for two years then warehoused it. Collected another few cool cars along the way. He always made good money but later in life, around the mid to late 80's, work started to dry up, and he began to have financial problems. When the first big muscle car boom happened, I watched him turn down enough money for his chevelle, and gto, to pay off the family house, and get out of debt. My mom, my sister and I were all extremely pissed. We said " they are only cars that you never drive". What is more important. He landed another good job, and got back on his feet for a few years, then, had a heart attack, and lost everything. the house, the cars, all the money, gone...... My mom and Dad were living in my Grandmothers basement in their mid to late 50's , with no money, and zero credit. I never want to make that mistake.

sounds like you've already got all the practical advice you need.


i sold off a motorcycle, guns, first editions, etc when buying my house. i love toys but being out of debt is indescribable joy. now i can pay cash for new toys every so often.

[targa911S]

Originally Posted by Eric 951

Fred,

I would vote sell and pay off the note.

With the increasing value of your P-car would you really enjoy driving it around here without worry (I'm looking at you Parkway, 51 and 28), plus the potholes, Penndot and the idiot drivers in general?

You mentioned you have other "fun" cars to use and enjoy if you do sell.

what Eric says. I sold my 70 S Targa 4 years ago and although I miss it, I paid off my home and every debt I had, plus put money in the bank. Not having any bills other than day to day operating expenses is a great feeling. If the Sh** goes south you own your home, nobody can take that away from you. There will always be cool cars.